tsth Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 9, 2005 Hi again Suzanne and y'all, Re: the white robe question........earlier on the post it was referenced that white robes were given to the martyrs........which is true.......and suggested that we should be willing to die for the Lord.......which I cannot disagree...... But there might be more to the white robes........ When Jesus spoke to the Church of Sardis He said Rev 3: 4. " You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5. He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments., and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life....." From what I understand about Sardis, they weren't suffering persecution (or martyrdom) as in some Churches......or wasn't particularly a hotbed of pagan influence. Sardis sounds like a Church that lost steam......and became indifferent or apathetic. (Jesus called them dead) I'm under the impression they became "carnal Christians", shall we say in polite terms. Again it has a ring of familiarity in todays world. Although it reads like Laodacea was much farther gone than Sardis, it may only be a call to the Laodaceans to be "overcomers" and repent ..... to be given the White Robe of the Lord.............. God Bless You.......dotcom <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hi dotcom, Interestingly enough, this evening I came across this passage (in NIV)? Rev. 22:14 Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they will have the right to the tree of life and may enter the city by the gates. I can't for the life of me figure out where they came up with that translation? In the KJV, here's how it reads: 14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. I would be curious to know how it translated to the "robe" meaning? Anybody have a way to find out??? Also, we can very clearly see the distinction between those who washed their robes, and those who did not, and WILL NOT be entering, even if they profess Christ as Lord. Rev. 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. 16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. 17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dotcom Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 31 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/06/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted January 9, 2005 Hi Suzanne, I could not find commentary on the translation differences of "do His commandments", and "wash their robes".....sorry....(....NAB translation is "wash their robes") The best link my mind can make....to be obedient to the will of the Lord, is to be washed clean by the blood the Lord shed for our sins........ I read some applicable Scripture in Daniel. It was at the "time of great trouble" (end times)..."where many will run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase". The Lord told Daniel that the prophecy would be closed up and sealed until the end. Daniel did not understand it, and was told to go his way........The Lord said: Dan: 12: 10 "Many shall be PURIFIED, and MADE WHITE, and TRIED; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand." (Also, there are a couple of images of Jesus wearing linen in this chapter.) I don't want to over-simplify, but in putting these different passages together, it seems that if a person remains "thirsty" for the Lord amid the pressure and trials of wicked things, they will be purified in His truth and wisdom, and allowed to enter in the presence of the Lord. "Thirst" is such a basic human element we can understand........I picture my mouth dry, on a hot day....(not a milkshake for dessert in this case!!) The empahasis you underlined in 22:16...in the churches....brings us back to Revelation chapters 1 through 3....the testimony of the Lord to the churches. He didn't want His Word corrupted, or watered down....(forgive the pun!) Paying lipservice of professing to be Christian is contrasted with the Lord ruling and transforming the heart .......Amen dotcom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 9, 2005 thank you dotcom for taking a look into it. i appreciate your milkshake comment too! In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsmeow Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 439 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 7,315 Content Per Day: 0.93 Reputation: 356 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/21/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 9, 2005 I'm not wanting to detract from the topic but I wonder just how much Ephesian 6 (firey darts from the enemy/attack on our thought life) has to do with all of this.. I often feel the the underlying "poison" infecting us isn't merely doctrinal distinctions, but the incessant attacks brethren make on each other. Jesus stressed "blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the 'sons of God'" The world will know us by our love for one another. Naturally, Satan will bait us against each other. Then he'll send in his "own" to bait debates and create friction and confusion. We need love, unity AND truth...but realizing that there will be Methodists, Catholics, Baptists, Nazarenes, Presbyterians, et al... THERE WILL BE DIFFERENCES yet there is only ONE BODY of Christ and only ONE CHURCH.....and in order to be SPOTLESS AND BLAMELESS, a Bride ready for her Husband, we must be in unity in love and righteousness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dotcom Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 31 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/06/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted January 9, 2005 Hi Cats, I've heard that called...."majoring in the minor"........one shouldn't have overblown disputes over minor issues......but should be discerning what the major issues are......... Thanks for your offer of more food for thought..........those dividing methods,...fiery darts of confusion.............. God Bless You dotcom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 9, 2005 I'm not wanting to detract from the topic but I wonder just how much Ephesian 6 (firey darts from the enemy/attack on our thought life) has to do with all of this.. I often feel the the underlying "poison" infecting us isn't merely doctrinal distinctions, but the incessant attacks brethren make on each other. Jesus stressed "blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the 'sons of God'" The world will know us by our love for one another. Naturally, Satan will bait us against each other. Then he'll send in his "own" to bait debates and create friction and confusion. We need love, unity AND truth...but realizing that there will be Methodists, Catholics, Baptists, Nazarenes, Presbyterians, et al... THERE WILL BE DIFFERENCES yet there is only ONE BODY of Christ and only ONE CHURCH.....and in order to be SPOTLESS AND BLAMELESS, a Bride ready for her Husband, we must be in unity in love and righteousness. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dear Cats, I'm not sure I see the issue you're speaking of? The only portion I see where there are problems within the church, are the blatant places that the Spirit of the Lord, warns against in the passages I posted above, specifically Rev. 22:14---, in which there are NO doctrinal differences, but only very clear falsehoods "within" the church, that we should be able to discern. Sorry, if I've just misunderstood your point, but I didn't see where that was an issue within this topic. It was more about looking at ourselves and our own standings before the Lord, rather than others and denoms. we must be in unity in love and righteousness. I agree, but sometimes that "love and unity" will begin with the conflict of the Truth spoken to a brother, and that can bring some discord too, but that doesn't mean that it's not right. It's hard to walk in "peace" when you stand on the Truth, people just get riled sometimes. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Timer Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Soapbox - Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 962 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 52 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/18/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/11/1932 Share Posted January 9, 2005 I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsmeow Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 439 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 7,315 Content Per Day: 0.93 Reputation: 356 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/21/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 9, 2005 I think there has to be a balance. Jesus speaks in Matthew 24 about many betraying and hating one another in the last days. I guess I've tended to see these as the "last days"....and see how tension within the Church and between brethren is the very core of the problem. For example, Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13 that regardless of how much knowledge or faith we have, it pales in comparison to our love for one another. No matter what we say or do, God is looking intently into the motives of our heart. I, too believe in following His voice and walking in the Spirit and not compromising with the world ... but want to acknowledge that none of us are the fount of all wisdom, as one can NEVER find two preachers or individuals who quite see all scripture through the same eyes. I often worry with the balance of legalism verses apostate rebellion, mixed with the attacks from the unseen adversary, who creates division among us. I ultimately hope that the love Christ spoke of OFTEN and emphatically will be the binding glue that will keep our feet on level ground, our hearts on the straight path and our minds clear and focused. Sorry, Suzanne...I may have trailed off on this. I'm thinking out loud. Forgive me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsmeow Posted January 9, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 439 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 7,315 Content Per Day: 0.93 Reputation: 356 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/21/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 9, 2005 I agree, but sometimes that "love and unity" will begin with the conflict of the Truth spoken to a brother, and that can bring some discord too, but that doesn't mean that it's not right. It's hard to walk in "peace" when you stand on the Truth, people just get riled sometimes. In His Love, Suzanne <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep. I agree. I dearly love River, who I haven't seen here for awhile but we continually disputed over his "liberal" views towards sexual behavior and my extreme opposite views of the matter. Likewise with another former poster who continually argued for Nudist Camps for Christians...and you can imagine how the "fur would fly" between us. I get militant in matters such as these. So, yes...I think I'm on the same page here but I do also leave the door open for anyone, regardless of where they're at, to come in and dine....the penitent with Christ and vise versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botz Posted January 10, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 76 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,492 Content Per Day: 0.61 Reputation: 191 Days Won: 18 Joined: 03/29/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2005 Hi Old Timer. You wrote... I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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