Retrobyter Posted April 22, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 9 Topic Count: 41 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,627 Content Per Day: 1.07 Reputation: 2,461 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/28/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/28/1957 Share Posted April 22, 2023 17 hours ago, Charles R. Sabo said: Great discussion going on here! I love it!! I just want to help to understand this misunderstanding. Mark 14:3-9 is an interruption in the timeline, when John Mark recalled (via Simon Peter) the anointing of Jesus before He proceeded towards His death. John Mark then kept on the timeline beginning in Mark 14:10. Shabbat shalom, Charles. Yes, I'm enjoying this discussion, as well! Yes, that's what Mike Winger called the "Markan sandwich," an insertion of an account within the account. 17 hours ago, Charles R. Sabo said: The event being recalled was of the time while in Bethany, which occurred before Nisan 10 (Palm Sunday). Just a note here. If you, like I, believe that the Passover was observed beginning on Thursday evening, then you must understand that the 15th of Nisan or at the latest the 16th would be the Passover, right? That means that this week had two back-to-back Shabbats (Shabbatiym): Thursday night to Friday, and Friday night to Saturday. 17 hours ago, Charles R. Sabo said: Notice, in Mark 14:10-11, that Mark had also inserted the meeting between Judas Iscariot and the Pharisees (occurred on Passover [Mk. 14:1]). The timeline then continued to be counting down from Mark 14:10 (first day of Unleavened Bread was the Passover). The gentleman was correct (52:58 time of the video), Mark’s reason for going to the anointing within Mark 14:3-9 was to point out what offended Judas, which caused him to betray Jesus. The event within Luke 7:36-50 was a totally different event from Mark 14:3-9. In Luke 7, it was a Pharisee named Simon (his house), as opposed to Simon the leper (his house) in Mark 14:3; the woman did not pour the oil over Jesus’s head In Luke 7:46, but she anointed His feet, while later Mary (sister of Lazarus) poured the oil upon Jesus’ head in Mark 13:3. Luke provided totally different information, because it was a different event totally from the time in Bethany within Mark 14:3. 5In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the Lord's Passover. 6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the Feast of Unleavened Bread unto the Lord: seven days you must eat unleavened bread. (Lev. 23:5-6) Since the Passover meal was accompanied with unleavened bread at their table, the Feast of Passover was adopted into being called the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread. It was meant to be started on the fifteenth day of the month, otherwise the day after the Feast of Passover. The Feast of Unleavened Bread is a seven-day feast. Through Jewish tradition, it was combined into an eight-day feast; they ate the Feast of Passover on the first day, which was the fourteenth day of the month. Now the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, “Where will You that we prepare for You to eat the Passover?” (Matt. 26:17) The timing is important, so that one can see that the scriptures give an accurate account. For many centuries, most of the church has been deceived by false doctrines on the crucifixion day of Christ. These doctrines which say that the crucifixion happened on Friday, and then Christ rose again on Sunday, actually contradict Jesus. Jesus is quoted in saying: Because as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the Earth. (Matt. 12:40) A Friday death does not give Jesus three days and three nights in the heart of the Earth, in order to be resurrected on Sunday morning. If one looks in Mark 11:1-10, the Scriptures tell of Jesus and His triumphant entry into Jerusalem on Palm Sunday. This was the tenth day of the month of Nisan (Ex. 12:3). Then if one keeps reading in Mark 11, one will find a verse which proclaims that it turns to the morrow (next day). “And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry” (Mark 11:12). This would be the eleventh day of the month of Nisan, which would be a Monday. Then look to Mark 11:19-20, and notice another day had passed; this makes it the twelfth day of the month of Nisan, or Tuesday. And when even was come, He went out of the city. 20 And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots. (Mark 11:19) Mark 14:1 indicates after two days, which would be Thursday, Nisan 14, and was the Passover. Please notice how Mark called that Thursday the Feast of Unleavened Bread, when it was actually the Feast of Passover. This is GREAT! It's EXACTLY as I see it, too! The Gentile reading along should understand that ALL meals this close to Pesach ("Passover") were feasts with unleavened bread, matsowt, where each matsah was made without leaven, because no leaven would have been left in their houses! They would even sweep their houses clean to be sure! 17 hours ago, Charles R. Sabo said: After two days was the Feast of the Passover, and of Unleavened Bread: and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take Him by craft, and put Him to death. (Mark 14:1) This brings us to the Feast of Passover on the fourteenth day of Nisan, which was a Thursday, then the Feast of Unleavened Bread is the fifteenth day of the month of Nisan, and was a Friday. Pesach was when they ate the lamb slain during the daylight hours just before the start of the new day at sundown. The feast of unleavened bread CONTAINED the Pesach meal as well as the rest of the week. 17 hours ago, Charles R. Sabo said: 13And they went, and found as He had said unto them, and they made ready the Passover. 14 And when the hour was come, He sat down, and the twelve apostles with Him. 15 And He said unto them: “With desire I have desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer.” (Luke 22:13-15) May God bless everybody in Christ! Yes, and Yeeshuwa` ("Jesus") was pointing out that He was eating the meal early because He was to suffer WITH the sacrifices of the lambs on the day of preparation. He was, after all, the Lamb of God! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne Posted April 22, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 108 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,828 Content Per Day: 1.29 Reputation: 4,818 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/31/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted April 22, 2023 4 hours ago, Retrobyter said: Shabbat shalom, Jayne. No, Lukas was not wrong in his report; however, one must realize that his book is a SYNOPSIS of several eye-witness accounts. He says as much in ... Yes, I have read/taught Luke many times. And I did leave that out in my post. My point was that Luke was not necessarily there when the woman anointed Jesus as another had posted. And even with eye-witness testimony, the Holy Spirit still directed the words. Thanks for the reminder of Luke's thorough investigations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Sabo Posted April 22, 2023 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 44 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 11 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/18/2023 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/16/1960 Share Posted April 22, 2023 (edited) 5 hours ago, Retrobyter said: Just a note here. If you, like I, believe that the Passover was observed beginning on Thursday evening, then you must understand that the 15th of Nisan or at the latest the 16th would be the Passover, right? That means that this week had two back-to-back Shabbats (Shabbatiym): Thursday night to Friday, and Friday night to Saturday. Thank you Retrobyter, As I understand it, Israel has never celebrated the Feast of Passover on any other day then Nisan 14, because that is what the Laws of Moses have commanded. Because GOD is faithful to His Holy Word, HE made sure that HIS Son died on Nisan 14. 5In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the Lord's Passover. 6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the Feast of Unleavened Bread unto the Lord: seven days you must eat unleavened bread. (Lev. 23:5-6) 5 hours ago, Retrobyter said: Thursday 3pm-5:59 pm He died = 1st day Friday 6pm-5:59am = 1st night Friday 6am-5:59 pm = 2nd day Saturday 6pm-5:59am = 2nd night Saturday 6am-5:59pm = 3rd day Sunday 6pm-5:59am =3rd night -He is risen! Edited April 22, 2023 by Charles R. Sabo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted April 23, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.89 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted April 23, 2023 On 4/22/2023 at 6:40 AM, Retrobyter said: "James" is a Hellenization/Anglicization of "Ya`aqoV" ("יַעֲקֹ֔ב"), which was transliterated as "Jacob" in the Tanakh. It was the name of Yisra'eel ("Israel") given at birth. (It's still a mystery to me how "James" came from "Jacob! The story that I've heard, although it may be apocryphal, it that the KJV translators did it to honour King James. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted April 24, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,147 Content Per Day: 4.60 Reputation: 27,843 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted April 24, 2023 I've not thoroughly read all the posts since I left off but I'm just wondering how Luke got into the mix,given the 3 accounts given and the OPs concern - seemed he was wondering about Johns account being different than both Mark and Matthew I certainly understand why someone would reference further examining but I'm just curious- I've always thought of Luke as the "thorough investigator" interviewing eye witness after eye witness ,typical of an academic who researched facts.The physician who loved Jesus Passionately- love reading Gospel according to Luke! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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