Running Gator Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.66 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 What is immodest? Do you think if I put up 10 pictures of women in varying amounts and types of clothing we could agree on which were immodest and which were not? I am sure we would all agree a woman (or a man) showing up church in a thong or a bikini is immodest. But after that it gets more iffy on if we would agree or not. Are shorts that do not go below the knee immodest? I know some people that think so, some people don't. Even the "painted on" clothing is really a matter of personal opinion. What I consider "painted on" differs from my wife and her view differs from our 20 something daughter's. Some would argue that anything that shows skin above the wrist is immodest. At what point does the responsibility fall on the male gender to control their thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kindle Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 53 Topic Count: 88 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 4,064 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,748 Days Won: 8 Joined: 02/23/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 2 hours ago, The_Patriot2017 said: Bet if I showed up to church in a thong no one would have any problem telling me what was up... I know your wife would catch you before you even left the house,lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Running Gator Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.66 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 1 hour ago, shiloh357 said: It is not about not being able to control one's mind. I did not sit there and lust after her. But it was distracting. And not only to me but to several other men who had complained that her attire was inappropriate. How many people have to complain before it is a problem? 1, 10, 20? If I complained about the woman in the right photo in the OP distracting me with her attire would it be up to her to change? Quote What it pertains to is dressing in a manner that honors God. When how a young woman in that position (which she was unqualified to be in) dresses detracts from the worship of the Lord, when she intentionally dresses that way, she is not dressing to honor God. She should have been removed from the praise team if she refused to dress and present herself appropriately. The same girl ended creating quite the scandal when it was discovered that she had some inappropriate "experiences" with some of the boys in the youth group and it ended up costing her father his ministry in that church, ultimately. You sure know an awful lot about a church your visited and left. That aside, those things happen to all sorts of girls. In the church we used to attend there was a girl that I taught in kids church and she was always the most modestly dressed around. She was always very careful to dress in what was seen as appropriate by the church body. Her older sister is my daughter's age and she was always getting in trouble for her clothing. The older one is now in her mid-20s' working and going to school and living a nice productive adult life. The younger one I just found out via facebook is pregnant, she is a senior in high school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 9 minutes ago, Running Gator said: How many people have to complain before it is a problem? 1, 10, 20? If I complained about the woman in the right photo in the OP distracting me with her attire would it be up to her to change? If a woman is dressing modestly and you have a lust problem, the problem is on you. You cannot apply to a situation where a woman is purposely dressing in an immodest and provocative manner. Quote You sure know an awful lot about a church your visited and left. I had friends that started attending there, who left about the same time I did, but they stayed in contact with some of the people who remained there. Quote That aside, those things happen to all sorts of girls. Having sexual liaisons with boys in church youth groups? Quote In the church we used to attend there was a girl that I taught in kids church and she was always the most modestly dressed around. She was always very careful to dress in what was seen as appropriate by the church body. Her older sister is my daughter's age and she was always getting in trouble for her clothing. The older one is now in her mid-20s' working and going to school and living a nice productive adult life. The younger one I just found out via facebook is pregnant, she is a senior in high school. That isn't even close to what I was referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisFirst Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 21 Topic Count: 315 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 3,491 Content Per Day: 1.25 Reputation: 2,582 Days Won: 3 Joined: 09/25/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 27 minutes ago, Running Gator said: What is immodest? Do you think if I put up 10 pictures of women in varying amounts and types of clothing we could agree on which were immodest and which were not? I am sure we would all agree a woman (or a man) showing up church in a thong or a bikini is immodest. But after that it gets more iffy on if we would agree or not. Are shorts that do not go below the knee immodest? I know some people that think so, some people don't. Even the "painted on" clothing is really a matter of personal opinion. What I consider "painted on" differs from my wife and her view differs from our 20 something daughter's. Some would argue that anything that shows skin above the wrist is immodest. At what point does the responsibility fall on the male gender to control their thoughts? It's just common sense, when going to Church, be respectful - honour God and respect the brethren. Too much skin is distracting. Tight clothing is distracting. Short hemlines are distracting. Tank tops, low cleavage dresses, tops are Not for worship. To me, this is just pure common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Running Gator Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.66 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 10 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: If a woman is dressing modestly and you have a lust problem, the problem is on you. You cannot apply to a situation where a woman is purposely dressing in an immodest and provocative manner. What is a person does not feel that is modest attire? She is showing a lot of arm and the skirt does not go down to her ankles as well as the skirt seems to be very sheer. Whose version of "modest" dress gets to be the standard? Quote Having sexual liaisons with boys in church youth groups? Yes, happens way more than people would like to think. I worked with the youth and chaperoned more events than I can count in multiple states and even multiple countries and it happens everywhere. If not for the diligence of the chaperones it would be even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 1 minute ago, Running Gator said: What is a person does not feel that is modest attire? Now we enter the part where the questions start getting ridiculous. I think we can all agree, objectively, on what modest attire looks like. Quote She is showing a lot of arm and the skirt does not go down to her ankles as well as the skirt seems to be very sheer. Whose version of "modest" dress gets to be the standard? We are talking about an objective, generally understood concept of modesty. What is normally understood in our context. Quote Yes, happens way more than people would like to think. I worked with the youth and chaperoned more events than I can count in multiple states and even multiple countries and it happens everywhere. If not for the diligence of the chaperones it would be even worse. The fact that it happens, more or less, isn't really relevant, though. That is entirely beside the point. The point is that the pastor's daughter who was dressing immodestly, was living in sin, and that was reflected in how she dressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Running Gator Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.66 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 Just now, HisFirst said: It's just common sense, when going to Church, be respectful - honour God and respect the brethren. Too much skin is distracting. Tight clothing is distracting. Short hemlines are distracting. Tank tops, low cleavage dresses, tops are Not for worship. To me, this is just pure common sense. The thing about common sense is that is really not all that common. Too much skin? Outside of someone wearing a thong to church, that is sort of a subjective thing, don't you think. For some a hemline that does not touch the shoes is short, others would not agree. How "tight" is too tight? This is something that even my wife and I did not really agree on when our daughter was in her teens, though we did work it out between us and put a united front when setting the rules. Now she is a young adult and has her own rules and they differ from ours. And what about men? This cannot only be about the women. What about men wearing shorts to church? Yes? No? I have found that it depends on where people live more than anything else. I would have never dreamed of wearing shorts to church, then we moved to Arizona and it was somewhat the norm where we were living. And I love shorts, I would wear them to work if they let me! I know men that think anything less than a triple breasted suit is not respectful to God, others do not agree. The last church I attended was looking for a new music minister and we had candidates come and audition as it were. Far and away the most qualified and the most gifted wore sandals and to many that was the kiss of death. The debate over this almost split the church and in the end he did not get the job, all because some people felt sandals were not respectful to God. I just feel that so often these things are about our own biases and not based upon anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Running Gator Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 91 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 10,596 Content Per Day: 3.66 Reputation: 2,743 Days Won: 25 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 4 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: Now we enter the part where the questions start getting ridiculous. I think we can all agree, objectively, on what modest attire looks like. Outside of not wearing a thong to church, I do not think we can. Modest attire is different from region to region and different based upon the age of the one making the determination. You seem to think that your standard is the only one that counts, but it is in the end just your opinion. Quote We are talking about an objective, generally understood concept of modesty. What is normally understood in our context. Again, outside of the crazy extremes of wearing a thong to church, there is no such thing generally understood concept of modesty. My view of modesty is very different than that of my daughters and that of my parents. What my parents thought was modest their parents disagreed with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisFirst Posted May 1, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 21 Topic Count: 315 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 3,491 Content Per Day: 1.25 Reputation: 2,582 Days Won: 3 Joined: 09/25/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 1, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Running Gator said: The thing about common sense is that is really not all that common. Too much skin? Outside of someone wearing a thong to church, that is sort of a subjective thing, don't you think. For some a hemline that does not touch the shoes is short, others would not agree. How "tight" is too tight? This is something that even my wife and I did not really agree on when our daughter was in her teens, though we did work it out between us and put a united front when setting the rules. Now she is a young adult and has her own rules and they differ from ours. And what about men? This cannot only be about the women. What about men wearing shorts to church? Yes? No? I have found that it depends on where people live more than anything else. I would have never dreamed of wearing shorts to church, then we moved to Arizona and it was somewhat the norm where we were living. And I love shorts, I would wear them to work if they let me! I know men that think anything less than a triple breasted suit is not respectful to God, others do not agree. The last church I attended was looking for a new music minister and we had candidates come and audition as it were. Far and away the most qualified and the most gifted wore sandals and to many that was the kiss of death. The debate over this almost split the church and in the end he did not get the job, all because some people felt sandals were not respectful to God. I just feel that so often these things are about our own biases and not based upon anything else. You have said you have a daughter? In her twenties? Then as a male (regardless of being her father, you would know exactly how much skin, shortness of hemline and tightness of clothing attracts a man(and I know all men are attracted differently) but I'm pretty certain if it's tight, short and very revealing, most men will look. Imo, you are being contrary just for the sake of arguing. I could be wrong...... Edited May 1, 2017 by HisFirst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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