Pelagianism

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

It demonstrates that James White is a better debater.  Did the OJ Simpson trial for murdering his ex-wife prove he was innocent?

Ill take you back to your initial reply to me

" I agree with you on your last post Blueeyedjewel.  It's not just a matter of debating, more importantly, it's a matter of what God's word says. "

Thats what I have been standing on. I will not entertain strawmen.

This exchange of ideas has been exhausted as far as I am concerned. BYE

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Wayne222 said:

Why would God create some people with no chance to be saved. That's not logical to me. 

We see through the glass dimly.

We cannot understand Gods ways.

God is sovereign.

8"For My thoughts are not your thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways," declares the LORD. 9"For as the heavens are higher than the earth, So are My ways higher than your ways And My thoughts than your thoughts.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Willa said:

I believe Scripture, not your logic.  People must resist His grace and the gift of faith to go to hell.  

I will not respond anymore to this Thread.  My beliefs are founded completely on God's Word.  Yours are based on man's logic.  We agree to disagree.

Blessings,

Willa

You never responded to me in the first place. WHY?

I provided scripture that disproves your thinking.

[Wayne222]

God created everyone to be saved. It's his will. Some will not be saved it's there will.

[Robert William]

24 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

God created everyone to be saved. It's his will. Some will not be saved it's there will.

I already gave you scripture proving you wrong. God saves, man can NOT save himself.

1Co 2:14  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1. It is man who is deceitful (Jer. 17:9), full of evil (Mark 7:21-23), loves darkness (John 3:19), does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12), is ungodly (Rom. 5:6), dead in his sins (Eph. 2:1), by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3), cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14), and a slave of sin (Rom. 6:16-20).
   1. The unbeliever CAN respond to God. His response will be in accordance with Scripture that says that he cannot do good, is a hater of God, is full of evil, etc. Therefore, we conclude that his free will response will be to reject God, according to the limits described by Scripture itself.
   2. How is it possible that an unbeliever who cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14), who does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12), and who is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:14-20), simply "chooses" God?
2. It is God who appoints people to believe (Acts 13:48), chooses who is to be holy and blameless (Eph. 1:4), calls according to His purpose (2 Tim. 1:9), chooses us for salvation (2 Thess. 2:13-14), grants the act of believing (Phil. 1:29), grants repentance (2 Tim. 2:24-26). It is God who causes us to be born again (1 Pet. 1:3), draws people to Himself (John 6:44, 65), predestines us to salvation (Rom. 8:29-30) and adoption (Eph. 1:5) according to His purpose (Eph. 1:11), makes us born again not by our will but by His will (John 1:12-13), and works faith in the believer (John 6:28-29).
3. Man Apart from God
   1. Jer. 13:23, "Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard his spots? Then you also can do good who are accustomed to doing evil."
   2. Rom. 5:10, "For if while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life."
   3. Rom. 8:7, "because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so."
4. Total Depravity Verses
   1. Gen. 6:5, "Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually."
   2. Gen. 8:21, "And the Lord smelled the soothing aroma; and the Lord said to Himself, “I will never again curse the ground on account of man, for the intent of man’s heart is evil from his youth."
   3. Ecc. 7:29, “Behold, I have found only this, that God made men upright, but they have sought out many devices.”
   4. Micah 7:4, "The best of them is like a briar, The most upright like a thorn hedge. The day when you post a watchman, Your punishment will come. Then their confusion will occur."
   5. John 3:27, "John answered and said, “A man can receive nothing, unless it has been given him from heaven."
5. Verses against free will choice of sinners:
   1. John 1:13, "who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."
   2. Rom. 9:16, "So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy."
      1. "the man" is singular
   3. Rom. 9:18, "So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires."

 

 

[Robert William]

34 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

God created everyone to be saved. It's his will. Some will not be saved it's there will.

You have proven to me that you are preaching Pelagian heresy.

[Wayne222]

52 minutes ago, Robert William said:

You have proven to me that you are preaching Pelagian heresy.

Heresy is a sin. How am I sinning? Look the sinner hears the gospel and can reject it or accept it according to his will. Everyone has light or how could God judge them?It's just men loved darkness and refuse to turn to God. They know what they love. 

[Robert William]

1 minute ago, Wayne222 said:

Heresy is a sin. How am I sinning? Look the sinner hears the gospel and can reject it or accept it according to his will. Everyone has light or how could God judge them?It's just men loved darkness and refuse to turn to God. They know what they love. 

You reject scripture, it's pointless to continue, I view the Canon of 66 books as the ultimate and final authority, you have elevated your feeling above scripture, that's the sin of idolatry.

[Wayne222]

Just now, Robert William said:

You reject scripture, it's pointless to continue, I view the Canon of 66 books as the ultimate and final authority, you have elevated your feeling above scripture, that's the sin of idolatry.

First you accuse me of heresy and now idolatry. I dont bow to idols at all. I bow to Jesus. Anyway your view has been debated by many. Norman Geiser sp? And James White and many others. My view does not mean I am heretical. We are saved by God's grace. But I am not a Calvinist. I like the teachings of Hank Hannigraft. And also my favorite Adrian Rogers. There is room in the body of Christ for diffrent views.

 

 

[Robert William]

5 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

First you accuse me of heresy and now idolatry. I dont bow to idols at all. I bow to Jesus. Anyway your view has been debated by many. Norman Geiser sp? And James White and many others. My view does not mean I am heretical. We are saved by God's grace. But I am not a Calvinist. I like the teachings of Hank Hannigraft. And also my favorite Adrian Rogers. There is room in the body of Christ for diffrent views.

 

 

Except for James White I know why you like those types of preachers, it's because they are Pelagian and or Arminian.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Robert William