Quasar93 Posted December 24, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 156 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 651 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 236 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/06/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted December 24, 2017 What kind of Body did Jesus have after His resurrection ? For those who would like to explore an alternative view to what Jesus post resurrection body was, let me pose this question for you: As we read in John 1:1-2, reference to the Word, is equated as that of Jesus: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning." In John 17:5: "And now Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began." In Proverbs 8:22-23: "The Lord brought me forth as the first of His works, before His deeds of old; I was appointed from eternity, from the beginning, before the world began." Finally, in Col.1:15: "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation." As such, the pre-incarnate Jesus was the first of YHWH's heavenly host spirit world, consisting of angels, through whom He created the universe according to Heb.1:1-2: "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the universe." The pre-incarnate Jesus was seen in the old testament at various times, physically materialized [called a theophany], as well as angels, such as being referred to as Lord, in Genesis 18, 19 and in Genesis 32, where Jacob wrestled with Him and called Him God. In Jos.5:13-15 where he is the Captain of God's army from heaven. Again in Nebuchadnezzar's fiery furnace when He appeared as the fourth man in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, in Daniel 3:25, among a number of other places. Which brings us to the issues in 1 Cor.15:42-44: "So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakeness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body." And in verse 50: "I declare to you brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." And again in 1 Cor.15:52-54: "In a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed - in a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet: For the trumpet will sound the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality., then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory." Now the question is, was the pre-incarnate body of Jesus the same as His resurrected body, since it had all the characteristics of a physical human body? As illustrated above in both the bodies of the pre-incarnate Jesus, as well as the angels who appeared fully materialized, God sent on various missions to earth in the old testament. Such as those with Abraham, in Genesis 18, 19, and 32 when he wrestled with Jacob, as well as the captain of God's army in Jos.5:13-15, where they both ate and were physically active? If not, provide examples of why the visible glorified body of Jesus, was not the very same as that of His pre-incarnate body, empowered to be materialized and fully physical, when He was resurrected. In the very same way as the angels who appeared in visible bodies, all with every physical aspect of the mortal physical bodies of human beings. A case and point is recorded in Acts 9:7, where Jesus accosted Saul and the men with him on the road to Damascus, when they heard him, but no one saw Him. Quasar93 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeyondET Posted January 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 118 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,991 Content Per Day: 1.25 Reputation: 825 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/29/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/01/1968 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Hey cool thread, in my opinion the same body he was crucified , yet with the wounds healed not over but healed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 On 12/24/2017 at 8:34 AM, Quasar93 said: Now the question is, was the pre-incarnate body of Jesus the same as His resurrected body, since it had all the characteristics of a physical human body? No, it was not the same body. The resurrected body of Jesus is the glorified version of his incarnate body. If Jesus' body reverted back to a pre-incarnate form, then there was no bodily resurrection. The body that went into the grave is the same body that came out. Furthermore, in His pre-incarnate form, Jesus was not Jewish. But Revelation 22:16 tells us that He is still Jewish; He is still of the line of David. And He has to be Jewish and of the physical line of David in order to fulfill all of the Messianic prophecies remaining to be fulfilled during His second coming and messianic kingdom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted January 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.33 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) On 12/24/2017 at 9:34 AM, Quasar93 said: What kind of Body did Jesus have after His resurrection ? For those who would like to explore an alternative view to what Jesus post resurrection body was, let me pose this question for you: As we read in John 1:1-2, reference to the Word, is equated as that of Jesus: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning." In John 17:5: "And now Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began." In Proverbs 8:22-23: "The Lord brought me forth as the first of His works, before His deeds of old; I was appointed from eternity, from the beginning, before the world began." Finally, in Col.1:15: "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation." As such, the pre-incarnate Jesus was the first of YHWH's heavenly host spirit world, consisting of angels, through whom He created the universe according to Heb.1:1-2: "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the universe." The pre-incarnate Jesus was seen in the old testament at various times, physically materialized [called a theophany], as well as angels, such as being referred to as Lord, in Genesis 18, 19 and in Genesis 32, where Jacob wrestled with Him and called Him God. In Jos.5:13-15 where he is the Captain of God's army from heaven. Again in Nebuchadnezzar's fiery furnace when He appeared as the fourth man in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, in Daniel 3:25, among a number of other places. Which brings us to the issues in 1 Cor.15:42-44: "So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakeness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body." And in verse 50: "I declare to you brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." And again in 1 Cor.15:52-54: "In a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed - in a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet: For the trumpet will sound the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality., then the saying that is written will come true: "Death has been swallowed up in victory." Now the question is, was the pre-incarnate body of Jesus the same as His resurrected body, since it had all the characteristics of a physical human body? As illustrated above in both the bodies of the pre-incarnate Jesus, as well as the angels who appeared fully materialized, God sent on various missions to earth in the old testament. Such as those with Abraham, in Genesis 18, 19, and 32 when he wrestled with Jacob, as well as the captain of God's army in Jos.5:13-15, where they both ate and were physically active? If not, provide examples of why the visible glorified body of Jesus, was not the very same as that of His pre-incarnate body, empowered to be materialized and fully physical, when He was resurrected. In the very same way as the angels who appeared in visible bodies, all with every physical aspect of the mortal physical bodies of human beings. A case and point is recorded in Acts 9:7, where Jesus accosted Saul and the men with him on the road to Damascus, when they heard him, but no one saw Him. Quasar93 Just some understanding to put in the pot thus far, in case it helps.......in heaven Jesus is in "the form of God" (Phil. 2:6), He is spirit, where it says God is spirit. On earth He may appear in glorified body, like an angel....where it says "His goings forth have been from old" (Mic. 5:2), He has made appearances.....the angel of the Lord I believe is a reference to jesus. But when He was born a baby and grew up in Israel He had a physical body like ours.....we know that it died......but when He was raised from the dead, He was raised in an imperishable (glorified) body, which is also a pattern and firstfruits of the redemption of our bodies. A glorified body can take on characteristics of a physical body like it can eat (eg, the angels that ate with Abraham) and the example you gave of being wrestled with.......except that it is not limited (bound) to the physical realm of space and time, eg, can appear/disappear, can go through physical barriers and cannot die or be killed....... it has eternal (spiritual) life. Edited January 3, 2018 by Heleadethme 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 26 minutes ago, Heleadethme said: Just some understanding to put in the pot thus far, in case it helps.......in heaven Jesus is in "the form of God" (Phil. 2:6), He is spirit, where it says God is spirit. On earth He may appear in glorified body, like an angel....where it says "His goings forth have been from old" (Mic. 5:2), He has made appearances.....the angel of the Lord I believe is a reference to jesus. But when He was born a baby and grew up in Israel He had a physical body like ours.....we know that it died......but when He was raised from the dead, He was raised in an imperishable (glorified) body, which is also a pattern and firstfruits of the redemption of our bodies. A glorified body can take on characteristics of a physical body like it can eat (eg, angels that age with Abraham) and the example you gave of being wrestled with.......except that it is not limited (bound) to the physical realm of space and time, eg, can appear/disappear, can go through physical barriers and cannot die or be killed....... it has eternal (spiritual) life. No, that is not true. The body that Jesus had on earth is still the body He has now, albeit in a resurrected, glorified state. Jesus is not in a spirit form. Jesus is still 100% man and 100%, and fully human and still Jewish and of the tribe of Judah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quasar93 Posted January 3, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 156 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 651 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 236 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/06/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 1 hour ago, shiloh357 said: No, it was not the same body. The resurrected body of Jesus is the glorified version of his incarnate body. If Jesus' body reverted back to a pre-incarnate form, then there was no bodily resurrection. The body that went into the grave is the same body that came out. Furthermore, in His pre-incarnate form, Jesus was not Jewish. But Revelation 22:16 tells us that He is still Jewish; He is still of the line of David. And He has to be Jewish and of the physical line of David in order to fulfill all of the Messianic prophecies remaining to be fulfilled during His second coming and messianic kingdom. Either quote the entire subject of what I quote, or not at all. Partial quotes are subject to readers arriving at misleding and wrong conclusions. The following is what I wrote : >>> Now the question is, was the pre-incarnate body of Jesus the same as His resurrected body, since it had all the characteristics of a physical human body? As illustrated above in both the bodies of the pre-incarnate Jesus, as well as the angels who appeared fully materialized, God sent on various missions to earth in the old testament. Such as those with Abraham, in Genesis 18, 19, and 32 when he wrestled with Jacob, as well as the captain of God's army in Jos.5:13-15, where they both ate and were physically active? If not, provide examples of why the visible glorified body of Jesus, was not the very same as that of His pre-incarnate body, empowered to be materialized and fully physical, when He was resurrected. In the very same way as the angels who appeared in visible bodies, all with every physical aspect of the mortal physical bodies of human beings. A case and point is recorded in Acts 9:7, where Jesus accosted Saul and the men with him on the road to Damascus, when they heard him, but no one saw Him.<<< Quasar93 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Quasar93 said: Either quote the entire subject of what I quote, or not at all. Partial quotes are subject to readers arriving at misleding and wrong conclusions. The following is what I wrote : >>> Now the question is, was the pre-incarnate body of Jesus the same as His resurrected body, since it had all the characteristics of a physical human body? As illustrated above in both the bodies of the pre-incarnate Jesus, as well as the angels who appeared fully materialized, God sent on various missions to earth in the old testament. Such as those with Abraham, in Genesis 18, 19, and 32 when he wrestled with Jacob, as well as the captain of God's army in Jos.5:13-15, where they both ate and were physically active? If not, provide examples of why the visible glorified body of Jesus, was not the very same as that of His pre-incarnate body, empowered to be materialized and fully physical, when He was resurrected. In the very same way as the angels who appeared in visible bodies, all with every physical aspect of the mortal physical bodies of human beings. A case and point is recorded in Acts 9:7, where Jesus accosted Saul and the men with him on the road to Damascus, when they heard him, but no one saw Him.<<< Quasar93 I answered the question you asked. I didn't misquote you. Jesus' appeared in human form prior to His incarnation. He was not like the angels, the Bible makes such comparisons. To ask people to speculate on what is not stated anywhere in the Bible is fruitless. The reason Jesus' glorified body isn't the same as his pre-incarnate form is that Jesus' glorified body is fully human, whereas his pre-incarnate form was simply in human form, not fully human. Rev. 22:16 makes clear that Jesus is still a Jew and of the line of David. That would not be true of his pre-incarnate form. Edited January 3, 2018 by shiloh357 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quasar93 Posted January 3, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 156 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 651 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 236 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/06/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: I answered the question you asked. I didn't misquote you. Jesus' appeared in human form prior to His incarnation. He was not like the angels, the Bible makes such comparisons. To ask people to speculate on what is not stated anywhere in the Bible is fruitless. The reason Jesus' glorified body isn't the same as his pre-incarnate body is that Jesus' glorified body is fully human, whereas his pre-incarnate form was simply in human form, not fully human. Rev. 22:16 makes clear that Jesus is still a Jew and of the line of David. That would not be true of his pre-incarnate form. I did not say you misquoted me! But rather, the quote you made, was a partial, giving readers misleading opinions. Quasar93 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 16 minutes ago, Quasar93 said: I did not say you misquoted me! But rather, the quote you made, was a partial, giving readers misleading opinions. Quasar93 What kind of misleading opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted January 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.33 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 3, 2018 1 hour ago, shiloh357 said: No, that is not true. The body that Jesus had on earth is still the body He has now, albeit in a resurrected, glorified state. Jesus is not in a spirit form. Jesus is still 100% man and 100%, and fully human and still Jewish and of the tribe of Judah. 2Corinthians 5:16-17 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more. Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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