Waggles Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,790 Content Per Day: 0.77 Reputation: 983 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/20/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 hours ago, David1701 said: YEC, as you call it, is simply believing what the Bible says about creation. Anything else is refusing to believe it, no matter what spin you might want to place on that. No - YEC - is a doctrinal point of view promulgated by mediaeval Roman Catholicism. The original Hebrew does not unequivocally state that each day in Genesis was a 24 hour day. Not at all. And given that three "days" occurred before the creation of the Sun and Moon that is certainly problematic. Neither does the Hebrew state that Genesis 2 is a retelling of Genesis 1. People are blinded by zealous adherence to their Sunday School stories. And Cain did not marry his sister for in scripture no sister is described. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.90 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Waggles said: No - YEC - is a doctrinal point of view promulgated by mediaeval Roman Catholicism. The original Hebrew does not unequivocally state that each day in Genesis was a 24 hour day. Not at all. And given that three "days" occurred before the creation of the Sun and Moon that is certainly problematic. Neither does the Hebrew state that Genesis 2 is a retelling of Genesis 1. People are blinded by zealous adherence to their Sunday School stories. And Cain did not marry his sister for in scripture no sister is described. Modern YEC, regardless if started by the RCC, was reinvigorated by the SDA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.90 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 5 hours ago, David1701 said: How arrogant can you get! It's this kind of condescending attitude (putting your scientific "knowledge" above the Bible and those who believe it) that often puts Bible believers off science altogether (sadly). YEC, as you call it, is simply believing what the Bible says about creation. Anything else is refusing to believe it, no matter what spin you might want to place on that. Arrogance is dismissing entire branches of science with a wave of their hand. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamjedgar Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 193 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 68 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/13/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) I have skipped over a couple of pages before replying here...i hope i dont repeat something that someone who wrote in those pages i skipped! I see the following issues regarding any evolutionary theory in Christianity... 1. Evolution states categorically that man evolved from animals! 2. God specifically states, he formed Man out of the dust of the ground and breathed life into him directly... 7Then the LORD God formed man from the dust of the ground and breathed the breath of life into his nostrils, and the man became a living being. There is simply no room in either world view for the other...they are completely at odds with each other. Theistic evolution is incompatible with the Bible and there is no way to resolve this dilemma without stating that certain passages of the Bible are wrong (which in itself defeats the belief in the inerrancy of the Bible and its author) here is another real problem for theistic evolution... “In no sense… can the Neanderthal bones be regarded as the remains of a human being intermediate between men and apes. At most, they demonstrate the existence of a man… somewhat toward the pithecoid type… the Neanderthal cranium… forms… the extreme term of a series leading gradually from it to the highest and best developed of human crania” (Huxley 1863, p. 149). Edited November 19, 2021 by adamjedgar 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1701 Posted November 19, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.51 Reputation: 3,524 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2021 1 hour ago, teddyv said: Arrogance is dismissing entire branches of science with a wave of their hand. It is NOT dismissing entire branches of science! It is believing what the Bible says, when that conflicts with the positions of certain scientists (usually atheists, although some professing Christian scientists also get caught up in their unbelieving hypotheses). In any matter on which the Bible gives us information, "science" must be subordinate to that revelation, not vice versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted November 20, 2021 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 776 Content Per Day: 0.83 Reputation: 332 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted November 20, 2021 5 hours ago, Waggles said: No - YEC - is a doctrinal point of view promulgated by mediaeval Roman Catholicism. Hogwash. Adam knew of a created earth because he was there. Moses knew the earth was created in its maturity because God told him so. Jesus, who was actually there, believed in the Scriptures as written, including the fourth commandment. It wasn't until people started espousing the notion of long ages that there was ever a designation of YEC or OEC. 5 hours ago, Waggles said: The original Hebrew does not unequivocally state that each day in Genesis was a 24 hour day. When Yom is used with evening and morning or as part of numbered days, it means a single day every time without exception. Your claim is quite simply false. There was light. Light shone on the earth until the third day when the sun was created to shine on the earth. You are promoting a false doctrine that the Lord said "Let there be light" and there wasn't until the third day.... because the star we call the sun is the only possible light source and it had to be exactly the same on day one as on day three. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted November 20, 2021 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 776 Content Per Day: 0.83 Reputation: 332 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted November 20, 2021 3 hours ago, teddyv said: Arrogance is dismissing entire branches of science with a wave of their hand. Wisdom is understanding that the study of the natural world (science) can neither prove nor disprove anything supernatural. If God created Adam, an adult man, with a physiology equal to a 22 year old, how old was Adam one second after his creation? If it takes a tree five years to produce fruit and God created trees bearing fruit on day three, how old are the trees on day four? If God creates a rock on day one that would radiometrically date to 10 million years old, how old is that rock on day three? If God raises a man from the dead after three days of being in desert heat, shouldn't his body be decomposed? The Bible lists 333 miracles, all of which are contrary to the laws of science. How, then, can science study them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted November 20, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.90 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2021 2 hours ago, RV_Wizard said: Wisdom is understanding that the study of the natural world (science) can neither prove nor disprove anything supernatural. If God created Adam, an adult man, with a physiology equal to a 22 year old, how old was Adam one second after his creation? If it takes a tree five years to produce fruit and God created trees bearing fruit on day three, how old are the trees on day four? If God creates a rock on day one that would radiometrically date to 10 million years old, how old is that rock on day three? If God raises a man from the dead after three days of being in desert heat, shouldn't his body be decomposed? The Bible lists 333 miracles, all of which are contrary to the laws of science. How, then, can science study them? So in your opinion, reality is unreliable? Careful you don't have a sperm whale or potted plant land on your head one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1701 Posted November 20, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.51 Reputation: 3,524 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2021 12 hours ago, teddyv said: So in your opinion, reality is unreliable? Careful you don't have a sperm whale or potted plant land on your head one day. Seriously? Are you claiming that God can't, or won't, do miracles? If God works miracles (and He does), then you cannot work out how God brought about creation, by extrapolating backwards, on the basis of natural processes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted November 20, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,084 Content Per Day: 0.67 Reputation: 974 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2021 On 11/8/2021 at 7:31 AM, RV_Wizard said: Early Christians would not be able to differentiate between the sun which shines light on the earth and another light source which did the exact same thing. The Hebrews did. And they were the ones writing down God's word. So that's what matters. As you see, there would be no morning or evening without a sun. This is how we know that the yom mentioned in the creation week are not literal 24 hour days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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