Is there a universal moral law?

[Schouwenaars]

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

minus the last sentence wich is don't fully undestand, you just perfectly formulated my thoughts thank you. i couldn't describe it better myself.

but don't think this is something is just came up with. i have thought many months about this subject. i have really really thought it trough, also in discussions with others.

Edited June 11, 2014 by Schouwenaars

[LuftWaffle]

 

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

minus the last sentence wich is don't fully undestand, you just perfectly formulated my thoughts thank you. i couldn't describe it better myself.

but don't think this is something is just came up with. i have thought many months about this subject. i have really really thought it trough, also in discussions with others.

 

 

I actually addressed the question to jerryR34, but you're welcome to answer.

 

Since both you and him do not believe that there really is such a thing as right and wrong, it would mean that both of you believe that right and wrong are evolutionary illusions, not so? A trick to help us survive...

 

So while it looks as if certain actions are wrong, they aren't really wrong. And while it looks like certain actions are virtuous they aren't really virtuous. So is it better to act as if morality is real and embrace the

illusion, or is it better to embrace the truth and live as if there is no right or wrong in anything you do?

[jerryR34]

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

 

The vast majority of humans are not subject to natural selection anymore.  Traits that would have died out in our more primitive times can be passed down now. 

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?  Anthropomorphizing things leads to wrong conclusions.

[jerryR34]

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

Morals have nothing to do with evolution.

 

All of our behaviors have to do with evolution.

[Guest]

....All of our behaviors have to do with evolution....

 

~

 

One Lie

 

Yea, hath God said, Genesis 3:1(c )

 

After Another

 

How foolish can you be? He is the Potter, and he is certainly greater than you, the clay! Should the created thing say of the one who made it, "He didn't make me"? Does a jar ever say, "The potter who made me is stupid"? Isaiah 29:16 (NLT)

 

Does Not The Truth

 

But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

 

For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 1 Corinthians 15:20-21

 

Make

 

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 1 Corinthians 15:22

[LuftWaffle]

 

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

 

 

The vast majority of humans are not subject to natural selection anymore.  Traits that would have died out in our more primitive times can be passed down now. 

 

 

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?  Anthropomorphizing things leads to wrong conclusions.

 

 

A mirage is also and yet it can be said with a perfectly straight face that many a wanderer was tricked into thinking it's water...

I think most people would get my drift.

 

But you haven't really responded to my question. Do you embrace the truth that there is no right or wrong and live accordingly, or do you embrace the illusion and live as if right and wrong does exists, even though it doesn't?

[jerryR34]

 

 

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

 

 

The vast majority of humans are not subject to natural selection anymore.  Traits that would have died out in our more primitive times can be passed down now. 

 

 

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?  Anthropomorphizing things leads to wrong conclusions.

 

 

A mirage is also and yet it can be said with a perfectly straight face that many a wanderer was tricked into thinking it's water...

 

But you haven't really responded to my question. Do you embrace the truth that there is no right or wrong and live accordingly, or do you embrace the illusion and live as if right and wrong does exists, even though it doesn't?

 

No, there is right and wrong.  It's based on empathy that has been derived from evolution.

[Guest]

Faith

 

So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17

 

And The Dance Of Death

 

Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. Hebrews 3:12

 

~

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?

 

~

 

The Devil

 

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: Romans 5:12

 

Is In The Details

 

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Romans 6:23

 

Can You Hear Him Now

 

Yea, hath God said, Genesis 3:1(c )

[LuftWaffle]

 

 

 

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

 

 

The vast majority of humans are not subject to natural selection anymore.  Traits that would have died out in our more primitive times can be passed down now. 

 

 

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?  Anthropomorphizing things leads to wrong conclusions.

 

 

A mirage is also and yet it can be said with a perfectly straight face that many a wanderer was tricked into thinking it's water...

 

But you haven't really responded to my question. Do you embrace the truth that there is no right or wrong and live accordingly, or do you embrace the illusion and live as if right and wrong does exists, even though it doesn't?

 

No, there is right and wrong.  It's based on empathy that has been derived from evolution.

 

 

That's interesting. How is empathy derived from a physical process?

[jerryR34]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i think that any law we make, how objective we think it might be, it will always stay subjective.

because what we think is good is typical for humans, for the continuing of our species.

it has been in our mind for tousands of years in order to survive.

our good and wrong is totally based on survival instinct.

check it yourself: everything you think is good, will help to let our species grow.

everything you think is wrong, will let our species disappear or will hurt our own species.

 

@ luftwaffle: Schouwenaars is just a random familyname here in flanders. nothing special

That makes no sense. 

 

Good and wrong based on survival instinct?  Where do you get that from?  Survival has nothing to do with what is good or evil.

 

Our morals evolved due to the fact we are a social species.  Traits that helped us pass on our genes were passed on.  You can see the same types of "moral" behaviors in our closest ape ancestors even though they can't read.

 

 

Suppose a person has a genetic condition which makes him anti-social. Since he is then an anti-social being, it would be morally normal for him to behave in anti-social ways, correct?

 

Are you saying that right and wrong are just illusions based on our evolution? That there isn't really right and wrong, but that our evolution tricked us into thinking there are such things as right and wrong so that we can better pass on our genes. Do you think holding illusions as truth is something that needs to be avoided?

 

 

 

The vast majority of humans are not subject to natural selection anymore.  Traits that would have died out in our more primitive times can be passed down now. 

 

 

 

Evolution is a process...how can you even say it "tricked us" with a straight face?  Anthropomorphizing things leads to wrong conclusions.

 

 

A mirage is also and yet it can be said with a perfectly straight face that many a wanderer was tricked into thinking it's water...

 

But you haven't really responded to my question. Do you embrace the truth that there is no right or wrong and live accordingly, or do you embrace the illusion and live as if right and wrong does exists, even though it doesn't?

 

No, there is right and wrong.  It's based on empathy that has been derived from evolution.

 

 

That's interesting. How is empathy derived from a physical process?

 

If you had any understanding of evolution (whether you believe it's the answer or not), you would not be asking that question.