Who are the two witnesses in the book of Revelation?

[truth7t7]

6 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

But I thought I was being clear the ‘Holiness’ (God’s Holy Spirit and not THE HOLY SPIRIT) are not the same. 

Mom Gen. 2:7 it is my belief God breathed into this earth His Holiness (a part of Him not given to any other animal NOR angel (which is why Satan hated God and His new creation- they were not given such a gift - but that is another story). This ‘Holy Spirit’ placed in Adam is NOT the HS in Pentecost (Trinity). 

Adam lost His Holiness when he sinned and will only be able to restore it by God at the resurrection. 

The only way to be saved is to believe in Jesus as our Messiah and Savior and receive His HS given at Pentecost- He will enter into us and help us in our sanctification process while on earth, but only God will restore OUR Holy Spirit back into us as it was given to Adam. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by truth7t7

[tatwo]

Part 3 in an abbreviated writing about the "two witnesses" 

Last time we left off it looked like John was setting up the prophetic battle between the “kingdom of God and…the gentiles.” Now let’s move on to Rev. 11:3

"And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth." Rev 11:3 NASB

If it is not some kind of battle, or war like event…why does the angel tell John “I will grant authority to My two witnesses,”...for the same time period...42 months, 1260 days? Likely, just as in the days of the flesh of Yahshua when the “religious outer court dwellers” persecuted and haggard…Him finally killing Him….the same thing that appears to be occurring here?

Notably the time frame 3.5 yrs. of the “two witnesses” is the same time frame Christ worked in His time on earth.

Is this reference to “two witnesses” as two individuals? Not likely…it is the indisputable temple of God, Christ, Head and Body that emerged from Johns measuring or authentication and was then empowered with Christ’s authority. What, no cannot be? You may then say…then to what do we ascribe the terms “two witnesses?”

Try this; the “two witnesses” are character attributes of the temple of God, Christ, Head & Body? We will get to that when we deal with the “olive trees and lampstands” in a bit…I am just introducing this to you in case you had never seen this before.

Now let’s look at the statement “and they will prophesy.” To “prophesy” means they will legitimately represent a testimony and display of Christ’s authority and power…fully clothed in the glory of God…exactly as Christ Yahshua Himself did in the face of religious persecution in His day. This is all taking place on earth in the same fashion as Yahshua Himself did. Can you see the continual typology to Christ in all of this, only now as His Body?

The two witnesses by the way will prophesy and witness in sackcloth. That tells us something of the substance of their prophesying or witnessing. When did the prophets of old prophesy in sackcloth...usually, it said sackcloth and ashes? Typically it is when the picture was one of how dire and extreme the departure from God had become among the people. It is the last-ditch effort to appeal to the people to come out of their deviant ways. That is when sackcloth is the appropriate attire. Concerning the “outer court” it is a visual picture of a beggarly people whose house is on fire, and things are dire and desperate.

This measured and judged people of God will exhibit two characteristics for the same period that the false church, the unbelievers on the temple grounds, the unbelievers in proximity to the real House of God, in that time there will be this conflict.

Tatwo…:)

Edited December 29, 2021 by tatwo

[truth7t7]

13 minutes ago, tatwo said:

This is the third part of an abbreviated writing about the "Two Witnesses." 

Last time we left off it looked like John was setting up the prophetic battle between the “kingdom of God and…the gentiles.” Now let’s move on to Rev. 11:3

"And I will grant authority to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for twelve hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth." Rev 11:3 NASB

If it is not some kind of battle, or war like event…why does the angel tell John “I will grant authority to My two witnesses,”...for the same time period...42 months, 1260 days? Likely, just as in the days of the flesh of Yahshua when the “religious outer court dwellers” persecuted and haggard…Him finally killing Him….the same thing that appears to be occurring here?

Notably the time frame 3.5 yrs. of the “two witnesses” is the same time frame Christ worked in His time on earth.

Is this reference to “two witnesses” as two individuals? Not likely…it is the indisputable temple of God, Christ, Head and Body that emerged from Johns measuring or authentication and was then empowered with Christ’s authority. What, no cannot be? You may then say…then to what do we ascribe the terms “two witnesses?”

Try this; the “two witnesses” are character attributes of the temple of God, Christ, Head & Body? We will get to that when we deal with the “olive trees and lampstands” in a bit…I am just introducing this to you in case you had never seen this before.

Now let’s look at the statement “and they will prophesy.” To “prophesy” means they will legitimately represent a testimony and display of Christ’s authority and power…fully clothed in the glory of God…exactly as Christ Yahshua Himself did in the face of religious persecution in His day. This is all taking place on earth in the same fashion as Yahshua Himself did. Can you see the continual typology to Christ in all of this, only now as His Body?

The two witnesses by the way will prophesy and witness in sackcloth. That tells us something of the substance of their prophesying or witnessing. When did the prophets of old prophesy in sackcloth...usually, it said sackcloth and ashes? Typically it is when the picture was one of how dire and extreme the departure from God had become among the people. It is the last-ditch effort to appeal to the people to come out of their deviant ways. That is when sackcloth is the appropriate attire. Concerning the “outer court” it is a visual picture of a beggarly people whose house is on fire, and things are dire and desperate.

This measured and judged people of God will exhibit two characteristics for the same period that the false church, the unbelievers on the temple grounds, the unbelievers in proximity to the real House of God, in that time there will be this conflict.

Tatwo…:)

Scripture teaches that these (Two Witnesses) in Revelation chapter 11 have literal bodies that die, and lay dead in a literal street in Jerusalem, while a literal world watches in celebration exchanging gifts?

Edited December 29, 2021 by truth7t7

[tatwo]

20 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

Scripture teaches that these (Two Witnesses) in Revelation chapter 11 have literal bodies that die, and lay dead in a literal street in Jerusalem, while a literal world watches in celebration exchanging gifts?

The scripture also teaches that Christ had a literal body that died...and has a literal body known as the "Temple of God" on a literal earth, today.

No problem...

Tatwo...:)

[truth7t7]

29 minutes ago, tatwo said:

The scripture also teaches that Christ had a literal body that died...and has a literal body known as the "Temple of God" on a literal earth, today.

No problem...

Tatwo...:)

That has absolutely nothing to do with the facts presented below 

Scripture teaches that these (Two Witnesses) in Revelation chapter 11 have literal bodies that die, and lay dead in a literal street in Jerusalem, while a literal world watches in celebration exchanging gifts?

[tatwo]

27 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

That has absolutely nothing to do with the facts presented below 

Scripture teaches that these (Two Witnesses) in Revelation chapter 11 have literal bodies that die, and lay dead in a literal street in Jerusalem, while a literal world watches in celebration exchanging gifts?

truth7t7, this is not the first time you have taken me out of context, let me explain.

I am curious, did you actually read the three parts I posted in their entirety? My sense is...that if you had...you would have never made the statement/question to me that you did...unless of course you are unable to understand the principal I am putting forth, if the latter were the case, then a question would be appropriate.

This forum is called "Who are the two witnesses in the book of Revelation?" I am attempting a multiple part look at the first few passages of Revelation 11, so far I am only through vs. 3, not sure how far I will go. In any case I have not yet dealt with vs. 7 that you feel the need to comment on?

Even a cursory look at the 3 parts I posted so far, openly reveal that the witnesses are literally alive in a literal world at that time...nothing in my posts even suggests the contrary.

With references to the "temple of God," "the body of Christ" and the "kingdom of God on earth" apparently not speaking to you in any way as relating to literal bodies, in a literal world at that time...Sir, we do not disagree as you appear to sense...no...we are completely disconnected. 

Discussion on what I posted is expected, that's the hope in posting it. Discussing that which has not been posted or in view, seems distracting at best. Persisting in that behavior gives insight into the character of your soul to the spiritually discerning.

I understand Sir, I understand.

Given what I just posted here to you truth7t7, and what I have encountered in a number of your other posts (personal and others)...it has come into view, that it would be difficult to inspire the life of Christ as a result of sustained interactions with you moving forward?

Tatwo...:)

 

 

 

 

[tatwo]

Part 4 in an abbreviated writing about the "two witnesses"

In regards to prophesying in sackcloth…the House of God, having been judged and authenticated, has a word (prophesying) for the Gentiles, for the unbelievers among them, that word is the strictest word of repentance related to the fact that you have run out of time. God is about to conclude the age, to summarize everything, and this is the last call to those who are occupying the place of the Gentiles, occupying the position associated with unbelief but in proximity to the people of God. So, this is a message of a last call.

Now on to the two olive trees and the two lampstands…

These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth. Revelation 11:4

Before we go any further let’s consider the reference to the “two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth” in Zechariah 4, really the whole chapter but let’s look at 4:11-14.

"Then I said to him, "What are these two olive trees on the right of the lampstand and on its left?" And I answered the second time and said to him, "What are the two olive branches which are beside the two golden pipes, which empty the golden oil from themselves?" So he answered me, saying, "Do you not know what these are?" And I said, "No, my lord." Then he said, "These are the two anointed ones who are standing by the Lord of the whole earth.” Zec. 4:11-14 NASB

A clear connection here to Rev. 11:4…now you really need to do some of the leg work required here on your own to receive a deeper revelation. I say that because I am going to hit the high spots in this connection, only. The picture of the women Zechariah reveals in Ch. 5 is very interesting but beyond the scope of this discussion for now. Let's move to ch. 6

“The word of the LORD also came to me, saying,  10  "Take an offering from the exiles, from Heldai, Tobijah and Jedaiah; and you go the same day and enter the house of Josiah the son of Zephaniah, where they have arrived from Babylon.  11  "Take silver and gold, make an ornate crown and set it on the head of Joshua the son of Jehozadak, the high priest.”  Zec 6:9-11 NASB

What is that? A royal priesthood. If you are sitting on a throne, you are a king; but if you are sitting on the throne as a priest, you are a royal priesthood. Well, that goes perfectly with making a crown of silver and gold and giving it to the priest whose name is Joshua, (Yahshua). If you made a crown of gold, you would give it to the king, and that would have been Zerubbabel. But the crown of silver and gold was given to the son of the high priest.

“12  "Then say to him, 'Thus says the LORD of hosts, "Behold, a man whose name is Branch, for He will branch out from where He is; and He will build the temple of the LORD.  13  "Yes, it is He who will build the temple of the LORD, and He who will bear the honor and sit and rule on His throne. Thus, He will be a priest on His throne, and the counsel of peace will be between the two offices.” Zec 6:12-13 NASB

This is clearly a picture of the Lord Yahshua (Branch) building the temple of God  "His Body" then “sitting and ruling” on His throne as “King, and Priest” a royal priesthood.

If you are following what I am putting up here, you can see that I am attempting to show that it is the “Fullness of Christ, Head & Body” that constitutes the temple of God as measured by John. And the two witnesses are “characteristics” of Christ’s throne in the temple…a “kingly priesthood” A Royal Priesthood of the order of Melchizedek. So the testimony of the two...the two olive trees and the two lampstands...is about the light and about the anointing. They are about those who carry the Spirit of God and whose words come forth by the Spirit of God and bring light.

Tatwo…:)

[truth7t7]

5 hours ago, tatwo said:

With references to the "temple of God," "the body of Christ" and the "kingdom of God on earth" apparently not speaking to you in any way as relating to literal bodies, in a literal world at that time...Sir, we do not disagree as you appear to sense...no...we are completely disconnected. 

Discussion on what I posted is expected, that's the hope in posting it. Discussing that which has not been posted or in view, seems distracting at best. Persisting in that behavior gives insight into the character of your soul to the spiritually discerning.

I understand Sir, I understand.

Given what I just posted here to you truth7t7, and what I have encountered in a number of your other posts (personal and others)...it has come into view, that it would be difficult to inspire the life of Christ as a result of sustained interactions with you moving forward?

Tatwo...:)

 

 

 

 

In Love

Once again, your claims above have absolutely nothing to do with the facts presented below 

Scripture teaches that these (Two Witnesses) in Revelation chapter 11 have literal bodies that die, and lay dead in a literal street in Jerusalem, while a literal world watches in celebration exchanging gifts?

[Marilyn C]

18 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Sorry but I am not sure I am following you here..

Charlie 

God sent his Holy Spirit in the time of the OT saints and certain ones had the Spirit come UPON them to enable them to do certain things - prophecy, rule, etc However it was not until Jesus actually went to His Father that He was able to send the Holy Spirit with His divine nature to be WITHIN believers. 

We are being made like Christ, but that couldn`t happen before He was a man on earth. For now we have His nature that overcame sin and the devil, being developed within by His Holy Spirit. 

Hope that is clearer.

[tatwo]

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

God sent his Holy Spirit in the time of the OT saints and certain ones had the Spirit come UPON them to enable them to do certain things - prophecy, rule, etc However it was not until Jesus actually went to His Father that He was able to send the Holy Spirit with His divine nature to be WITHIN believers. 

We are being made like Christ, but that couldn`t happen before He was a man on earth. For now we have His nature that overcame sin and the devil, being developed within by His Holy Spirit. 

Hope that is clearer.

Nicely put Marilyn C.

Tatwo...:)