Neighbor Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 958 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,660 Content Per Day: 5.04 Reputation: 9,086 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted June 6, 2023 39 minutes ago, AlsoBroken said: Interesting replies. Why do most of you have such a compunction to preach or lecture though? Let’s say you’re the pastor of a church. One Sunday you get up and read Psalm 91, and the during your sermon you tell the amazing, glowing account of how your whole family narrowly missed a deadly car collision during your vacation. Praise God! Then as parishioners file out the door after the worship service, one man stops and says, “Pastor, my 8 yr. old son was killed in an auto accident 6 months ago. Why did God protect your children but not mine?” I’d like to hear ONLY your answer to this one simple question. In that pastor’s shoes, what is YOUR answer to this father? Hi, I really can't relate, as the elders I have known over the decades seem very prone to having serious tragedy occur in their own immediate family. If I ask myself why, why does this happen to such excellent servants, I find an answer in the thinking that God is using even these awful events and consequence to prepare his called ministers to shepherd the sheep of the flocks assigned to them by God Specifically; if my pastor stated his family narrowly avoided great harm, I would join in the praise of God for it, as my pastor does not need yet another tragedy and burden to befall his family as he tries to shepherd the sheep through their own harsh times and events. I would be aware of his burdens just as he is of mine, and so I would not ask that question of him. Instead; we would ( and do) celebrate together, even as we comfort one another in our hardships and harsh events that are very much part of our lives. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 25 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,606 Content Per Day: 3.95 Reputation: 7,797 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2023 I have led a long and not prticularly glorious life. I have been a pilot in the NWT of Canada. I have been attacked in Afghanistan. I have been in many and varied saw-mill situations and somehow survived (controls engineer). Have been in many many very dangerous situations and very near accidents. The Lord High God saw fit to preserve me. I have seen the HAND of The Risen Lord close, very close, as people have been delivered. I have partaken in a couple of Divine healings. I have gotten off airplanes quite drunk and driven across busy freeways at night. (right across the median) I have done so many really dumb things and crossed continents with not a scratch on me. I have been blessed with children that I have not seen for many years. But they seem OK. Before I was two years old I was sent from pillar to post amongst six foster homes and quite badly treated. (bruises all over) God is the Lord and His Messiah is my King. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Hartono Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 774 Topics Per Day: 0.34 Content Count: 6,949 Content Per Day: 3.05 Reputation: 1,984 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/15/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, AlsoBroken said: “Pastor, my 8 yr. old son was killed in an auto accident 6 months ago. Why did God protect your children but not mine?” I’d like to hear ONLY your answer to this one simple question. In that pastor’s shoes, what is YOUR answer to this father? God did not protect His Son Jesus Christ from horrible death either so He can accept your son that was killed in accident into heaven. Edited June 6, 2023 by R. Hartono 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlsoBroken Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 66 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/30/2022 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 4 hours ago, Neighbor said: I’d like to hear ONLY your answer to this one simple question. In that pastor’s shoes, what is YOUR answer to this father? Repeating my original question: you have the bereaved father right in front of you searching your face for an answer. It’s not a far fetched question. In THAT moment, what do you say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlsoBroken Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 66 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/30/2022 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 Again, Let’s say you’re the pastor of a church. One Sunday you get up and read Psalm 91, and the during your sermon you tell the amazing, glowing account of how your whole family narrowly missed a deadly car collision during your vacation. Praise God! Then as parishioners file out the door after the worship service, one man stops and says, “Pastor, my 8 yr. old son was killed in an auto accident 6 months ago. Why did God protect your children but not mine?” I’d like to hear ONLY your answer to this one simple question. In that pastor’s shoes, what is YOUR answer to this father? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 958 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,660 Content Per Day: 5.04 Reputation: 9,086 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted June 6, 2023 Hi, I did answer the question. It would not happen in that manner, for both my pastors/elder, and myself have had so many scars from this life that none of us would be in the mindset(s) you describe. We each know the hurt of life in this world. We each care for the other, enough so that we would give praise for the avoidance of personal involvement an accident while also praying for those involved if there were actually others involved that did not miss in the near accident and for them it was real and traumatic. We would if possible then seek to find out how we might be of help to those that did not fair so well as to be able to give thanks for a near miss. In general individuals face not one horror but many, and so in general individuals can and do identify with the sorrows that nearly all of us carry in this world. Sorrows do not disappear. We do carry the pain of them long as we are here. What we do go forward with is the faith of Jesus that has allowed one man who had lost much to write "It Is Well With My Soul". That poem has been a comfort in it's expression , it's testimony, usually in music of the determination to not lose confidence in the faith of Jesus to many hundreds of thousands over many years now. May God give you and me that very determination that becomes strength to persevere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlsoBroken Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 66 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/30/2022 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 @Neighbor, I appreciate all of what you’re saying, thank you. And I hear where you’re coming from, but my question is NOT answered. You’re saying YOU would not ask your pastor that Why question. You said… “Specifically; …I would be aware of his burdens just as he is of mine, and so I would not ask that question of him.” That’s beside the point. I asked you, or anyone here, to imagine BEING the pastor (who had given that particular scripture and testimony in his sermon) then afterwards being met with a very personal question of Why from a grieving parent. Why didn’t God protect his son from being killed? @Hartono is the only one who gave a reply as far as what to say TO THAT PARENT in that circumstance. It’s a very real question, and one that any Christian might be asked by someone suffering a great loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlsoBroken Posted June 6, 2023 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 66 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/30/2022 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 My own reply (if I was that pastor) would be something like… “I am SO sorry for your loss Mr. Smith, and would love to have you stay and talk with me after everyone goes. Could you do that? So you can tell me about what happened to your son and your family?” And then in private, I would invite him to pour out his heart, and to his question of “Why” I would say honestly… “I don’t know.” I might apologize to him “if my praises of God’s protection seemed very insensitive to you.” I’d ask if I could pray with him, Then perhaps I’d offer some scriptures about trusting God because He has His purposes that are beyond our limited comprehension. Ultimately good purposes. I would want to make sure this father is given emotional support in whatever way he needs it, because THIS IS what Jesus would do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted June 9, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 958 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,660 Content Per Day: 5.04 Reputation: 9,086 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted June 9, 2023 On 6/6/2023 at 5:20 PM, AlsoBroken said: My own reply (if I was that pastor) would be something like… “I am SO sorry for your loss Mr. Smith, and would love to have you stay and talk with me after everyone goes. Could you do that? So you can tell me about what happened to your son and your family?” And then in private, I would invite him to pour out his heart, and to his question of “Why” I would say honestly… “I don’t know.” I might apologize to him “if my praises of God’s protection seemed very insensitive to you.” I’d ask if I could pray with him, Then perhaps I’d offer some scriptures about trusting God because He has His purposes that are beyond our limited comprehension. Ultimately good purposes. I would want to make sure this father is given emotional support in whatever way he needs it, because THIS IS what Jesus would do. Hi, Okay, let's talk a bit about one phrase or sentence, "Sorry for your loss". It has become an often used response. Is it a good one in your opinion? Does it make sense, or satisfy any hurt that is there? To be very blunt, do I not, in order to be sincere, have to ask myself, am I sorry for your loss, or risk coming off as being somewhat insincere, or even glib, in response to a real hurt a deep wound suffered to the heart and spirit? Just what am I, me, when You say in effect, how can you be joyous when I hurt so? Will a sorry for your loss do it? I don't think it suffices, but do think when faced with the question there is no quick sufficing response. You I think are correct in suggesting a "Let's talk" counter or response from the hearer of the question/statement (To a pastor or otherwise) to the mindset presented, really one of of how can you be happy when I am not, and why does God allow this to happen to me. While one can then talk, and go through some quick and some lengthy Bible situations, they will not so quickly help at all for the hurt is so deep. The hurt in my opinion has to be treated, not ignored, nor brushed over with happy talk to mask it. It does not matter how long or how recently the hurt has been there it needs be faced as the hurt it is for it is real. I'll quit right there, for now anyway, as this is getting to be too long a response for this format. Suffice it to say there are procedures, especially in traditions, that are specifically designed to treat such deep hurt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farouk Posted June 15, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 26 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 6,558 Content Per Day: 12.21 Reputation: 3,348 Days Won: 31 Joined: 11/18/2022 Status: Online Share Posted June 15, 2023 On 6/5/2023 at 9:16 AM, AlsoBroken said: Yes. And their testimony has greater impact because of their being “slayed” more or less. @AlsoBroken I think the wording of Job 13.15 is illustrative of Job's strong sense of trust in God beyond circumstances. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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