justfaith Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 Do you wish to gain the promises of the covenants or the new Ephesians 2:12-13King James Version (KJV) 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. I choose the New Covenant brought by Jesus. Scripture says it is the better covenant. I was under the Mosaic covenant and now I am under the New Covenant, and I know which is the better covenant. How about you? Which covenant do you choose? I chose the covenants of promise, which includes the new What are the laws of the new that are being spoken about ? The covenant of promise if the New Covenant. Not covenants. There is only one New Covenant which promises eternal salvation brought by Jesus. So, I think you are confused about the various covenants given by God. If you are a Gentile, you are either under the Noachide covenant, or the New Covenant. For food laws, in the New Covenant, that would fall under the two general heading of loving God and loving your neighbor. So, we are back to the original scriptures that I posted. Peter had a vision and told to eat of what was unclean food so that he could be sent to the house of Gentiles and share the gospel and stay and eat with them. Later, we are told of our freedom to eat, but not at the cost of causing a brother to stumble, so food offered to idols (non-kosher) is permissable unless it causes a brother to stumble. That is New Covenant law. People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden. The part of the texts usually quoted is, "And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. - Acts 10:13-15". This all happened about 41 A.D., and about eight years after Jesus had gone to heaven. Peter had been with Jesus during His ministry to the House of Israel and had been preaching the gospel at least seven years, and had never eaten any thing unclean. If Jesus had died to make the unclean animals, fowls, creeping things, and things of the waters, clean, Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, The vision was about the gentiles thus the animals represented such Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qnts2 Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 20 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,875 Content Per Day: 0.70 Reputation: 1,336 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/13/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted August 28, 2014 I chose the covenants of promise, which includes the new What are the laws of the new that are being spoken about ? The covenant of promise if the New Covenant. Not covenants. There is only one New Covenant which promises eternal salvation brought by Jesus. So, I think you are confused about the various covenants given by God. If you are a Gentile, you are either under the Noachide covenant, or the New Covenant. For food laws, in the New Covenant, that would fall under the two general heading of loving God and loving your neighbor. So, we are back to the original scriptures that I posted. Peter had a vision and told to eat of what was unclean food so that he could be sent to the house of Gentiles and share the gospel and stay and eat with them. Later, we are told of our freedom to eat, but not at the cost of causing a brother to stumble, so food offered to idols (non-kosher) is permissable unless it causes a brother to stumble. That is New Covenant law. People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden. The part of the texts usually quoted is, "And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. - Acts 10:13-15". This all happened about 41 A.D., and about eight years after Jesus had gone to heaven. Peter had been with Jesus during His ministry to the House of Israel and had been preaching the gospel at least seven years, and had never eaten any thing unclean. If Jesus had died to make the unclean animals, fowls, creeping things, and things of the waters, clean, Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, The vision was about the gentiles thus the animals represented such I know that those who try to justify Gentile believers keeping kosher say that the vision was only about Gentiles. but neglect scripture, cherry picking what they want. Acts 11:2 And when Peter came up to Jerusalem, those who were circumcised took issue with him, 3 saying, “You went to uncircumcised men and ate with them.” The vision showed unclean things and God said to take and eat. Peter went to the home of Gentiles (uncircumcised men) and he ate with them. Peter ate non-kosher food. That is why the vision spoke of food and Gentiles. Now, when I first accepted Jesus, I was till living in the Jewish community. I continued to eat kosher food for another 2 years. It was not until I went to a church, and was invited to the home of a Gentile for lunch, that I ate my first non-kosher food. Up until the time of Peter going to Cornelius, he lived in Jerusalem and shared the gospel with Jewish people. Peter would have eaten kosher food. When I invite Orthodox Jews to my home, I serve Kosher food. When I go to a Gentiles house, I eat non-kosher food. That is what Acts 10 and 11 teaches us that Peter did. By the way, Jesus didn't die to make animals clean. Jesus died to make people clean. Clean vs. unclean food is Mosaic law. Clean vs unclean food is not a New Covenant law. Romans 14:19 So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another. 20 Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden If you think you are saved because you don't eat certain animals for food, you are not a follower of Jesus. Followers of Jesus are those who trust in Jesus for salvation and in Him alone. You are following the law and the law will not save you. Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, There is no repeal and why would there need to be? Gentile believers are not required anywhere in the Bible to obey the OT dietary laws. If you want to obey them, are free to, but do come here teaching that all men are required to keep them in order to get saved or stay saved. That would be a false gospel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden If you think you are saved because you don't eat certain animals for food, you are not a follower of Jesus. Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, There is no repeal and why would there need to be? Gentile believers are not required anywhere in the Bible to obey the OT dietary laws. If you want to obey them, are free to, but do come here teaching that all men are required to keep them in order to get saved or stay saved. That would be a false gospel. The dietry laws are from genesis not leviticus or deuteronomy that is what you dont understand When was thou shall not kill first mention was it in Genesis or exodus ? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden If you think you are saved because you don't eat certain animals for food, you are not a follower of Jesus. Followers of Jesus are those who trust in Jesus for salvation and in Him alone. You are following the law and the law will not save you. Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, There is no repeal and why would there need to be? Gentile believers are not required anywhere in the Bible to obey the OT dietary laws. If you want to obey them, are free to, but do come here teaching that all men are required to keep them in order to get saved or stay saved. That would be a false gospel. What does this mean ? "Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you," - 2 Corinthians 6:17, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justfaith Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 309 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 70 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/18/2014 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 28, 2014 Do you wish to gain the promises of the covenants or the new Ephesians 2:12-13King James Version (KJV) 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. I choose the New Covenant brought by Jesus. Scripture says it is the better covenant. I was under the Mosaic covenant and now I am under the New Covenant, and I know which is the better covenant. How about you? Which covenant do you choose? I chose the covenants of promise, which includes the new What are the laws of the new that are being spoken about ? The covenant of promise if the New Covenant. Not covenants. There is only one New Covenant which promises eternal salvation brought by Jesus. So, I think you are confused about the various covenants given by God. If you are a Gentile, you are either under the Noachide covenant, or the New Covenant. For food laws, in the New Covenant, that would fall under the two general heading of loving God and loving your neighbor. So, we are back to the original scriptures that I posted. Peter had a vision and told to eat of what was unclean food so that he could be sent to the house of Gentiles and share the gospel and stay and eat with them. Later, we are told of our freedom to eat, but not at the cost of causing a brother to stumble, so food offered to idols (non-kosher) is permissable unless it causes a brother to stumble. That is New Covenant law. 1 Timothy 4th Chapter In the last days there were to be seducing spirits. They were to command to abstain from meats that God created to be received with thanksgiving, or in other words they were to be vegetarians, and were to forbid to marry. "For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. - 1 Timothy 4:4-5" We have many vegetarians in the world who command their followers to abstain from all meats. As the word sanctify means to set apart, there must be two classes of creatures in the world. There was a sign of sanctification before the flood or Noah would not have known the clean from the unclean, in taking the beasts into the ark. Therefore, they were (sanctified) set apart, some clean and some unclean before that time. If all were cleansed by the blood of Christ, there would be only one class in the world and no unclean for the clean to be set apart from. If all the people in the world were righteous alike, they could not be sanctified because there would be no wicked or sinners for the righteous to be set apart from; so it remains that there were animals created to be received with thanksgiving, and some not to be received with thanksgiving as a food, and some sanctified by the Word of God, and some not sanctified for food. Are you sanctified ? by what means ? and How thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezekiel Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Seeker Followers: 2 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 315 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 60 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/25/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/31/1959 Share Posted August 28, 2014 Food for the flesh is just that food for the flesh and food for the Spirit every word that comes from the mouth of God. Food has never save any one for what will they say I have eaten a good herb now I will go to heaven. But the Word even Christ thru him heaven waits for us. Ezekiel 20 25 Wherefore I gave them also statutes that were not good, and judgments whereby they should not live; Just thinking what was on them first two tablets Moses came down with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted August 28, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted August 28, 2014 The dietry laws are from genesis not leviticus or deuteronomy that is what you dont understand When was thou shall not kill first mention was it in Genesis or exodus ? thanks dietary laws given to Moses: and yes it was in Genesis... Gen 9:1-5 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth. 2 And the fear of you and the terror of you shall be on every beast of the earth and on every bird of the sky; with everything that creeps on the ground, and all the fish of the sea, into your hand they are given. 3 Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant. 4 Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. 5 And surely I will require your lifeblood; from every beast I will require it. And from every man, from every man's brother I will require the life of man. NASB What God gave to Noah for instructions is a Cajun dietary plan....... if it moves, eat it. But don't eat it alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden If you think you are saved because you don't eat certain animals for food, you are not a follower of Jesus. Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, There is no repeal and why would there need to be? Gentile believers are not required anywhere in the Bible to obey the OT dietary laws. If you want to obey them, are free to, but do come here teaching that all men are required to keep them in order to get saved or stay saved. That would be a false gospel. The dietry laws are from genesis not leviticus or deuteronomy that is what you dont understand When was thou shall not kill first mention was it in Genesis or exodus ? thanks No there are no dietary laws contained in Genesis. There were clean and unclean animals in Genesis but there were no set dietary laws given in Genesis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted August 29, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted August 29, 2014 Justfaith: The following are all your questions as they appear, sequentially, through your op. does the law of clean and unclean meats apply for Christians today why or why not ? When were they first given to Israel ? thanks Do you think it is alright for christians to smoke ? Why or Why not ? Would you eat blood ? taking into account what you said that not what goes into a man defiles a man thanks Would you eat things offered to idols ?thanks What verse in the new says we are not to practice this anymore ? Can believers eat blood in the old as well as in the new ? Would you eat blood ? He took seven clean so that it will have more food to eat and the unclean by two were less to clean the earth Do you think today it have more clean than unclean animals Why What does this verse means and when will it be fulfilled . "¶ For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire. For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many. They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, (or one after the other) eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory." - Isaiah 66:15-18 Do you wish to gain the promises of the covenants or the new Do you wish to gain the promises of the covenants or the new what are the promises to be inherited by the other covenants ? Do you want to obtain the promises as stated in Ep that the gentiles are to obtain by the blood of the lamb ? People who eat the things pronounced unclean in the Word of God in order to justify themselves like a drowning man grabbing for straw, are willing to risk their eternal welfare on the above point and go on eating the abominable things of God has forbidden. The part of the texts usually quoted is, "And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. - Acts 10:13-15". This all happened about 41 A.D., and about eight years after Jesus had gone to heaven. Peter had been with Jesus during His ministry to the House of Israel and had been preaching the gospel at least seven years, and had never eaten any thing unclean. If Jesus had died to make the unclean animals, fowls, creeping things, and things of the waters, clean, Peter should have known it; but the fact that he had never eaten anything unclean shows that he had no knowledge of the repeal of the law of the clean and the unclean. The sheet was let down three times. Three men of the Gentiles were there for him to go with them to the house of Cornelius. Peter went with them as God had bidden him, The vision was about the gentiles thus the animals represented such The dietry laws are from genesis not leviticus or deuteronomy that is what you dont understand When was thou shall not kill first mention was it in Genesis or exodus ? thanks What does this mean ? "Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you," - 2 Corinthians 6:17, If all the people in the world were righteous alike, they could not be sanctified because there would be no wicked or sinners for the righteous to be set apart from; so it remains that there were animals created to be received with thanksgiving, and some not to be received with thanksgiving as a food, and some sanctified by the Word of God, and some not sanctified for food. Are you sanctified ? by what means ? and How thanks I have not had the understanding that you are on some kind of quest for better understanding, but rather that your intentions are to change the understanding of anyone responding to your op Upon seeing your questions in the manner in which you wrote them, it it my opinion that you are trying to pull others into your own rather misguieded view of the covenants and the apparent belief that you have concerning how what a person eats, will santicfy them or condemn them. You truly do not understand the work of Christ on the cross nor do you understand the followingm, spoken by Christ Hmself: "It is not what enters into the mouth that defiles the man, but what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man." Matthew 15:11 I saw this at the beginning and over the space of a few days, you have brought to the surface what you actually believe I could eat blood today and still be a believer. I do not eat blood, but doing so would not cause me to loose my salvation. On the other hand, if had some belief that eating blood would in fact cause me to loose my salvation, and I ate it anyway, I would be sinning as this verse explains: So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. 23But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat, because their eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin. Romans 14...whole chapter applies to the op Acting apart from your relationship with God...that is without faith....is sin. Without faith it is impossible to please God...However, not faith in how we think we understand, but faith IN God. That's a big difference. Why? If we believe we are acting from faith, and yet we are wrong, we will still allow God to examine our heart and in so doing, He will lead us, FAITHFULLY, by His Holy Spirit out of our error. HOWEVER, if we, in the stubborness and pride of our hearts, disallow for correction and believe everyone else is wrong and we continue in our error, we will sink ever futher into deception. Therefore, keep a heart that is open before God and have a teachable spirit and understand that deception is possible for almost anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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