The MARK of the Beast is literal

[Pilgrim7]

Hi again Mark,

Looks like I continue to surprise you, or not to surprize you? What you write is true, those who have the mark, that of obedience to man rather that God, who worship according to the traditions of man rather than God, will not be able to buy and sell. Their accounts will be frozen and they will have no jobs.

It always amazes me that Christians always take Revelation Literaly when the book itself states that God wrote it in signs and symbols. I mean are we really talking about a real beast, or a real whore? Which whore, there are millions on the streets. If the Beast is symbolic and the Whore is symbolic, how can the mark be other than symbolic. It is real, but not any more a physical mark that the Beast is a physical animal.

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified [it] by his angel unto his servant John: (to signify means to relate it in signs and symbols)

1:2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

1:3 Blessed [is] he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time [is] at hand. (another interesting point and something to be taken literally. It all began in John's time.)

Parables, the subject of another thread, are also taken literally, when they are symbolic stories, not lies, employed by God to teach Spiritual truths. Yet Spiritual things are Spiritually discerned.

Now we get to the substance of the Beast, and that is to symbolize or not take literal the the rest of the Bible which is to be taken literally. To spiritualize certain passages that speak of the perseverance and endurance required to enter the kingdom and explain them away. This type of 'exegesis' is what developed the 'Beast' power', "Mystery Babylon" back in the time of John. Yes and it is still with us today. Not to worry though, very soon now the 'Beast' is to be destroyed.

God bless you my Brother,

Dennis

[Guest It_could_be_today_we_leave]

I believe the mark that will required will be a person's SS#. This will be added to whatever the symbol that will signify "the beast and his #. It will probably be invisibly lasered on the "right hand" or if no right hand is available it will be the "forhead" This will be to be able to buy or sell. A person will go to a checkout and a scanner will be used to access their accounts. This will be brought about in the beginning I think as a "great idea" to make people think (in the beginning) no more being robbed because there will no longer be actual funds that are carried around. It will be that when a person earns money it will be automatically put into this account. A person will never see their actual money again. The believers of prophecy will be the ones to know that this is the "mark" of the one world leader and government. It will be that nothing can be done without it. That is when Christians will be going underground to survive as their lives will be threatened and taken if they don't comply with the "new world order" Scriptures states that people will be actually beheaded for not denouncing Christ and receiving the "mark". Non-believers will go along with this as "life will go on" and "it's just the way things are" People are not going to want to give up their homes, cars, property, jobs etc. thus they will allow the "mark" to be implanted. Satan is very deceptive and comes as an "angel of light" Believers will know that this the "prophacized mark" and the meaning of accepting it. This is when we as believers will be martyered for our Lord....Allelujah!!

I believe that only the true b

You are forgetting that

[CarolineS]

The beast is an organization or system that receives its power from Satan. It is Satan that is thrown into the lake of fire.

The harlot in chapter 17 represents an apostate church that utters blasphemy and leads people away from Jesus. A woman in scripture represents a church.

The harlot is riding the beast in chapter 17 which represents a church state union. That is why the harlot is riding the beast.

Babylon represents everything that is against God. It is a worldly system that believers are to stay out of.

Do you really think Satan is going to line people up and say take this mark or die? He is alot more subtle than that. He isn't going to be so blatant.

In Christ,

CarolineS

[other one]

The beast is an organization or system that receives its power from Satan. It is Satan that is thrown into the lake of fire.

The harlot in chapter 17 represents an apostate church that utters blasphemy and leads people away from Jesus. A woman in scripture represents a church.

The harlot is riding the beast in chapter 17 which represents a church state union. That is why the harlot is riding the beast.

Babylon represents everything that is against God. It is a worldly system that believers are to stay out of.

Do you really think Satan is going to line people up and say take this mark or die? He is alot more subtle than that. He isn't going to be so blatant.

In Christ,

CarolineS

Yep, I sure do... and the number of us that say no will be so great that John could not fathom the words for such a number, so he just told us that there are more than can be numbered coming out of that time of tribulation.

[CarolineS]

I think the beast is a nation, power, or system that will be present in the last days. It may have a man at the top who speaks for it. But it receives it's power from Satan, the dragon. I don't think we are to be looking for one person to arise, like some dictator, who is going to enforce some mark. Scripture does't teach that.

CarolineS

[Pilgrim7]

MARK,

Just because something is not literal does not mean that it is not real. The 'Mark' is real, the beast is real, the whore is real, just not literal, meaning that it isn't a literal animal, it isn't a literal woman and it isn't a literal war with guns and bullets. Please read the whole post carefully before you reply. I clearly stated that it was real. To take it literally means that it needs to be a literal animal, a literal whore and a literal mark or sign of some sort. A Compurter chip is not a literal interpretation of the text. The 'mark' is not the number.

Here again you make my point, it is not a physical war, which would be the literal interpretation, but a Spiritual war which is not literal, although very real. You wrote:

"we are at SPIRITUAL WAR---AND ITS REAL---not symbolic."

Symbolic means that the word used stands for something else which is very real. In Prophecy, a 'beast' stands for a kingdom or political Power. A 'woman' stands for a church or religion. A 'whore' stands for an apostate 'religion'. A 'mark or sign' stands for the 'main identifying characteristic' of that 'system' whether it be political or religoius. Here we have an 'apostate religion' which controls 'political power' and uses that power to inforce its 'laws and worship system' directly contrary to God's 'laws and worship system'. The word 'name' stands for, 'position, character or authority'. The 'number' of His name is the 'value or essence' of His position as head of this religious/political system.

In Biblical numerology, six is the number of man. 666 is the trinity of man in place of God. It is man standing in the place of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. One takes the number of the beast when they are part of a worship system in which Man stands in the place of God. This is Called Blasphemy. In this 'Mystery Babylon' system, a man stands in the place of God. He calls himself the 'Holy Father', He calls Himself the 'Vicar of Christ' and he claims the position of the Holy Spirit as the 'infalable interpreter of Scripture'. The trinity of man in place of God.

Here Pauls warns us of this 'false system of Worship', all very real:

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God (Father, Son and Holy Spirit), or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple (church, claiming to be the head of Christianity) of God, shewing himself that he is God.

All very real. All symbolized perfectly in Revelation and here in Thessalonians.

Again you wrote:

"I have to remember that you are not Ruah Brit(denise), cause she does the same thing you have just done here."

Is this really necessary in order to make your point? I know that you have never considered this point, but there could be some here who understand better than you. The word of God should be all that is needed to make your point.

What does Adam have to do with this point. I think that we all understand that Adam died. He died 930 years after He was created. The point I think you are referring to is that I stated when He sinned, he died spiritually and needed to be redeemed and infused with the Spirit of God through the 'new birth' just as we all have to.

God Bless you,

Dennis

Edited October 26, 2005 by Pilgrim7

[Mikeyjay]

[fenwar]

The mark is not the number?

Re 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Which to John's original readers meant exactly one thing: Nero.

The mark is the number, in so much as it is Nero's name. Those who pledged their allegiance to the name of Nero obviously didn't literally scrawl it across their foreheads or on their wrists - but in God's eyes they might as well have.

[Wendie]

[i belive it will be a microchip . Thier doing it to the troops to keep track of them . I belive thats what it will be . Its in a shot . its really not all that simple . Keeps all data on . What your name is wher you were born . all prevess address ,the car you drive , what you buy ,your ssn , marrage liseens, what medds your on ,.

[Pilgrim7]

Wendie,

A microchip has nothing to do with worship. The essence of the mark of the beast is that it shows who we worship, the God of this world, or the God who created all. God has given a sign between himself and those who he sanctifies or makes holy. God's true children are made holy by God himself. To be sanctified means to be set apart for a holy use, to do holy things. Thus the person who is holy will do all that God says is holy. If you search the scriptures you will find all the things that God calls Holy. He calls His Law holy, He calls His Sabbath Holy, He calls His Son Holy, He calls His Spirit Holy. Those who are sanctified will do those things, they will be part of their worship.

A microchip is only an identity and tracking device. It can be used to follow people, but cannot determine who we worship.

There are two marks or signs that show who we worship. Those who are born again, recreated in the image of God, will worship on the day the Creator, Jesus, created and made holy for mankind, the 7th day Sabbath, when He created them in His image. Those who are not born again will worship on the day that man created, Sunday, showing that they esteem the creation of men above the creation of God.

God bless,

Dennis