iamlamad Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 12, 2023 You can try and answer His questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 12, 2023 On 5/11/2023 at 6:34 AM, BibleWords said: That’s correct, it has not. You pulled verses out of context to give this answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleWords Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 233 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 139 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2023 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/20/1957 Share Posted May 12, 2023 Give Scripture for any of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleWords Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 233 Content Per Day: 0.58 Reputation: 139 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2023 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/20/1957 Share Posted May 12, 2023 On 3/23/2021 at 4:47 PM, other one said: can people actually agree on what the tribulation time is. No they cannot, or will not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted May 12, 2023 On 4/25/2023 at 10:53 AM, iamlamad said: Where you are MISSING IT. 1 Thes. 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thes. 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do. HOW can we "ever be with the Lord?" The answer is simple: by way of the rapture or being caught up. Since we are to be caught up before wrath, it is indeed a comfort. In chapter 5, HOW can we "live together with Him?" The answer is simple: by way of the rapture or being caught up. But in chapter 5, Paul wrote "to obtain salvation." In other words, to be raptured. Since we are to be caught up before wrath, it is indeed a comfort. Paul is repeating the rapture again in chapter 5, first to show us he has not quit writing of the rapture, but second to show us that events in chapter 5 happen at the same time. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. [WHEN are people saying "peace and safety?" They are saying this just before the rapture events. WHEN will this "sudden destruction hit? It will hit a moment after the dead in Christ are raised.] 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. 7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, [Paul is connecting his "sudden destruction" with God's wrath. Paul is writing a paradigm: bringing up two different groups of people to show us the different outcome between "we" and "us" and "they" and "them:" those who live in the light of the gospel, and those who don't. A moment after the rapture, TWO different groups of people get TWO very different results. Those living in the light get caught up, and get to "live together with Him" (So shall we ever be with the Lord) while those living in the darkness get "sudden destruction," which will come with God's wrath.] 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. [We get to live together with Him by being caught up.] The Day of the Lord BEGINS (God begins to get angry so officially begins the DAY of His wrath) at the 6th seal. A few days later, at the 7th seal, THE BOOK gets opened which will reveal the 70th week of Daniel, written INSIDE the book. The first thing read inside is that seven angels get their trumpets. God's wrath then begins to be FELT on earth as the first trumpet judgment sounds. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 Isn't A Pre-Tribulation Rapture, Dont Be Deceived The main scripture used by supporters of the (Pre-Trib Rapture) is 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, this is nothing more than the (Second Coming) (Last Day) resurrection, not a (Pre-Trib Rapture), don't be deceived 1. Is a resurrection of the believer seen in 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, 100% Yes! 2. Does this resurrection take place on the (Last Day) as Jesus Christ taught below in John 6:39-40, 100% Yes! 3. Is the (Last Day) the time of final judgement as Jesus Christ taught in John 12:48 below, 100% Yes! Many deny the truth of Gods words below, that are simple, clear, and very easy to understand. (THE SECOND COMING, LAST DAY RESURRECTION) 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17KJV 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (THE LAST DAY RESURRECTION) John 5:28-29KJV 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. John 6:39-40KJV 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. (THE LAST DAY JUDGEMENT) John 12:48KJV 48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Marsh Posted May 12, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 126 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 2,087 Content Per Day: 0.57 Reputation: 500 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/03/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/15/1956 Share Posted May 12, 2023 nothing to say 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted May 13, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 13, 2023 17 hours ago, truth7t7 said: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 Isn't A Pre-Tribulation Rapture, Dont Be Deceived The main scripture used by supporters of the (Pre-Trib Rapture) is 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, this is nothing more than the (Second Coming) (Last Day) resurrection, not a (Pre-Trib Rapture), don't be deceived 1. Is a resurrection of the believer seen in 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, 100% Yes! 2. Does this resurrection take place on the (Last Day) as Jesus Christ taught below in John 6:39-40, 100% Yes! 3. Is the (Last Day) the time of final judgement as Jesus Christ taught in John 12:48 below, 100% Yes! Many deny the truth of Gods words below, that are simple, clear, and very easy to understand. (THE SECOND COMING, LAST DAY RESURRECTION) 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17KJV 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (THE LAST DAY RESURRECTION) John 5:28-29KJV 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. John 6:39-40KJV 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. (THE LAST DAY JUDGEMENT) John 12:48KJV 48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. You are free to believe as you do. Let's just wait and see how your beliefs work out for you. For me, I am praying to be found worthy to ESCAPE all these things (the days of tribulation) and to stand before Him. (So shall we ever be with the Lord.) I WILL escape, for I will be found LOOKING for His coming when He will come PRETRIB (just before the start of the Day of the Lord) for His Bride. It will be very easy to be left behind. Just refuse to believe His will come pretrib. Then see what happens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted May 13, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 13, 2023 17 hours ago, truth7t7 said: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 Isn't A Pre-Tribulation Rapture, Dont Be Deceived The main scripture used by supporters of the (Pre-Trib Rapture) is 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, this is nothing more than the (Second Coming) (Last Day) resurrection, not a (Pre-Trib Rapture), don't be deceived 1. Is a resurrection of the believer seen in 1 Thess 4:15-17 below, 100% Yes! 2. Does this resurrection take place on the (Last Day) as Jesus Christ taught below in John 6:39-40, 100% Yes! 3. Is the (Last Day) the time of final judgement as Jesus Christ taught in John 12:48 below, 100% Yes! Many deny the truth of Gods words below, that are simple, clear, and very easy to understand. (THE SECOND COMING, LAST DAY RESURRECTION) 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17KJV 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (THE LAST DAY RESURRECTION) John 5:28-29KJV 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. John 6:39-40KJV 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. (THE LAST DAY JUDGEMENT) John 12:48KJV 48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. In John chapter 6, WHO was Jesus talking to? He was talking to JEWS. This was long before God put blindness in part upon the Jews and sent Paul to start the Gentile church of today. In Revelation, "at the last day" will be at the 7th bowl that will finish the week. That is when God will raise up all the OLD TESTAMENT saints. The Gentile church of today, on the other hand, was seen safely in heaven before the 70th week began in John's timeline of Revelation. That was the great crowd, too large to number. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted May 13, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted May 13, 2023 (edited) On 5/11/2023 at 10:03 AM, BibleWords said: The Bible does show us Jesus in the throne room of God. The question is asked, “Who is worthy?” John is sad because no one is found worthy. Then John is told not to be sad because The Lamb is there and found worthy to open the seals of the book. The Lamb is Jesus. What do you mean He was in the center of the earth? He was right there, he came forward and took the book. This is John’s vision of the scene in heaven, after the rapture. Of course the rapture hasn’t happened yet today, but this is a vision of the future. Quote The Bible does show us Jesus in the throne room of God. Yes, it does in 5:6, but there He has JUST ARRIVED. Go ahead, TRY and find Him in Chapter 4. If you find Him there, so me the verse. ( I noticed that you did not even try to answer the questions Jesus asked me.) Quote John is sad because no one is found worthy. Jesus asked me about that: "If you read ahead, I was found worthy. Why was I not found worthy in that first search John watched?" I hope you will try and answer this question. Quote Then John is told not to be sad because The Lamb is there and found worthy to open the seals of the book. Get the whole picture. John just watched a search for one worthy to take the book and open the seals, but NO MAN WAS FOUND. That search ended. There was no where else to search. This angel search in heaven, on earth and under the earth. You must include TIME and TIMING when you read this. TIME PASSES as John weeps. Why do you think God included that John wept MUCH? It is to show us that TIME was passing. It is not written word for word, but God is telling us that ANOTHER SEARCH was started, after that first search failed. I suspect that this search for one worthy began when Jesus died. No one knows how many times this angel searched. 5:5 Then one of the elders said to me, “Do not weep! See, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has triumphed. He is able to open the scroll and its seven seals.” What did Jesus triumph over that caused Him to then be found worthy to open the seals, when BEFORE He triumphed, He was NOT found worthy? The answer is simple: He rose from the dead—He triumphed over death. And then He was found worthy. It seems apparent that written on the outside of this book was instructions as to WHO would be qualified to open the seals. My guess is, it had to be someone who could conquer death with His own power. Don't miss this truth: at one point in time Jesus was NOT found worthy to open the seals, but later WAS found worthy. Quote What do you mean He was in the center of the earth? Sorry, I should have used John's words, He was "under the earth." The truth is, hell is FAR "under" the earth. But it is not in the center. Quote He was right there, he came forward and took the book. True, after He was NOT SEEN in the throne room, and after He was NOT FOUND in that first search, and after He WAS FOUND in a subsequent search, and after He ascended. Then He was back in the throne room. Quote This is John’s vision of the scene in heaven, after the rapture. This is a myth. John does not see the raptured church in heaven until chapter 7, as that crowd too large to number. Your timing is WAY off. John GIVES US the timing by understanding chapters 4 & 5. Jesus got the book and began opening the seals the MOMENT after He ascended. Here are the clues: 1. Jesus NOT SEEN in the throne room in chapter 4. 2. The Holy Spirit STILL in the throne room in chapter 4. 3. Jesus NOT FOUND in a search for someone to open the seals. 4: Jesus THEN found in another search after time had passed. 5. Jesus ascended and entered the throne room where He had not been seen for the past 32 or 33 years. 6. Jesus took the book as soon as He ascended. 7: Jesus begin right then, opening the seals. So at that time, the church was JUST STARTED. You imagine the rapture of the church, but John and the Holy Spirit are way back around 32 AD. If you wish to see heaven AFTER the rapture, read about the great crowd, too large to number. Edited May 13, 2023 by iamlamad 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted May 13, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted May 13, 2023 (edited) 5 hours ago, iamlamad said: You are free to believe as you do. Let's just wait and see how your beliefs work out for you. For me, I am praying to be found worthy to ESCAPE all these things (the days of tribulation) and to stand before Him. (So shall we ever be with the Lord.) I WILL escape, for I will be found LOOKING for His coming when He will come PRETRIB (just before the start of the Day of the Lord) for His Bride. It will be very easy to be left behind. Just refuse to believe His will come pretrib. Then see what happens. The only place a pre-trib rapture is found is in a "Tim La Haye" (Left Behind) Sci-Fi movie, because it's not in the bible In Love, Jesus Is The Lord Edited May 13, 2023 by truth7t7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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