Is the Beast in Daniel 7 the same Empires as Dan 2?

[Marilyn C]

5 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

The 1260, 1290 and 1335 mean what I say they mean, Gid doesn't change in MID STREAM, if one means 1290 days before the Second Coming then ALL THREE mean the same thing, and I prove it via scriptures. What I find is people are too entrenched in their own ideas, thus it clouds their judgments when presented with facts because it explodes their ideas they are invested in. 

 

God Bless.

Now where does it say `BEFORE THE SECOND COMING!` 

[Revelation Man]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Now where does it say `BEFORE THE SECOND COMING!` 

Daniel 10, 11 and 12 are all one continual vision. So, lets just look at it this way, in full. You can skip the scriptures of Dan. 11:36-45. I am just making this visual where it might just trigger an observational point of access missed heretofore. Daniel 12 however tells the story of the Dan. 11:36-45 Anti-Christ.

The Anti-Christ conquers Israel and THE MANY

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done. 37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all. 38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things. 39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

The Anti-Christ's actually Conquering seen here: BELOW:

40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, AND many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.(Petra/Bozrah area)

42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.

43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.

After the Anti-Christ Conquers, he also comes to his end.

44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

 

Then the vision continues into Daniel chapter 12:

Daniel 12:1-2 shows this is the end times, the last 1260 days on this earth for Satan to rule

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up(Rev. 12), the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation( End Times AGREED? ) even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered(Jesus delivers Israel via the Second Coming AGREED ? ), every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake(Second Coming Judgments), some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. 4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro(Our end time world TRAVELS a lot), and knowledge shall be increased (Knowledge has increased tremendously in the last 150 years, from Horse and Carriages to trains, jets and cars. And the Science has gone bonkers.)

Daniel sees Michael, Gabriel and a Pre Incarnate Jesus

5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two (Angels, Michael & Gabriel see Chapter 10), the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.

6 And one said to the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? {{ What is it that ends the Anti-Christs rule in Dan. 11:45? Jesus' Second Coming, this is a given sister. He will rule for 42 months or 1260 days. Do not nullify what we know today just because Daniel was not given the FULL DETAILS.}}

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. {{ Why do you think we get both a Time, Times and Half in Rev. 12, where Michael stands up, and the 1260 days? Because God wants us to know these are the SAME EVENTS in Dan. 12 and Revelation 12, the times of Great Troubles.}} 

Daniel wants to know more, but Jesus will not tell him any details, for a reason, he did not even tell Daniel about the Anti-Christ per se, earlier on in Dan. 8 and 9 he was told about a Little Horn (a MAN with great power). But just like in verse 7, Jesus only gives him MORE NUMBERS. The first number we know via Logical Deduction that it is about the Anti-Christ of Dan. 11:36-45, because those verses explains how he Conquers Israel (Pleasant Land). Thus when Jesus gives the number that equals 1260 days, then swears that after those 1260 days ALL THESE WONDERS (Anti-Christ in Daniel 11:36-45) WILL END. We know sister this ends via Jesus' Second Coming, don't we? Reading Dan. 12:1-2 tells us this also, its the TIME OF Jacobs troubles, its the VERY END when those who sleep arise to be judged !! It is very clear, but we then get even more tips. Michael stands up to save Israel, just like in Revelation 12 when Israel has to flee Judea.

So, when we see the NUMBERS BELOW in verses 11-12, we know God/Jesus are not changing the formula sister, we are just given two more numbers that are THAT MANY DAYS(1290 & 1335) until ALL OF THESE WONDERS END, Daniel asks the exact same question in verse 8. Now, we easily got who verse 7 was about, so much has been written about the Beasts 42 month or 1260 day rule over Israel. But not many can add up WHO the other two numbers are about. But they are also specific events, just like the Anti-Christ was the 1260, the 1290 and 1335 are SPECIFIC EVENTS and SPECIFIC PEOPLE, who are that many days away from Jesus Christs Second Coming ENDING ALL OF THOSE WONDERS Daniel saw in Daniel 11:36-45.

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. (NOW)

10 Many shall be purified, and made white(Church Age leads to the very END TIMES), and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice(Jesus is our DAILY SACRIFICE) shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up (The AoD Image of the E.U. President), there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. {{ Till all these wonders end as verse 8 SUGGESTS via Daniel's question}}

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. {{The coming Two-witnesses show up BEFORE the DOTL (1260 events) to turn Israel back unto God. They show up 1335 days before ALL THESE WONDERS END via the Second Coming of Jesus. We all know intuitively that Jesus' Second Coming ends all of these end time wonders which Daniel was shown. We just have to accept that it will change our former understandings. }}

13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

So, why not tell Daniel that the 1290 is a Jewish High Priest/False Prophet to come? That's easy (once I thought about it for days, LOL) When Daniel got this Prophesy in 500 BC or so, if God had PLAINLY told him this would be a Jewish High Priest to come, then for the next 500 or so years until 70 AD, the Jewish Leaders fearing the False Prophet to come was in their midst, they would have killed every other High Priest !! Get it now, this is why it had to be cloaked. So why was John told about the False Prophet in 90ish AD? 

Well, Jerusalem had already been sacked, and would not be a nation again for nigh 2000 years !! The 1290 is a Jewish High Priest who forbids the Jews whom have repented from worshiping Jesus in "His Temple" then he will place an IMAGE of the E.U. President up in the Temple (AoD) and that is the SIGN for the Jews to flee Judea. If the Jews had not already repented by this time, none of this could happen. They would not know an E.U. Presidents image in the temple was the AoD, nor would most even care !!

By the way, King Herod tried to kill baby Jesus via the Scriptures, they surly would have tried to kill a coming High Priest False Prophet.

God Bless. Think it through, this is a burden to me, God has shown me deep truths. I am not a book writer per se, I write blogs but not books. So, I just get it our where I can, and unto my hometown patrons of course. 

Edited December 18, 2022 by Revelation Man

[Marilyn C]

1 hour ago, Revelation Man said:

Daniel 10, 11 and 12 are all one continual vision. So, lets just look at it this way, in full. You can skip the scriptures of Dan. 11:36-45 I am just making this visual where it might just trigger an observational point of access missed heretofore. Daniel 12 however tells the story of the Dan. 11:36-45 Anti-Christ.

The Anti-Christ conquers Israel and THE MANY

Daniel 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done. 37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all. 38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things. 39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

The Anti-Christ's actually Conquering seen here: BELOW:

40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, AND many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.(Petra)

42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.

43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.

After the Anti-Christ Conquers, he also comes to his end.

44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many. 45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

 

Then the vision continues into Daniel chapter 12:

Daniel 12:1-2 shows this is the end times, the last 1260 days on this earth for Satan to rule

Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up(Rev. 12), the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation( End Times AGREED? ) even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered(Jesus delivers Israel via the Second Coming AGREED ? ), every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake(Second Coming Judgments), some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. 4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro(Our end time world TRAVELS a lot), and knowledge shall be increased (Knowledge has increased tremendously in the last 150 years, from Horse and Carriages to trains, jets and cars. And the Science has gone bonkers.)

Daniel sees Michael, Gabriel and a Pre Incarnate Jesus

5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two (Angels, Michael & Gabriel see Chapter 10), the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.

6 And one said to the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? {{ What it is that ends the Anti-Christs rule in Dan. 11:45? Jesus' Second Coming, this is a given sister. He will rule for 42 months or 1260 days. Do not nullify what we know today just because Daniel was not given the FULL DETAILS.}}

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen(Jesus), which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. {{ Why do you think we get both a Time, Times and Half in Rev. 12, where Michael stands up, and the 1260 days? Because God wants us to know this is the SAME EVENTS in Dan. 12 and Revelation 12, the times of Great Troubles.}} 

Daniel wants to know more, but Jesus will not tell him any details, for a reason, he did not even tell Daniel about the Anti-Christ per se, earlier on he did say he would be a Little Horn (a MAN with great power). But just like in verse 7, Jesus gives him MORE NUMBERS, and the first number we know via Logical Deduction that it is about the Anti-Christ of Dan. 11:36-45, because those verses explains how he Conquers Israel (Pleasant Land). Thus when Jesus gives the number that equals 1260 days, then swears that after those 1260 days ALL THESE WONDERS (Anti-Christ in Daniel 11:36-45) WILL END. We know sister this ends via Jesus' Second Coming, don't we? Reading Dan. 12:1-2 tells us this also, its the TIME OF Jacobs troubles, its the VERY END when those who sleep arise to be judged !! It is very clear, but we then get even more tips. Michael stands up to save Israel, just like in Revelation 12 when Israel has to flee Judea.

Hi Rev. Man,

Thank you for taking the time to do such a detailed explanation. Now this first part of your comments I agree with. Will address the next part separately.

Marilyn,

[Marilyn C]

2 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

 

 

 

So, when we see the NUMBERS BELOW, God/Jesus are not changing the formula sister, we are just given two more numbers that are THAT MANY DAYS until ALL OF THESE WONDERS END, Daniel asks the exact same question in verse 8. Now, we easily got who verse 7 was about, so much has been written about the Beasts 42 month or 1260 day rule over Israel. But not many can add up WHO the other two numbers are about. But they are also specific events, just like the Anti-Christ was the 1260, the 1290 and 1335 are SPECIFIC EVENTS and SPECIFIC PEOPLE, who are that many days away from Jesus Christs Second Coming ENDING ALL OF THOSE WONDERS Daniel saw in Daniel 11:36-45.

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. (NOW)

10 Many shall be purified, and made white(Church Age leads to the very END TIMES), and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice(Jesus is our DAILY SACRIFICE) shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up (The AoD Image of the E.U. President), there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. {{ Till all these wonders end as verse 8 SUGGESTS via Daniel's question}}

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. {{The coming Two-witnesses show up BEFORE the DOTL (1260 events) to turn Israel back unto God. They show up 1335 days until ALL THESE WONDERS END via the Second Coming of Jesus. We all know intuitively that Jesus' Second Coming end all of these end time wonders Daniel was shown. We just have to accept it changes our former understandings. }}

13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

So, why not tell Daniel that the 1290 is a Jewish High Priest/False Prophet to come? That's easy (once I thought about it for days, LOL) When Daniel got this Prophesy in 500 BC or so, if God had PLAINLY told him this would be a Jewish High Priest to come, then for the next 500 or so years until 70 AD, the Jewish Leaders fearing the False Prophet to come was in their midst, they would have killed every other High Priest !! Get it now, this is why it had to be cloaked. So why was John was told about the False Prophet in 90ish AD? 

Well, Jerusalem had already been sacked, and would not be a nation again for nigh 2000 years !! The 1290 is a Jewish High Priest who forbids the Jews whom have repented from worshiping Jesus in "His Temple" then he will place an IMAGE of the E.U. President up in the Temple (AoD) and that is the SIGN for the Jews to flee Judea. If the Jews had not already repented by this time, none of this could happen. They would not know an E.U. Presidents image in the temple was the AoD, nor would most even care !!

By the way, King Herod tried to kill baby Jesus via the Scriptures, they surly would have tried to kill a coming High Priest False Prophet.

God Bless. Think it through, this is a burden to me, God has shown me deep truths. I am not a book writer per se, I write blogs but not books. So, I just get it our where I can, and unto my hometown patrons of course. 

Hi Rev. Man,

Firstly, I see you have assumed that the extra days are ALL ending at Jesus` second coming.

Whereas they are sequential -

1,260 - anti-Christ`s rule till Jesus comes. (Dan. 12: 7)

1,260+ 30 = 1,290.  anti-Christ`s rule taking away sacrifice and setting up AOD till temple cleansed. (Dan. 12: 11)  

1,290 + 45 = 1,335. the extra 45 days involves a month (30 days) + 15 days, for the Jews to come from all over the world to Jerusalem, (Isa. 66: 20) to celebrate their National deliverance on the 15th of Adar in Jerusalem. (see Esther 9: 18)

The Lord is revealing to Daniel not only how long the anti-Christ rules but further to the cleansing of the Temple and finally to the celebrations of national deliverance. All those scriptures to the end of the chapter are a part of what the Lord is revealing and not just the 1,260 days as you think ending it all.  

All the other details are purely assumption on your part. No one is seeing the EU as the `terrifying beastly power.` Whereas Islam is revealing itself as - deception and cruelty across the world. 

Marilyn.

[abcdef]

On 12/16/2022 at 5:23 PM, Marilyn C said:

Hi abcdef,

I`ll also comment. We are in the times of the Gentiles ruling the world - From Babylon to Islam.

Hi Marilyn,

When did the gentiles not rule the planet?

--

The word "world" has different definitions.

One would be the planet earth,

another might be, the perception of the environment in which the person lives. That would be, "He was at home in the desert world", or "That person lives in his own world in his mind". 

The point is that the image of the material environment of people in the OT and the 1st century regarding the planet and universe were very limited. Remember that people thought that the gods rode in chariots across the sky. They had mountain gods, valley gods, ocean gods, stars for gods, on and on. Most people were totally ignorant of the planet and the universe's make up and shape.

So when the Bible says, "the world", it should be defined which definition fits, the planet or the known world of Israel at the time of the writing of the passage.

----- 

In the context of the NT letters that were written in the 1st century,"the world" from their view was wherever the children of Israel were. The known world of Israel would have been the general area of the Roman Empire and some extended areas such as India.

The rest of the nations outside the known areas would be considered to be the wilderness, of the gentile nations.

An example would be Acts 2:5, "... out of every nation under heaven." 

"Every nation under heaven" in 33 AD., in Jerusalem, meant the known area where the children of Israel live. Not Australia, New Zealand, South or North America, but the known world of Israel at that time which was mainly the Roman Empire and its neighbors.

Another example would be Dan. 2:39 where it says the the brass will "rule over all the earth". But the Greek brass didn't rule the planet, only the known earth of the children of Israel.

In the case of the Antichrist ruling the world, it is not the planet that he rules, but only the children of Israel in the Roman Empire region. The children of Israel flee the known world environment of their time into the unknown wilderness of the gentile nations where Rome does not rule their "world". 

Part of the problem with prophecy is deciding which "world" the passage is referring to. The planet or the viewpoint world of the person writing the passage.

In the Revelation the view of the "world" is from the children of Israel in the 96 AD ish time period and centers on the unbelieving flesh children of Israel and the believing Christian flesh of Israel.

To take the viewpoint that is centered in the world viewpoint of Israel in 96 AD and expand it to make its center about the planet and wilderness gentile nations of the planet changes the meaning of the messages. 

----

Consider this, that the only times when the gentiles did not rule was when the children of Israel were in control of Jerusalem.

Jerusalem, exclusively.

 

On 12/16/2022 at 5:23 PM, Marilyn C said:

1. Yes, we are in the time of the iron/clay feet & toes about to come together under there Ruler.

But the toes/horns do not unite and become one again, they remain separate, are divided by the clay, grow smaller and come to an end.

They are all part of the continual Roman iron (Dan. 2) and are a continuing part of the 4th beast (Dan. 7).

They can only be Roman entities, attached and continual from their original form nation.

When was the year when the Roman iron/clay feet divided into the iron/clay toes and the horns divided from the 4th beast? 

 

On 12/16/2022 at 5:23 PM, Marilyn C said:

The final Gentile Global Government will come together with 10 emirs from Islam halfway through the tribulation. (Rev. 17: 12,  13: 5) 

The toes/horns iron can only be Roman, as they have been from the beginning of the iron.

 

On 12/16/2022 at 5:23 PM, Marilyn C said:

2. God has judged all the past rulers of the world kingdoms and those governments are no more. Yes, land and people are still here, but God was & is dealing with World GOVERNMENTS/RULERS.

Since the center of the scriptures is Jesus and the children of Israel, the gentiles nations are primarily seen as enemies or animals, mentioned in passing, to the overall timeline of the gospel salvation eternal message.

 

On 12/16/2022 at 5:23 PM, Marilyn C said:

The rapture is very, very close. Look to the Lord and trust Him.

Marilyn.

The anchor of the timeline for us is the restoration of Jerusalem in 1967.

That was 55 years ago ish.

One thought that I have is that this generation of Israel has had the opportunity to accept the salvation gospel kingdom or not accept it.

It's kind of the same situation as when the gospel was preached in the time of the apostles. A dangerous situation with consequences for the children of Israel and salvation.

--

Soon we will see, if we are still alive, the battle of Armageddon begin.

The war of Armageddon has already begun. The battle of Armageddon is only the very last battle in the war before 1967 restored Jerusalem is surrounded and falls.

The armies from across the Euphrates are already crossing the river to attack Jerusalem.

Because these things about Israel and Jerusalem are being revealed now, it is another sign that the end of the material planet/world is here, Rev 10:7.

We are not waiting for things of the Rev to begin, we are at the end of Rev 20:9.

----

[Marilyn C]

2 hours ago, abcdef said:

Hi Marilyn,

When did the gentiles not rule the planet?

--

The word "world" has different definitions.

One would be the planet earth,

another might be, the perception of the environment in which the person lives. That would be, "He was at home in the desert world", or "That person lives in his own world in his mind". 

The point is that the image of the material environment of people in the OT and the 1st century regarding the planet and universe were very limited. Remember that people thought that the gods rode in chariots across the sky. They had mountain gods, valley gods, ocean gods, stars for gods, on and on. Most people were totally ignorant of the planet and the universe's make up and shape.

So when the Bible says, "the world", it should be defined which definition fits, the planet or the known world of Israel at the time of the writing of the passage.

----- 

In the context of the NT letters that were written in the 1st century,"the world" from their view was wherever the children of Israel were. The known world of Israel would have been the general area of the Roman Empire and some extended areas such as India.

The rest of the nations outside the known areas would be considered to be the wilderness, of the gentile nations.

An example would be Acts 2:5, "... out of every nation under heaven." 

"Every nation under heaven" in 33 AD., in Jerusalem, meant the known area where the children of Israel live. Not Australia, New Zealand, South or North America, but the known world of Israel at that time which was mainly the Roman Empire and its neighbors.

Another example would be Dan. 2:39 where it says the the brass will "rule over all the earth". But the Greek brass didn't rule the planet, only the known earth of the children of Israel.

In the case of the Antichrist ruling the world, it is not the planet that he rules, but only the children of Israel in the Roman Empire region. The children of Israel flee the known world environment of their time into the unknown wilderness of the gentile nations where Rome does not rule their "world". 

Part of the problem with prophecy is deciding which "world" the passage is referring to. The planet or the viewpoint world of the person writing the passage.

In the Revelation the view of the "world" is from the children of Israel in the 96 AD ish time period and centers on the unbelieving flesh children of Israel and the believing Christian flesh of Israel.

To take the viewpoint that is centered in the world viewpoint of Israel in 96 AD and expand it to make its center about the planet and wilderness gentile nations of the planet changes the meaning of the messages. 

----

Consider this, that the only times when the gentiles did not rule was when the children of Israel were in control of Jerusalem.

Jerusalem, exclusively.

 

But the toes/horns do not unite and become one again, they remain separate, are divided by the clay, grow smaller and come to an end.

They are all part of the continual Roman iron (Dan. 2) and are a continuing part of the 4th beast (Dan. 7).

They can only be Roman entities, attached and continual from their original form nation.

When was the year when the Roman iron/clay feet divided into the iron/clay toes and the horns divided from the 4th beast? 

 

The toes/horns iron can only be Roman, as they have been from the beginning of the iron.

 

Since the center of the scriptures is Jesus and the children of Israel, the gentiles nations are primarily seen as enemies or animals, mentioned in passing, to the overall timeline of the gospel salvation eternal message.

 

The anchor of the timeline for us is the restoration of Jerusalem in 1967.

That was 55 years ago ish.

One thought that I have is that this generation of Israel has had the opportunity to accept the salvation gospel kingdom or not accept it.

It's kind of the same situation as when the gospel was preached in the time of the apostles. A dangerous situation with consequences for the children of Israel and salvation.

--

Soon we will see, if we are still alive, the battle of Armageddon begin.

The war of Armageddon has already begun. The battle of Armageddon is only the very last battle in the war before 1967 restored Jerusalem is surrounded and falls.

The armies from across the Euphrates are already crossing the river to attack Jerusalem.

Because these things about Israel and Jerusalem are being revealed now, it is another sign that the end of the material planet/world is here, Rev 10:7.

We are not waiting for things of the Rev to begin, we are at the end of Rev 20:9.

----

Hi a.......,

Rather a long reply there. Israel at one time was the major power on the earth in King David and King Solomon`s time.

As God wrote His word I do believe he knows what He is saying. And IF you would read what God said to the King of Babylon then you would realise that God gave the King the whole world everywhere, however it is just that the King only attended to the known world, (as you say.) (Dan. 2: 37 & 38)

As to Rome well God judged that government and it is no more. Today the EU is not terrifying anyone, but has great troubles of its own. The real terrifying power is already marching across the world, killing, torturing, beheading, raping, etc etc

Marilyn.

 

[Revelation Man]

On 12/17/2022 at 6:37 PM, Marilyn C said:

Hi Rev. Man,

Firstly, I see you have assumed that the extra days are ALL ending at Jesus` second coming.

Whereas they are sequential -

1,260 - anti-Christ`s rule till Jesus comes. (Dan. 12: 7)

1,260+ 30 = 1,290.  anti-Christ`s rule taking away sacrifice and setting up AOD till temple cleansed. (Dan. 12: 11)  

1,290 + 45 = 1,335. the extra 45 days involves a month (30 days) + 15 days, for the Jews to come from all over the world to Jerusalem, (Isa. 66: 20) to celebrate their National deliverance on the 15th of Adar in Jerusalem. (see Esther 9: 18)

The Lord is revealing to Daniel not only how long the anti-Christ rules but further to the cleansing of the Temple and finally to the celebrations of national deliverance. All those scriptures to the end of the chapter are a part of what the Lord is revealing and not just the 1,260 days as you think ending it all.  

All the other details are purely assumption on your part. No one is seeing the EU as the `terrifying beastly power.` Whereas Islam is revealing itself as - deception and cruelty across the world. 

Marilyn.

I am telling you what they are. You will understand once you get to heaven, but by that time it will be too late to save people or to  help people understand what is coming. So, we have to get it right now, not later. 

Israel accepting Jesus and worshiping him thereby cleanses the temple. The temple was rent because they rejected Jesus. The easy way to see this is true is to look at all the scriptures. I think a quick view without much explanation (been there done that) might help.

My contention, and the plain facts are

The 1335 is the Two-witnesses who show up 1335 days before 2/C.

The 1290 is a Jewish High Priest who takes away Jesus Worship and places the AoD 1290 days before the 2nd Coming.

The 1260 is the Anti-Christ/Beast who goes forth Conquering 1260 days before Jesus Second Coming ends all of these wonders.

DO SCRIPTURES BACK THIS TIMING UP? The 1260 is the DOTL. 

Malachi 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:(1260/DOTL)

6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

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Zechariah 13:8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.

So Israel Repents above: Then the DOTL arrives in the next verse

Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

{{ Above the Anti-Christ conquers Jerusalem at the 1260 event or on the DOTL. Below, Jesus shows up to defeat the Beast 42 months later as he lands on Mt Zion. }}

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

So, Elijah is sent back to get Israel to repent BEFORE the 1260 DOTL events !! (that is why the Two-witnesses are the 1335)

Then we see Israel repents BEFORE the DOTL arrives in Zech. 14:1 via Zech. 13:8-9. 

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Rev. 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

So, the Two-witnesses DIE during the 2nd Woe ends, right before the 3rd Woe (which they have already prayed down) comes. The 3rd Woe comes via the 7th Trump, it brings all 7 Vials.

Rev. 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

In Rev. 16:19, God allows Jesus to destroy all of the Wicked that gathered against Him at Armageddon. So, since both the Beast and the Two-witnesses have 1260 day offices on this earth, as stated by God, if the Beast's rule starts at the 1260 and ends 1260 days later at Jesus' Second Coming, but the Two-witnesses die at the 2nd Woe,  then in order for "Their Ministry" to cover the required 1260 day office ordained by God Himself, that means they have to show up BEFORE the 1260, and they do at the 1335, which is 75 days before the 1260. If the Two-witnesses showed up like the Beast at the 1260 middle of the week but then died at the 2nd Woe, they could not fulfill their 1260 days of Witnessing !! That is why they are the 1335 BLESSING. 

People just can't see once they get other ideas in their heads, which is why God told me He couldn't reach people, "You guys already know it all Ron" 

I took that to heart and stopped my vain glory of my ideas. I had some great ones. But I prefer God's versions now. (SMILE)

Edited December 19, 2022 by Revelation Man

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14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi a.......,

Rather a long reply there.

Yes it was a little long, but you see my point with examples of scriptures.

The planet earth vs. the earth of Israel viewpoint is one major facet in the understanding of prophecy. 

If you say that the words "earth" or "world" always means planet, then the understanding of the events in the timeline becomes distorted, especially in the Revelation.

There are times when world/earth doesn't mean planet, when are those times in the Bible? I gave you 2 examples. There are more if you want.

 

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Israel at one time was the major power on the earth in King David and King Solomon`s time.

On earth, the planet? What about China? India? Japan? The Americas?

Babylon and the statue only show 4 specific gentile nations in their relationship to the children of Israel. Greece did not conquer the entire planet, only the entire "earth/world" known to Israel Dan. 2:39.

Yes, Babylon was the power in the Middle East, but not the planet.

 In the Revelation, some would say planet earth/world, when it should only be the world of where the children of Israel are, centering on Israel and not the gentile planet.

 

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

As God wrote His word I do believe he knows what He is saying. And IF you would read what God said to the King of Babylon then you would realise that God gave the King the whole world everywhere, however it is just that the King only attended to the known world, (as you say.) (Dan. 2: 37 & 38)

God said that the brass kingdom would "bear rule over all the earth". What does "earth" mean in this context? Not the planet.

Notice that it says "all the earth". If it meant planet earth, then Dan 2:39 would not be true, because Greece did not conquer the planet. The Bible is centered on  the "world/earth" of the children of Israel in the time when the passages were written. Beyond the world known to Israel was the gentile wilderness. 

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The events shown in the Revelation and NT are to be centered the same way, on the children of Israel at the time the passage was written.

The Revelation is about what the children of Israel experience, both the unbelieving flesh branches and the believing Christian flesh branches.

One example would be the seals/trumpets timeline. The events shown there happen Exclusively to the unbelieving broken flesh branches of the children of Israel. Other entities are shown in the Revelation such as the Roman beast and gentile spiritual Israel, but the seals/trumpets passages are centered on the unbelieving flesh branches and are not gentile and planet wide.

 

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

As to Rome well God judged that government and it is no more.

Look at the Dan. 2 statue. The iron is continual to the end of the toes. The iron Roman nation cannot stop and start again, that is Impossible or the statue would fall down as it does later.

This fact contradicts the the popular thinking of our time, proving that theory to be untrue. 

As the statue is still standing to this very day, because the stone has not struck yet, it should be obvious and without any doubt that the Roman iron nation has been here and continues to be here until perdition, Rev 17:11.

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The Roman Empire was, is (6th head, 96 AD.), is not (7th head dies, 476 AD), yet it's image is with us even to this day, continual. The 8th is one of the seven that spans centuries from 476 AD (is not), until 2022 AD (yet is).  The beast dominates the children of Israel and not the planet.

 

14 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Today the EU is not terrifying anyone, but has great troubles of its own. The real terrifying power is already marching across the world, killing, torturing, beheading, raping, etc etc

Marilyn.

You mean Russia currently? Islam? China? These things have always been around.

Our center is on the people of Israel, Jerusalem, and the eternal Jerusalem.

I agree that the Islamic nations primarily will be the destroyers of Israel.

The events shown in the 6th trumpet and 6th vial are already taking place. If the events are taking place now, that means that the 6th trumpet has already been blown and the 6th bowl/plague has already begun. (9-11-01)

Look at the events happening right now in the Israel- Iran Islamic war. Could the events shown be happening now? (Yes)

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Consider this, that after the armies march on Jerusalem, the events of the 7 trumpet and 7th plague take place.

If Israel would win the battle of Armageddon, there would be no need for the 7th vial.

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Edited December 18, 2022 by abcdef

[Markie51]

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The image (statue) that Nebuchadnezzar dreamt and the vision (beasts) that Daniel dreamt-during the reign of Nebuchadnezzar’s grandson (Belshazzar) are the same.  Daniel 2:38-40 and 7:4-7 refer to the Babylon, Medo-Persian, Greek and Roman world power/kingdoms.  The beast mentioned at Revelation 17:10 is referring to the same two accounts in Daniel-with the exception of the first two world powers: Egypt and Assyria and the last dual kingdom Great Britain and United States.

When Revelation was penned only one world power was evident: Rome (Revelation 17:10).  The last power, symbolized by the seventh head of the “seven-headed beast,” referred to a future power.  I agree that this specific prophecy of the seventh power/head refers to “end times” only.

The “three kings” that you mentioned were remaining and part of the smaller ten-kingdoms that arose from Rome’s dissolution/fall, but not during Rome’s dominance.-Daniel 7:20.

The small horn (Daniel 7:8) refers to Great Britain of who conquered the three remaining horns: Spain, Netherlands and France.

I do not understand how the “antichrist/s” is relevant in these prophecies.

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On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

Hi Revelation Man,

I'm sorry that I didn't answer you sooner. Sometimes I am gone for days or weeks. I will have to break my responses into pieces for the details.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

Great, you would be surprised at the number of people, when I corner them on a debate point, start saying its numerology,

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

they can understand that God can call the 10 virgin brides the [complete] church

I believe that the story of the 10 virgins really happened at someones wedding. Jesus uses a true event to make a point about the kingdom of heaven, Matt 25:1-13, 1.

The kingdom of heaven began on Pentecost in 33 AD. It is also known as the gospel kingdom of Israel. You and I seem to agree that the 10 virgins represent the kingdom of Israel/church of Israel.

We seem to agree that the numbers used in that passage are symbolic and not literal. That is, more souls than 5 young girls will enter into the wedding between Jesus and the gospel kingdom of Israel/(church).

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We seem to agree that some of the numbers in the Rev have a symbolic meaning, 5, 7, 10, and 144,000 for example.

--

The similar numbers found in Dan. 2 & 7, have similar symbolic meanings, paralleling each other.

You agree that the numbers are not literal, necessarily, but they have a meaning through the symbols presented. That is, it is what the symbols/(numbers) represent that are the message and not the symbols themselves that are the subject.

It is what the 10 virgins represent that is the message, not the 10 virgins themselves, that are the subject of the passage, message.

================

Now try thinking of the 7 times, 3 1/2 times, 42 months, and 1260 days in the Revelation the same way as the 10 virgin symbolism.

They are not literal years. They represent time periods through symbolic numbers. 

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The 7 times are showing the same time period as the statue in Dan. 2, and the 4 beasts of Dan. 7.

The first 3 1/2 times is from Babylon until 70 AD. when Israel was scattered, Dan. 12:7. 

The second 3 1/2 times is from 70 AD until 1967 when Jerusalem was restored and the 2nd part of the times of the gentiles statue came to an end, Lk 21:20-24, 24.

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So the numbers that many thought were literal years are not literal at all. They are symbolic showing a time period of centuries. 

The 7 times equals the time of the statue, from Babylon until 1967.

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The central question for the children of Israel since Babylon always has been, "When will the children of Israel be restored to control of Jerusalem again?"

The statue and the 4 beasts answer that question.

The Revelation answers the question for those after 70 AD., those who are in the second 3 1/2 times.

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Think about it.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

but just can not accept that God can call His Jewish Bride 144,000 Male Virgins with a code also. I mean, to me its obvious that 12 (Fulness) x 12 x 10 (Completeness) x 10 x 10 = ALL Israel who repent or 3.5-5 million end time Jews (Israelites) who repent, we get the number (3.5-5 million) by looking to the 1/3 who repent in Zechariah 13:8-9 vs the 2/3 who refuse to repent and die. God doesn't just chose perfect numbers, thus the 7000 He has saved Himself, the 144,000 and the 1/3 can all mean the same thing, and God can't lie. I got this in full trying to put the book of Revelation in perfect Chronological Order when I understood the Seals are NOT JUDGMENRS but Jesus prophesying what was soon to come, it hit me, my 144,000 understanding now fit perfectly with

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

the Jews fleeing Judea just before the DOTL

Was it a DOTL in 70 AD when Jerusalem and the temple were Destroyed?

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

(Rev. 8 Asteroid) which is God's Wrath.

The Rev 8 passage is centered on the unbelieving flesh broken branches of Israel. 

The events described happen to the broken branches because they rejected the gospel kingdom.

The symbols of the passage describe the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple, the aftermath and 70 AD great scattering, and the continued withdrawing of the blessings of covenant protection on the flesh broken branches.

-- The real asteroid that will soon hit is shown as the stone striking the statue in Dan. 2 and the fire from heaven in Rev 20, after the toes end when Jerusalem is restored, 1967.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

As we can see in Scriptures in many places, Zech. 13:8-9 & 14:1, Malachi 4:5-6 and of course Matt. 24:15-20.

You are confusing some scriptures about the second coming for salvation DOTL, with some that are about the 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem and the temple DOTL.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

This was an idea that some man came up with somewhere over time, provably Herbert W. Armstrong, and it became "legend" all because Rome had two place of power.

All you have to do is look at the statue to see that it has 2 legs, 10 toes, and that it is a continual timeline.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

Well, Greece had two Arms but no one says that means they had two places of power, even though both had many places of power, they ruled far and wide and had many, many sub stations and out posts. There is no division in Rome. To God Rome is Rome. It doesn't transfer to Turkey, and the A.C. is not a Muslim. This is easily proven via the texts in the bible. There are Three Prophetic Descriptors which tell us exactly where this man has to come from, and ALL THREE must e correct because they are Prophesy. So, simply put them all together and see of the all can be possible. Lets do this brother.

1.) He has to have Assyrian Bloodline, so says the Prophet Isaiah in Isaiah chapter 10. 

2.) He has to be born in Greece, so says the Prophet Daniel in Daniel 8:9. In the End Times he waxes great TOWARD the East, the South and Israel. Well, we know he Conquers Israel, so WAXES GREAT TOWARDS = Conquers. So, in this simple Four Way Directional box (Four Generals) God gave us, we can clearly see in this inter-kingdom battle tat the end time Anti-Christ conquers East (Seleucid/Turkey), South (Ptolemy/Egypt) and Israel or the Pleasant Land. This mean he Conquers from the Northwest corridor of the kingdom, or from Greece/Cassander. God gave us the simplest of four way boxes, tells us where he comes from, and we OVERTHINK IT sadly. 

3.) He has to arise out of the Fourth Beasts Head as I show in maps above, this means the E.U. today. And guess what, Greece is in the E.U. See how it all has to interlock? 

This man will be an Assyrian, Northern Iraq, bits of Syria or Tukey, that was the old Assyrian Kingdoms landmass. Turkey and Greece of course have had a common border for eons, their peoples intermingle on that border, so an Assyrian [Turk] Family migrating to Greece 100 to 200 years ago, or even further back is a no brainer tbh. So, that knocks out two of the Prophesies. The third is he must come to power from the E.U. or Europe's 10 that Divided or Divided Europe in general (Complete Europe). And Greece is in the E.U. not in some Islamic Horde that comes together in the End Times. As a matter of fact the bible never says that happens anywhere, that came from men like Joel Richardson and others who are not adding up all of the facts as I just did. WHY do we get a RUNDOWN of every Greek King in Dan. 11 from Alexander the Great to Antiochus (Dan. 11:21-34) and then get the Anti-Christ in Dan. 11:36-45? Because the A.C. will be born in Greece just like Antiochus his forerunner. 

How many Antichrists are there? Many. Antiochus was just one.

Caesar is the Antichrist who destroyed Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD.

All the Caesars and all the Bishops of Rome since the fall of Rome have been Antichrists, Roman beast false prophets.

The timelines are continual.

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If you say that the timelines are not continual, then you are directly going against what the Dan. 2 and Dan. 7 timelines show.

Any theory that contradicts the Dan. 2 & 7 timelines cannot be correct.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

The legs do not represent an East and West Kingdom, that is not of God.

History plainly shows that the Roman iron 4th beast divided into east and west.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

As a matter of fact the bible is about Israel and Israel being under the Dominion of Beast Kingdoms. Rome sacked Israel and Jerusalem in 70 AD,

Yes

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

so something that happened in 286 AD is not relevant to a Beast having Dominion over Israel.

History shows that the division of east and west was totally relevant to the children of Israel. The fact that the Roman Empire divides into 2 parts shows the major beginnings of the deterioration of the Roman power over the children of Israel.

And fulfills the prophetic statements that God made about the iron 4th beast centuries before.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

As a matter of fact you could say in the end that Constantine wanted to use his power convert those in the East to Christianity, the Mortal Wound came when the Church conquered Rome's beliefs of paganism. The Beast is did by 300 AD or so because Rome became a Christian nation, and

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

there can be no Beast anyway, without Israel in the land,

This is a misconception.

All of the beast nations and those of the statue rule over the children of Israel until Jerusalem is restored to Israel.

After Jerusalem is restored, none of the beast nations rule over the children of Israel. The reign of the statue and beasts ends when Jerusalem is restored. 1967

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Consider that the Roman image beast in Rev 16 must deceive the kings of the east to attack Jerusalem, because he does not have the power to do it himself, because he is an image beast, without the "substance" to attack Jerusalem himself.

2013, Vatican recognizes the State of Palestine.

2015, Vatican-Iran treaty.

 

On 12/17/2022 at 7:08 AM, Revelation Man said:

that is why the Ottoman Empire nor the British Empire are named as Beasts over Israel.

CONTINUED............

Rome is the last beast that rules over the children of Israel from 63 BC until 1967, continual until the end. Changing form, but continual.

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