God places it on our hearts ,when we are to apologise.

[Whyme]

2 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Yes. If you were to point out I'd done/said something wrong and I relied, "You do it, too" that implies I know what I did, I know what I did was wrong, and implies some degree of regret. It might not express a desire to change but it implies admission and regret. 

Does that meet the standard(s) you've posted? Would you find that apology godly?

It depends on the motive perhaps

[johnthebaptist]

3 minutes ago, Josheb said:

????? 

Who is controlling any conversation? I cannot tell you or anyone else how or what to post, but I can state what it is I, personally, will and will not collaborate with and leave the other person free to respond accordingly. 

You're off-topic again. 

I'm not interested in discussing the relevant veracity of digression.

I am interested in discussing the topic of this op and invite you to join me. 

Or not. 

You choose. 

 

 

The topic of conversation is the premise God places apologies on our heart and my position is 1) while an apology is a common and acceptable social convention, 2) it is not what scripture teaches and 3) there is a higher standard to which we are called when doing wrong and that standard applies no matter the wrong; even in cases of adultery.  

Have you anything op-relevant further to contribute in response to the above?

You said, "And when someone asks for a return to the topic and provides topical input with which to do so, then what?" so apparently someone is asking for a return to topic.

[Whyme]

20 minutes ago, Josheb said:

No I am not. The apologies posted are actual apologies I've received.

Based on the words alone, how do you know any of those apologies are sincere?

Ahh yes, the problem of accurately attributing motive to complete strangers in a text-based medium. 

How do you know the motive of another's apology in cyberspace? How accurately do you believe you can identify the motive in the three examples provided? 

I apologize for the way I spoke... 

I apologize for the way I impugned your character, deniggrated your motive, mocked you, and questioned your salvation.

You do it, too. 

 

Depends on my my motive. What's my motive in those three apologies? 

Jesus said you shall forgive your brother seventy times seven

 But how do you know your brother is sincere?

[OneLight]

There is no mention of trying to figure out the sincerity of the one you are forgiving.  It's doesn't matter if they are sincere or not.

Matthew 18:21-22

Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”

Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven. ..."

[Walter and Deborah]

On 2/25/2021 at 12:33 PM, clancy said:

First to God then to the brother/ sister we upset and hurt.

 

someone told me, God doesn’t do that....and it’s from the pit of hell?

@Clancy, as always any person must do of what your first statement is saying in this post, as you know for everyone must search the scriptures, but rightly divide the words of truth unto GOD, ok?

Matthew 18:21-35

Matthew 18:21-35 NKJV;NIV;KJV - The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant - Bible Gateway

Love, Walter

Edited March 3, 2021 by Walter and Deborah
More info.

[Whyme]

26 minutes ago, Josheb said:

No shifting onuses, please.

Don't know what that means. 

[OneLight]

8 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Why then d you suppose the topic arose? Why does your sincerity matter if you are apologizing (or confessing/repenting) for your own wrongdoing? Why does my sincerity matter if I am apologizing (or confessing/repenting) for my own wrongdoing?  

Or.....

Is the sincerity of my forgiving relevant?  

 

(I recommend reading through the thread to become familiar with what transpired)

We each will stand before the Lord and give account for every word we speak. Matthew 12:26

Should it matter?  That depends on if you are going to live your life for Christ according to what another does or feels.  I, for one, will not allow anyone to control my walk with Christ by resting my forgiveness on another persons sincerity.  Neither will I give another power to deny my apology by the hardness of their heart.  As long as my heart is right with the Lord, then I've done all I can do to create peace with another.

 

[OneLight]

2 minutes ago, Josheb said:

I completely agree. That is one of the reasons why I have asserted the position(s) I have. It matters. It matters now and it will matter then. It matters intra-personally and it matters inter-personally. 

Yes. For all the reasons I have stated in these posts.

Forgiveness is not the matter in dispute. 

Apology is what we're discussing. The op is about the veracity of apology and the premise God lays apology on our heart. 

My response is 1) while an apology is a common and acceptable social convention, 2) it is not what scripture teaches; 3) there is a higher standard to which we are called when doing wrong and 4) that standard applies no matter the wrong - including the wrong of personally attacking other posters in the forum. I have posted much about that in the posts above so if interested they can be read and if op-relevant questions persist ask and I'll endeavor to provide answers. Otherwise, the op appears to have run its course and I'll be moving on unless or until I read something new (and op-relevant). 

How would you ask for forgiveness then?  Would you come right out and ask "Will you forgive me for sinning against you?" without saying you were sorry?   That would be like saying "Forgive me, but I'm not sorry for what I did."

If you have a hard time with apologizing or saying you are sorry, which is a for of apologizing, that's your choice.  I chose to apologize when I am in the wrong.  It keeps me humble.

[OneLight]

2 minutes ago, Josheb said:

I just got done saying the conversation is not about forgiveness per se and my preference is to stick to the op.

Yet you do not control the progressiveness of a thread.  I see asking for forgiveness and apologizing one in the same and have made statement to the same.  Perhaps when you do not agree with me, try discussing instead of controlling. 

2 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Nice red herring. At no time did I say I have a hard time with either and any insinuation to the contrary isn't helpful. Apology is an acceptable social convention but it is not what scripture teaches. The specific apology prompting this op is definitely not scriptural and therefore not something God lays on anyone's heart..... and because of this discussion the matter was resolved in a manner I hope and I believe will be commendably enduring. 

Seriously?  There is no red herring in my statement or questions.  For someone who has no issue with an apology, you sure have a strange way of showing it through the posts you've made.

[Guest clancy]

5 hours ago, Walter and Deborah said:

@Clancy, as always any person must do of what your first statement is saying in this post, as you know for everyone must search the scriptures, but rightly divide the words of truth unto GOD, ok?

Matthew 18:21-35

Matthew 18:21-35 NKJV;NIV;KJV - The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant - Bible Gateway

Love, Walter

Ok, thanks, Walter.?