Resurrection

[simplejeff]

18 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

None of that makes it anti-Semitic to go to church on Sunday, today

 

32 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

There is nothing anti-Semitic about Sunday observance.

There was much , much in the past, even in the last 100 to 200 years :

(just found) :  excerpts from :

http://personal.stevens.edu/~llevine/sunday_laws.pdf

"From  the  earliest  times,  American  legisl
ation  has  favored  regulations  of  Sabbath  
observance.  The  courts  have  
invariably  traced  the  orig
in  of  Sunday  laws  to  the  
2
Jews’  legislation  for  the  Sabbath,  but  ha
ve  calmly  transferred  the  “holy  time”  
from the seventh day of the week to the first.
The  first  Sabbath  Laws  were  instituted  in  
1650  in  Connecticut.  Other  colonies  followed  
suit. The goal was to preserve the “sanctity”
of the day of rest. Th
e Blue Laws (as these
sorts of laws were referred to) in Connect
icut included the followi
ng: “No one shall run
on  the  Sabbath  day,  or  walk  in  his  garden  or  
elsewhere,  except  reverently  to  and  from  
meeting;  No  one  shall  travel,  cook  victuals,  make  beds,  sweep  house,  cut  hair,  or  shave  
on  the  Sabbath  day;  No  woman  shall  kiss  
her  child  on  the  Sabbath;  The  Sabbath  shall  
begin at sunset on Saturday.” "

-----

"Sabbath observing Jews who came to America
found themselves at odds with the general
society within which they resided. For example,  
The  pressure  of  conformity  to  the  customs  of  the  majority  affected  the  Sabbath  
observance  by  Richmond  Jews.  The  pressu
re  of  business  and  the  attendance  of  
Jews  at  private  schools  on  Saturday  were
  formidable  obstacles  to  religious  
orthodoxy.  "

-----

"The fact of the matter is th
at the courts have upheld th
e legality of Sunday Laws.  
Sunday  closing  laws:  Laws  requiring  
merchants  to  be  closed  on  Sunday  do  
not
violate  the  Establishment  Clause  [of  
the  First  Amendment,  namely,  “Congress  
shall  make  no  law  respecting  an  esta
blishment  of  religion.”]  McGowan  v.  
Maryland, 366 U.S. 420 (1961).
Rationale:   The   Court   reasoned   in   McGo
wan   that,   as   these   statutes   are   
administered  today,  they  have  a  secula
r  purpose  and  effec
t:  providing  a  uniform  
day  of  rest  for  all  citizens.
  (The  Court  believed  it  irrelevant  that  the  laws  were  
originally enacted for
purely religious reasons.)"

-------

"The  problem  of  keeping  Shabbos  and  working  on  Sunday  continued  well  into  the  
twentieth       century.       In       1943       Rabbi
       Dr.       Bernard       Drachman       (See       
http://www.jewishpress.com/page.do/19202/
A_Forgotten_Champion_of_American_Orth
odoxy.html
 ) wrote:
Of  the  forty-eight  states  of  the  Union  
twenty-four,  or  exactly
  half,  prohibit  all  
work  or  business  on  Sunday. ..."

------

 

 

p.s.   nothing at all to do with sda .......

[Guest shiloh357]

3 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

 

There was much , much in the past, even in the last 100 to 200 years :

 

Nothing you posted proves that Sunday observance is anti-Semitic.   Stop posting nonsense.

[Guest shiloh357]

2 hours ago, Justin Adams said:

There are other reasons why Christians will not want to consider the Wednesday crucifixion and Sabbath resurrection. 

No, we really just get the truth from the Bible.  Jesus rose AFTER the Sabbath was ended.  He was buried on Wed evening, just before the onset of the High Sabbath and rose at the end of the weekly Sabbath giving us 72 hours or three days and three nights just like He said.   So immediately after the weekly Sabbath was ended, he rose on the first day of the week.

It's not rocket science.

[simplejeff]

Well, perhaps some readers care:  (many accounts of anti-semitic legislation re opposed to Yahweh's Sabbath)

https://www.google.com/search?q=anti-semetic+sunday+laws&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

[Justin Adams]

Full text - re quoted: Hopefully you will get to read all of this and the various translations to see if indeed this is correct.

There are other reasons why Christians will not want to consider the Wednesday crucifixion and Sabbath resurrection.   They may have learned about it from a heretical group that denies the eternity of the Son of God, Yeshua.   There are many cults that quickly recognize and imitate a form of godliness, but then they reject the Son of God, even denying that he is YHWH our Adonai.  Christians need to learn that Satan's expertise is in packaging up neglected truths with damnable falsehoods.  Satan hopes to trick some into the lie using the neglected truth, and at the same time make other Christians, keep away from the neglected truth due to the bad reputation packaged with it.   Yet it is necessary to make a search into what the truth is.   For most Christians already are part of a cult or heresy.   The only way to escape is to pray and study the truth your group or denomination may be neglecting.   Specifically, everyone needs to pray that God will show them the truth on every matter.  One need to believe they will receive an answer fitting their level of maturity.

       Another reason Christians may not be able to see certain truths is that they are using Bibles that hide that truth.   The Catholics make their own translations.   Different Protestant denominations also make their own translations.   And every other cult in the world tries to make its own translation of the Scriptures.   There are so many versions of the Bible in America, that no one can blame Christians for being confused.   On the other hand, the confusion is witness to the reality of the attack of Satan on the Word of God.   If he cannot burn bibles, then he prints his own, and uses them to deceive Christians.  Should you choose this mission, to seek the truth, you will be met with all of these alternatives.   The situation is comparable to ancient times when the people who knew the truth lived 10,000 miles away from those who did.   A simple web search on a biblical topic will yield more controversy than anyone with a lifetime of scholarship can unravel.  No one actually has time to sift through the fog that Satan has created.   And the fog is not just lies.  That fog is dressed up in every form of outward religion.  It looks spiritual, tastes spiritual, and is partly spiritual, but is mixed with deadly poison.   Will you be able to drink the truth without swallowing the poison first? Will you endure the trek while you search?   Many will try and be unable.  That is what Yeshua said.  Blessed is the one who tries asking God for help.

       Remember, if you are content with everything you were taught by your group, then it is likely that you do not have an eye to discern neglected truth.  It is probable that you are not practicing the faith as Yeshua meant it to be practiced.   It is likely that somewhere in the past your fathers lied.   Is that not the testimony of the Bible?   One thing is very clear in the Scriptures, in both Old and New Testaments:  the majority of people who THINK they have the truth actually believe lies and oppose the truth whenever it comes along.   And these people make every claim to being perfectly religious and perfectly spiritual about it.   Only the absolute truth can set you free from all of this.  The absolute truth is Messiah Yeshua crucified and raised from the dead.   Therefore, we need to understand the facts of his death and resurrection, and the important conclusions we can draw from those facts.

      In the Messiah's death and resurrection, two important biblical themes come together.   These are the Law and the Gospel.   Everything about Yeshua's death and resurrection was according to the Torah and Prophets.   Both the laws and the teachings of forgiveness for sin are exalted in the historical events of Messiah's life on earth.  This article will show how Yeshua exalts both the Torah and the Good News.   He died to make payment for our sins, to satisfy God's just decree of punishment for sin.   He rose again to give us life, and this life is expressed in His law which he is wants to write on our hearts.   Whoever desires forgiveness of sin and this eternal life of living the way God desires will be saved.   One begins by asking Yeshua to forgive their sins.   Doing this, you will be forgiven, and will be given God's Holy Spirit so that you will live and learn to love Yeshua by keeping his commandments.

       Why then do we believe that Messiah rose from the dead on the Sabbath day?  For two reasons.  First, the Sabbath best illustrates rest and redemption from sin, and peace in the life to come.  Second, because the facts necessary to make this point are actually true.  Messiah did rise from the dead on the Sabbath day.  I mean the seventh day Sabbath, which is called "Saturday" in English or "El Sabado" in Spanish.  This is the same Sabbath that Jewish People and many Christians worship God on.  In order to understand this, we will need to take a fresh look at the original Greek manuscripts and some accurate translations.   But we will not get too detailed here.   This article is actually a popular summary of a 255 page book called, The Scroll of Biblical Chronology and Prophecy, which is available free online.   This book demonstrates how the Sabbath resurrection leads to the complete solution for all biblical chronology problems, and how it provides a firm foundation for understanding future events, however, it is technical and not very devotional.   The current article you are reading is intended to be as non-technical as I can make it, and it is intended to be devotional.  That means, I will frequently explain the spiritual meaning of things and what it means to you.  

        All the finer details are proved in the chronology book.   Putting the resurrection on the Sabbath is related to possible years for the crucifixion, which in turn is related to the solution of Daniel 9, which in turn is related to when the sabbatical years are, which in turn is related to when the Jubilee year is, which in turn are related to the overall framework of biblical chronology.   If you are willing to digest all this information, then you will be just as confident as I am about the truth of the Scripture, and exactly how and when God did things in history.   Taking the whole counsel of God and putting it together into a consistent whole is the real proof of the divine inspiration of Scripture and why we should listen to its teaching.

        Matthew 28:1 teaches a Sabbath resurrection:  "On the later of the Sabbaths, at the dawning for the first of the Sabbaths, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the tomb."   It begins, "On the later Sabbath ..." because there were two Sabbaths in Passion Week.  One Sabbath was the annual Passover feast day, and the other was the weekly seventh day Sabbath which followed.   In Passion Week, the annual Sabbath was on Thursday.   "On the later of the Sabbaths" tells us that the resurrection was on the weekly Sabbath, and not on the annual Sabbath.    Jewish believers in Yeshua know that the annual Passover feast day is a rest day as well as the weekly Sabbath.

         Why does the above translation of Matthew 28:1 differ from what Christians are used to?  Actually, what Christianity does not realize is that with respect to translations, it is like the proverbial frog being slowly boiled to death in a pan of water.   Errors have crept into the translation because either ancient translators did not understand the text or they had an unspiritual distaste for things that reminded them of Jewish laws, like the Sabbath.   Here is a list of resources that admit that the original Greek meant "Sabbath".

·         The Concordant Greek Text

·         The Concordant Literal New Testament

·         Robert Young's Literal Translation

·         Some of John Calvin's Commentaries

·         The Companion Bible

·         The Interlinear Bible by J.P. Green, 2nd Edition, Vol. IV

·         The Coverdale Quarto Bible, 1537

·         Some of Wycliffe's Translations

·         Some of Tyndale's Translations

·         The Rheims version, 1582

·         The Bishop's Bible, 1568

·         The Latin Vulgate

·         The Old Latin

·         All Greek Texts

·         The Syriac Peshitta

        It was only at the time of the reformation that the translators decided they could change the text from "Sabbath".   Now they translate "week".   But the original Matthew said, "On the later of the Sabbaths, at the dawning for the first of the Sabbaths, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the tomb."   The book of Leviticus shows us what the end of Matthew's verse means.  Matthew wrote, "at the dawning for the first of the Sabbaths".   If we use specifically the King James Version, we will get an accurate explanation of the original Hebrew, "And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete:" (Lev. 23:15).    This text gives commandment to Israel to begin counting something after the annual Passover Sabbath.   It says they should count "seven sabbaths".   "At dawn for the first of the Sabbaths" will be the first one of these Sabbaths.  It will be exactly the first Sabbath after the annual Passover feast.

        So the resurrection was prior to the dawning on the weekly Sabbath after Passover.   Why has Christianity not seen this?   Do you really expect a majority to be correct?   Yeshua came to an adulterous and unbelieving generation of Jews.   Do you really think Christianity has improved on the righteousness of the Jews?   While Christianity has spread over the whole world, it has also been degenerating at the same time.   With each new wave of spreading, its original potency and truth has been diluted bit by bit.   Did not God's law warn us: "Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil;" (Exodus 23:2).   The Jewish People rejected the most important teaching of the Torah and Prophets.  The most important teaching that would tell them that Yeshua is the Messiah, the Son of God, the embodiment of the Most High in human form.   Why then should you expect the Gentile Christians to do any better?   The first generation began well, but the story of biblical history is a lesson in the speed and quickness of apostasy!   Did not Messiah himself predict that at the end of the age, the love of most would grow cold, and the many would fall away from the truth?

        As always, apostasy overturns the most important doctrines and teachings of the Scripture.  Those who want to be lawless overturn and remove everything that reminds them of God's Law.   That includes the Sabbath.   They remove just enough to become disobedient to God, and then Satan leaves them alone.  He wants them to retain the more minor truths, because Satan wants to keep their children from seeking the truth elsewhere.

        Messiah Yeshua died on a Wednesday afternoon, and rose from the dead just before dawn on the Sabbath day.   Now, we agreed that Messiah did rise on the third day.   The time immediately before dawn on the weekly Sabbath of that week falls just within the limit of three days.   In this case a day is a 24 hour period.   But when does it begin and end?   Yeshua's death on the cross was a sacrifice for our sin.  The scripture also calls his sacrifice a "peace" offering, because it makes "peace" or Shalom between God and man.   Here is the Torah's regulation for a peace offering, "And the flesh of the sacrifice of his peace offerings for thanksgiving shall be eaten the same day that it is offered; he shall not leave any of it until the morning" (Lev. 7:15).  Notice that the offering must be eaten "the same day that it is offered"?   Yet, the limit of that day is defined as "until the morning".  The Rabbis, who liked to put fences around the law, changed the limit to midnight.  However, the Torah teaches that the offering could be eaten as long as it was night, as long as dawn did not lighten the countryside.  By this definition of "day" for a "peace offering", the day lasted from morning to morning.   And the peace offering is a type of Messiah.   Therefore, we should not be surprised if the three days are counted according to a Temple day for a sacrificial offering.

So let us calculate the three days according to the peace offering.  The death of Messiah falls on the first day of the count, between dawn on Wednesday and dawn on Thursday.   Both the Passover lamb and the peace offerings offered at the same hour Yeshua died would have to be eaten by the end of that "same day" which is defined as "until the morning".  In the case of a sacrifice on Wednesday afternoon, the day ends at dawn on Thursday.   That is the first day.    Some offerings could be eaten on the second day (cf. Lev. 19:6).  The second day was dawn on Thursday to dawn on Friday.   But no offering could be eaten on the third day.   The third day was dawn on Friday to dawn on the Sabbath.   Yeshua was raised before dawn on the Sabbath.    It was still the third day until the dawn lightened the countryside.   Yet Yeshua's offering was kosher on the third day, so that we may partake of his resurrection.    Yeshua's offering is an exception, as pointed out in the Psalms, "Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see decay" (Psalm 16:10).
 

Edited October 20, 2017 by Justin Adams

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Justin Adams said:

Full text - re quoted: Hopefully you will get to read all of this and the various translations to see if indeed this is correct.

There are other reasons why Christians will not want to consider the Wednesday crucifixion and Sabbath resurrection.  

No, we just get our understanding from the Bible.   We don't need you or anyone to explain to us that we get from somewhere else.   We get it from the Bible.   The Bible, the one with 66 books, the only true Bible, is all we need to defend our views.

Quote

Why does the above translation of Matthew 28:1 differ from what Christians are used to?  Actually, what Christianity does not realize is that with respect to translations, it is like the proverbial frog being slowly boiled to death in a pan of water.   Errors have crept into the translation because either ancient translators did not understand the text or they had an unspiritual distaste for things that reminded them of Jewish laws, like the Sabbath. 

In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
(Mat 28:1)

The Greek word "opse" for the word "end"  means, "after."   The issue is not the word "Sabbath."  What the text says is that after the Sabbath, as it was beginning to dawn toward the first day of the week...    After the Sabbath, because the women would not have violated the Sabbath to come to the tomb  to finish anointing Jesus' body.

 

[Justin Adams]

9 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

No, we just get our understanding from the Bible.   We don't need you or anyone to explain to us that we get from somewhere else.   We get it from the Bible.   The Bible, the one with 66 books, the only true Bible, is all we need to defend our views.

In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
(Mat 28:1)

The Greek word "opse" for the word "end"  means, "after."   The issue is not the word "Sabbath."  What the text says is that after the Sabbath, as it was beginning to dawn toward the first day of the week...    After the Sabbath, because the women would not have violated the Sabbath to come to the tomb  to finish anointing Jesus' body.

 

And Yeshua was ALREADY out of the tomb before they got there.

He rose sometime on the Sabbath. Maybe it was later towards the end of the Sabbath. One thing is for certain, the mistranslated verses were sometimes by error and sometimes by design. The Greek was no doubt from the Aramaic anyway. So much to discredit truth was twisted because the Israelis, as today, are just hated and despised. You really have to dig to find the depravity of misrepresentations. If your mind is open, you will find quite a few Greek translation and transliteration errors of misunderstanding the vernacular of the times.

If you care not to do this, that is OK as well.
But you cannot be so OUTSPOKEN about everyone and their errors, heresies, and teaching falsehoods and lies, without first applying the same rigors of inquiry, inspection, and cross-examination of motive to yourself.

(This does not detract from the Lord's design or intention to show us His Truth thru the prophets and apostles. He can make a donkey talk if necessary after all.)

[Justin Adams]

12 hours ago, John Robinson said:

What is with all the SDA cultists coming here to Worthy lately? If they're looking for new recruits, I'd suggest they not troll an evangelical website, as it's not going to end well.

Caramba, what a strange bunch!

That is a beautiful way of saying - RACA.

I have not seen any but the cult of 'thought police' that is undesirable...

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Justin Adams said:

And Yeshua was ALREADY out of the tomb before they got there.

Yes he was.

Quote

He rose sometime on the Sabbath.

No, he didn't and the Bible never says that.   That is something YOU are making up.

Quote

One thing is for certain, the mistranslated verses were sometimes by error and sometimes by design. The Greek was no doubt from the Aramaic anyway.

Nothing has been mistranslated.   You are simply teaching false doctrine, like you do on other threads.

Quote

So much to discredit truth was twisted because the Israelis, as today, are just hated and despised.

Nothing is being discredited or twisted.   You are simply not skilled enough theologically to make the claims you're making.  There is nothing anti-Semitic about saying Jesus was raised on the first day of the week.  

 

Quote

 

If you care not to do this, that is OK as well.
But you cannot be so OUTSPOKEN about everyone and their errors, heresies, and teaching falsehoods and lies, without first applying the same rigors of inquiry, inspection, and cross-examination of motive to yourself.

 

You're exactly right.  And there is no false doctrine in what I am saying.   So I can be that outspoken about the falsehoods and heresies that get promoted on this board.

 

[Guest shiloh357]

1 minute ago, Justin Adams said:

That is a beautiful way of saying - RACA.

I have not seen any but the cult of 'thought police' that is undesirable...

Those who wish to control what others think are the ones who can't handle the push back on their nonsensical claims.