Buddy D. Mouse Posted July 12, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 108 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2020 But getting back to Ole Camel Knees and the OP - James was emcee at the Acts 15 council, saying "it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us"... Bold, and perhaps presumptuous... Peter was eating with Gentiles at Antioch until "certain of James" showed up - Peter and Barnabus backed away from what they had been doing, and Paul jumped on Peter about it. Later Camel Knees James talks Paul into taking a vow at the Temple, and paying for other guys to do the vow, shave their heads, etc. It is obvious that James had a STRONGLY JEWISH SLANT to things, and Paul's struggles with Judaizers is well-known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy D. Mouse Posted July 12, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 108 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2020 Aye, gids, and let no one muzzle us oxen as we tread out the grain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted July 12, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 12, 2020 26 minutes ago, Episcopius said: I suspect that, too, gids, in any case, it is up to you to reconcile Paul with this "right strawey epistle" I have no issues reconciling Paul and James. All James was doing is clarifying that IF we get saved by faith alone correctly, good works WILL flow. The fact that for many, the transformation is not occurring, even after decades of walking as believers, is a mountain sized red flag, but instead of investigating, we have rather erroneously concluded that two apostles were in disagreement as to the very basics of our Christian faith. Thank God, He is about to open our understanding to why there is, in fact, no conflict at all between the two. And when we see it, and walk on it, we will rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory. blessings, Gideon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy D. Mouse Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 108 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2020 I do not say that the two apostles were "in disagreement as to the very basics of our Christian faith", but I look at James throughout all his life as scripture presents it. Wasn't he present trying to go get Jesus thinking Jesus had a screw loose, leading to "who is my mother and my brothers?" So James was not a disciple during Jesus' ministry. Yet he soon becomes one of the PILLARS in Jerusalem. He is not fully WITH THE PROGRAM about Gentiles, affecting even Peter who had the "don't call common what I have cleansed" vision. I do not minimize clear disagreements between James and Paul. Even James' "compromises" set forth in Acts 15 council - Paul goes against later saying "eat whatever is sold in the shambles". There are disagreements between Paul and James, and it is unwise to ignore them as we chew our straw and tread the grain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 13, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Episcopius said: I do not say that the two apostles were "in disagreement as to the very basics of our Christian faith", but I look at James throughout all his life as scripture presents it. Wasn't he present trying to go get Jesus thinking Jesus had a screw loose, leading to "who is my mother and my brothers?" So James was not a disciple during Jesus' ministry. Yet he soon becomes one of the PILLARS in Jerusalem. He is not fully WITH THE PROGRAM about Gentiles, affecting even Peter who had the "don't call common what I have cleansed" vision. I do not minimize clear disagreements between James and Paul. Even James' "compromises" set forth in Acts 15 council - Paul goes against later saying "eat whatever is sold in the shambles". There are disagreements between Paul and James, and it is unwise to ignore them as we chew our straw and tread the grain. No, brother. You are sowing seeds of doubt that we a children of God in tbe 21st century can take ALL of the words God has given to us in the New Testament to lean upon them fully for understanding, exhortation and, where the case may arise, correction. There are no "minor" epistles. Either all scripture is given by inspiration of God is profitable for correction and instruction in righteousness, or none of it is. Once cracks in our dam of truth are accepted that hold back unbelief, we risk being swept away by our interpretations of who was and who was not more inspired. The main thrust of my post stands as is. To bring doubt upon the validity of the author is but a smokescreen, a diversion, an easy way to escape having to own up to examining ourselves whether we truly "be in the faith" as to whether the shoe fits us or not. blessings, Gids Edited July 13, 2020 by Gideon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy D. Mouse Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 108 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2020 I am not sowing any seeds of doubt and resent the accusation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 13, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Episcopius said: I am not sowing any seeds of doubt and resent the accusation. Brother, you may not see it as such. However, in your very first post, this was your response. Look at the intro to James' letter. I'm a Gentile. Seems not addressed to me. But it's scripture, has good stuff in it - I heard Luther called it an epistle of straw You could have very easily simply stayed on the thrust of the post. Failing that, you could have simply stated that the book of James is scripture and has "some good stuff" in it. However, first, you implied what James shared was not applicable to you or any other gentiles, and then threw in the kicker that Luther called it an epistle of straw. Why the need for such a comment? If that is not sowing seeds of doubt that we need to take James's words as the Word of God, rhen your understanding of sowing seeds of doubt and mine are not the same. If you disagree with what I shared in my Op, no problem. If you agree, great. But what you posted simply ignored why the post was shared to begin with and chose to go on a tangent. I would rather keep it on track if you do not mind, forcit is an important subject that needs our addressing. blessings, Gids Edited July 13, 2020 by Gideon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy D. Mouse Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Junior Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 108 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2020 Apology accepted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 13, 2020 Just now, Episcopius said: Apology accepted. ? Bless you. Gids Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathoner Posted July 13, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,312 Content Per Day: 7.11 Reputation: 13,343 Days Won: 99 Joined: 05/24/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2020 No disagreement exists between the epistle of James, the volume of Paul's writings, and the words of our Lord Himself. To couch it simply the works of our faith are thus: that we obey the Son of the living God. We love the Lord and serve Him alone, forsaking the cares of the world and this flesh which is perishing. The latter is by far the greatest challenge we face on the narrow path but take heart because Almighty God remembers that our frame is dust. Nothing is impossible in Christ Jesus: His yoke is easy and His burden is light! An excellent contribution by Gideon and if I have anything to add in the wake of his timely exhortation, it's this: never forget the prayer of our Lord as recorded in the 17th chapter of John. This is who we are. "I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. "Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. "As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. "And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. "Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. "And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: "I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me." (verses 15-23) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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