Jedi4Yahweh Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,955 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/12/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted March 16 I often hear the argument that God condemns slavery, but the truth of the matter, there are places in the bible where God permits and justifies slavery and gives instructions on slavery practices. See the following scripture references: Lev 25:44-46, Exo 21:1-27, Deut 15:11-14. Furthermore some may argue that it was only OT practices and not allowed under NT, but we find where Paul gives instructions to Christian slave owners and slaves: Eph 6:5-8, Col 3:22-24, 1Tim 6:1-2, 1Pet 2:18, Titus 2:9-10. In addition, Paul wrote a letter to a Christian slave owner regarding how he had found one of his runaway slaves who had become a Christian and was asking the slave owner to receive him back and to treat him kindly (Philemon 1:10-16). The point I am making saying the bible condemns slavery is a very weak argument if not entirely invalid, being that slavery was a permitted practice in the bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 66 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,094 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 613 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted March 16 (edited) James 5 doesn't sound like God is okay with it. Come now, you rich, weep and howl for your miseries that are coming upon you! 2 Your riches [a]are corrupted, and your garments are moth-eaten. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded, and their corrosion will be a witness against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have heaped up treasure in the last days. 4 Indeed the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, cry out; and the cries of the reapers have reached the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth. Edited March 16 by RdJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi4Yahweh Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,955 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/12/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 16 13 minutes ago, RdJ said: James 5 doesn't sound like God is okay with it. Come now, you rich, weep and howl for your miseries that are coming upon you! 2 Your riches [a]are corrupted, and your garments are moth-eaten. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded, and their corrosion will be a witness against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have heaped up treasure in the last days. 4 Indeed the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, cry out; and the cries of the reapers have reached the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth. This passage of scripture is addressing those who are rich & corrupted those who become wealthy though fraudulent means. You would agree that not everyone who is wealthy are corrupt and fraudulent. So in the same manner not everyone who owned a slave was unjust and evil, being the bible clearly permitted it and give instructions on slavery as mentioned in my OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. Adrien Posted March 16 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 454 Content Per Day: 4.68 Reputation: 386 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/22/2024 Status: Offline Share Posted March 16 4 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said: This passage of scripture is addressing those who are rich & corrupted those who become wealthy though fraudulent means. You would agree that not everyone who is wealthy are corrupt and fraudulent. So in the same manner not everyone who owned a slave was unjust and evil, being the bible clearly permitted it and give instructions on slavery as mentioned in my OP. The way slavery was practiced was not how a modern person views it. Often the relationship was contractual, or after a period of time it would become contractual, where the enslaved could choose freedom or be contracted with the owner to continue with the arrangement. Some would sell themselves into slavery to pay off a debt. Of course being enslaved through a military campaign would be a whole different set of laws and demands upon those captured and enslaved. It is never a good idea to impose modern sensibilities upon an ancient culture and its practices. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 66 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,094 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 613 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted March 16 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said: This passage of scripture is addressing those who are rich & corrupted those who become wealthy though fraudulent means. You would agree that not everyone who is wealthy are corrupt and fraudulent. So in the same manner not everyone who owned a slave was unjust and evil, being the bible clearly permitted it and give instructions on slavery as mentioned in my OP. The explanation I heard was that it was more like an employer in the N.T. which was seen as okay and not the evil slavery from today. These days slavery is that they use people from North Korea as slaves or pay people way too little to get the harvest in. Edited March 16 by RdJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. Adrien Posted March 16 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 454 Content Per Day: 4.68 Reputation: 386 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/22/2024 Status: Offline Share Posted March 16 4 minutes ago, RdJ said: The explanation I heard was that it was more like an employer in the N.T. which was seen as okay and not the evil slavery from today. These days slavery is that they use people from North Korea as slaves or pay people way too little to get the harvest in. Also human trafficking which occurs across the U.S. southern border regularly with NGOs being a big contributor to the problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathoner Posted March 16 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 71 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,138 Content Per Day: 7.06 Reputation: 13,092 Days Won: 97 Joined: 05/24/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted March 16 The slavery mentioned in the scriptures was indentured servitude, typically done to satisfy a debt. However, the master was obligated to treat the slave fairly, providing for their needs during the term of their servitude. Slavery was not life-long on the part of the slave with limits placed upon the duration by the Lord. However, a slave who is set free by their master could choose to serve them for the remainder of their life; this is the bondservant. The bondservant is treated like family. This is not the chattel slavery we're familiar with from recent history. There is no comparison. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi4Yahweh Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,955 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/12/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 16 22 minutes ago, D. Adrien said: The way slavery was practiced was not how a modern person views it. Often the relationship was contractual, or after a period of time it would become contractual, where the enslaved could choose freedom or be contracted with the owner to continue with the arrangement. Some would sell themselves into slavery to pay off a debt. Of course being enslaved through a military campaign would be a whole different set of laws and demands upon those captured and enslaved. It is never a good idea to impose modern sensibilities upon an ancient culture and its practices. Well Yes and No. The bible gives different instructions for foreign slaves verses Hebrew slaves. Hebrew slaves could sell themselves into slavery and could be a slave for 6 years and then had to be released, but for foreign slaves there was no time limit restrictions. Lev 25:44-46, Exo 21:1-27, Deut 15:11-14. Any yes there was slavery for those who stole and could not pay back double for what they stole. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. Adrien Posted March 16 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 454 Content Per Day: 4.68 Reputation: 386 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/22/2024 Status: Offline Share Posted March 16 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Jedi4Yahweh said: Well Yes and No. The bible gives different instructions for foreign slaves verses Hebrew slaves. Hebrew slaves could sell themselves into slavery and could be a slave for 6 years and then had to be released, but for foreign slaves there was no time limit restrictions. Lev 25:44-46, Exo 21:1-27, Deut 15:11-14. Any yes there was slavery for those who stole and could not pay back double for what they stole. I may be wrong but I believe that the year of release or Jubilee the owners were expected to release Jewish slaves as well as return land that been given as collateral for a loan, and so forth. Edited March 16 by D. Adrien wording Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi4Yahweh Posted March 16 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,955 Content Per Day: 0.26 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/12/2003 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 16 1 minute ago, D. Adrien said: I may be wrong but I believe that the year of release or Jubilee the owners were expected to release Jewish slaves as well as return land that that been given as collateral for a loan, and so forth. That maybe true for the Jubilee year which is every 49years. 7 x 7. I will have to look into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts