Premillennialism

[enoob57]

1 minute ago, Justin Adams said:

Maybe, but I would like to say for all the readers that removing the Divine Sovereign Love and Power of Yeshua/Jesus, is at the heart of the pre-mil doctrine. A doctrine that has been called Dispentialism and originally was dreamed up by Nelson Darby. Up until 200 years ago, nobody even considered this idea.

I would see this as a bias toward one own point of view... a natural happenstance to one's own studied opinion. However one who holds to a pre mil, pre trib view is not confronted with the spiritualizing of the plain text of Scripture as other opposing views do... and the Darby thing is incorrect as study will show - EARLY PREMILLENNIALISM (ldolphin.org)

[enoob57]

7 minutes ago, Alive said:

The way I think about this is as follows. Christ gave dominion to His Church and where we stand, the Kingdom of God holds sway. We take and declare ground for Him on earth now--whether that is as we conform to His image in sanctification (taking the Land an acre at a time as in Canaan) or over the power of the enemy in situations and places. The enemy has zero place in me--zero authority over me and by extension the Church. That is the invisible Church that pervades this world. Since Pentecost, the Church has taken ground and established an influence over this earth.

On earth as in Heaven--Christ's sovereignty reigns. This is a relative matter. The already, but not yet principle can be applied from the practical POV, but the reality is God reigns now. Nothing can happen that isn't providentially allowed. Satan has no power over God, His Plans or His children. God is God--always.

We are members of the New Man--Second Adam NOW--and have dominion 'In  Christ'. In this sense, that which was lost in Eden was regained by Christ as corporate representative. It is finished!

 

but I don't see how you fit this in this passage as it is clearly divided out  
 

Col 3:1-17

3 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.

8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

13 Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.

14 And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.

15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful.

16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

17 And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.
KJV
 

[Alive]

1 minute ago, enoob57 said:

but I don't see how you fit this into this in this passage as it is clearly divided out  
 

Col 3:1-17

3 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.

8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;

13 Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.

14 And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.

15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful.

16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

17 And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.
KJV
 

What is divided out? How do these scriptures contradict what I stated?

Be specific because it seems you have something in mind.

[enoob57]

Just now, Alive said:

What is divided out? How do these scriptures contradict what I stated?

Be specific because it seems you have something in mind.

I've got to go right now but will address this evening  

[Justin Adams]

13 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

I would see this as a bias toward one own point of view

Just a plain reading of scripture in context and in the time it was written with no man-made doctrines tacked on. Just as the apostles meant it to be read. No church spin and no theological twisting. Just plain scripture as written without 'interpreter's' spin on it all.

[Riverwalker]

On 5/17/2021 at 6:25 AM, Justin Adams said:

First, it espouses the premillennial theory of Christ’s second coming.

First. The rapture is not the second coming.  In the Rapture Jesus does not come back to earth  yet, we meet Him in the air

1 Thess 5:

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

On 5/17/2021 at 6:25 AM, Justin Adams said:

Generally, premillennialists believe that shortly before the second coming the world will be marked by extraordinary tribulation and evil and the appearance of the Anti-Christ. At his coming, Christ will destroy this anti-Christ and believers will be raised from the dead. There will then follow a millennium of peace and order over which Christ will reign with his saints. At the close of this time, Satan will be loosed and the forces of evil will once again be rampant. The wicked will then be raised, and a final judgment will take place in which Satan and all evil ones will be consigned to eternal punishment (Harvey 1964, 151).

And that is pretty much what Revelation 20 Says

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+20&version=NKJV

 

Also this has NOTHING to do with the Jews, at the cross,  the door to all open and God is no longer a respecter of person. There is no Jew Or Gentile anymore

 

[Guest kingdombrat]

3 hours ago, enoob57 said:

When God sets up His kingdom He will rule... thus what I have said stands...

Do you believe Christ is Reigning and Ruling by Spirit, currently?

[Justin Adams]

36 minutes ago, Riverwalker said:

And that is pretty much what Revelation 20 Says

That is old history. Not future and the proof text from Thess. will no work either though I know it is used to prop up that false doctrine often. Many texts are cherry picked to use wrongly in this Darby pre-mil case. Just like Rev 20, which is history.

Read my 'Futurism' OP.

Edited May 18, 2021 by Justin Adams

[Riverwalker]

1 minute ago, Justin Adams said:

That is old history. Not future and the proof text from Thess. will no work either though I know it is used to prop up that false doctrine often. Many text are cherry picked to use wrongly in this pre-mil case. Just like Rev 20, which is history.

Really Jesus came back already and I missed it?????

 

DANG!

(come on man!)

[Justin Adams]

16 minutes ago, Riverwalker said:

Really Jesus came back already and I missed it?????

That is the stock fake incredulity phrase. Use another next time.

Yeshua came in Judgement on Jerusalem. Read Josephus. The lord comes and goes as He wills because ALL has been put under His Feet. EVERYTHING. We rule and reign with Him now. He is our High Priest and King. We are His kings and priests on the earth.

21 far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. 22 And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.…

The end of the 'present age' happened at 70AD. The old covenant was destroyed along with Jerusalem. We are now in the New Covenant. 

31 Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. 32 It will not be like the covenant I made with their fathers when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt—a covenant they broke, though I was a husband to them,” declares the LORD.

24 and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, “This is My body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 25 In the same way, after supper He took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood; do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.” 26 For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until He comes.

Edited May 18, 2021 by Justin Adams