Floatingaxe Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 27, 2012 I'm afraid I don't understand your meaning. The NT never commands tithing to churches either, neither is it commanded at all. Only giving is commanded and it doesn't say you have to give to a church. So are you telling me that if I give to the poor and needy, BUT skip the middleman of the church, I am being disobedient? Give me 1 single scripture where I am commanded to give a tithe or offering to a church please. Giving to the poor is something we are instructed to do, but tithing is to God. We give an offering, but we PAY a tithe. It is for the house of God, and for the administration of the work and is disbursed to the needs of others. The tithe is something that the Lord lays on the heart to do. There is no scripture that rescinds the tithe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taylor30 Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 382 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 96 Days Won: 3 Joined: 12/31/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted April 27, 2012 I'm afraid I don't understand your meaning. The NT never commands tithing to churches either, neither is it commanded at all. Only giving is commanded and it doesn't say you have to give to a church. So are you telling me that if I give to the poor and needy, BUT skip the middleman of the church, I am being disobedient? Give me 1 single scripture where I am commanded to give a tithe or offering to a church please. Giving to the poor is something we are instructed to do, but tithing is to God. We give an offering, but we PAY a tithe. It is for the house of God, and for the administration of the work and is disbursed to the needs of others. The tithe is something that the Lord lays on the heart to do. There is no scripture that rescinds the tithe. Well that is a bit of a stretch. Remember that Jesus said when we give to the least of these, we ARE giving to him. So I can certainly support the position that when I give to a poor person or needy person I see ( and maybe who God caused to cross my path so I could give to them ) then I AM giving to God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 27, 2012 Floatingaxe: There is no scripture that rescinds the tithe. Moving someone land markers to get some of their land was against the law. It is stealing. I see nothing in the Word that changes the concept as to where it would be OK today to steal property. Theft, is theft. God provides Apostles, pastors, teachers, Prophets, evangelist for the body of Christ, so we can grow and learn. God provides many promises in his word, like to multiply our seed sown, and to supply all of our needs. God empowers people to build churches so we can witness, learn and gather together. With all God provides, he only asked one thing to be his, and that is a 10th of what he enables us to bring in. If God had no part in taking care of us, or helping us get jobs, blessing our businesses, showing us the best trades in the Markets, if he were completely absent from blessing us financially, then he would not have a right to ask for at least a tenth back. If you believe God is not helping you, then keep the money. If God is your supply, your source. If God is multiplying your seed sown, then what would be the issue of giving back to him 10%? If a Bank, or Walmart someone you can see told you that they were going to pay all your bills, get you a job (Supply seed to the Sower), and all you had to do is give back 10% which they would turn around and multiply back to you, making you even more wealthy. I suspect everyone would sign up for that deal. Be blessed. Amen! Well put! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 27, 2012 I'm afraid I don't understand your meaning. The NT never commands tithing to churches either, neither is it commanded at all. Only giving is commanded and it doesn't say you have to give to a church. So are you telling me that if I give to the poor and needy, BUT skip the middleman of the church, I am being disobedient? Give me 1 single scripture where I am commanded to give a tithe or offering to a church please. Giving to the poor is something we are instructed to do, but tithing is to God. We give an offering, but we PAY a tithe. It is for the house of God, and for the administration of the work and is disbursed to the needs of others. The tithe is something that the Lord lays on the heart to do. There is no scripture that rescinds the tithe. Well that is a bit of a stretch. Remember that Jesus said when we give to the least of these, we ARE giving to him. So I can certainly support the position that when I give to a poor person or needy person I see ( and maybe who God caused to cross my path so I could give to them ) then I AM giving to God. It may be a stretch to some folk, but God and His precious promises are more than worth it. There are certain promises connected to the tithe, and not to merely giving or being generous with people. Giving is something we do over and above the tithe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taylor30 Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 382 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 96 Days Won: 3 Joined: 12/31/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted April 27, 2012 I'm afraid I don't understand your meaning. The NT never commands tithing to churches either, neither is it commanded at all. Only giving is commanded and it doesn't say you have to give to a church. So are you telling me that if I give to the poor and needy, BUT skip the middleman of the church, I am being disobedient? Give me 1 single scripture where I am commanded to give a tithe or offering to a church please. Giving to the poor is something we are instructed to do, but tithing is to God. We give an offering, but we PAY a tithe. It is for the house of God, and for the administration of the work and is disbursed to the needs of others. The tithe is something that the Lord lays on the heart to do. There is no scripture that rescinds the tithe. Well that is a bit of a stretch. Remember that Jesus said when we give to the least of these, we ARE giving to him. So I can certainly support the position that when I give to a poor person or needy person I see ( and maybe who God caused to cross my path so I could give to them ) then I AM giving to God. It may be a stretch to some folk, but God and His precious promises are more than worth it. There are certain promises connected to the tithe, and not to merely giving or being generous with people. Giving is something we do over and above the tithe. I think you are still misunderstanding me. My MAIN point is that the tithe does NOT apply to Christians. I'm not saying we shouldn't, but if you say its REQUIRED, you place people under bondage. What should I tell my neighbor when she can barely afford to feed her kids? That Giddy is punishing her for not thing and her kids should go hungry so the local pastor can pay the bills in the church? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 27, 2012 I think you are still misunderstanding me. My MAIN point is that the tithe does NOT apply to Christians. I'm not saying we shouldn't, but if you say its REQUIRED, you place people under bondage. What should I tell my neighbor when she can barely afford to feed her kids? That Giddy is punishing her for not thing and her kids should go hungry so the local pastor can pay the bills in the church? Perhaps you do not understand that the tithe applies to all who love God. I don't say it is required, but God does to those who are hearing Him. As for your neighbour. Is she a born again Christian? You cannot teach a person to do something that you do not do yourself. As for her poverty, realize also that poverty is bondage. Then teach her about the widow's mite. To teach someone that poverty is a punishment from God runs counter to who God is and it is a lie. Who is Giddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taylor30 Posted April 27, 2012 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 382 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 96 Days Won: 3 Joined: 12/31/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted April 27, 2012 I think you are still misunderstanding me. My MAIN point is that the tithe does NOT apply to Christians. I'm not saying we shouldn't, but if you say its REQUIRED, you place people under bondage. What should I tell my neighbor when she can barely afford to feed her kids? That Giddy is punishing her for not thing and her kids should go hungry so the local pastor can pay the bills in the church? Perhaps you do not understand that the tithe applies to all who love God. I don't say it is required, but God does to those who are hearing Him. As for your neighbour. Is she a born again Christian? You cannot teach a person to do something that you do not do yourself. As for her poverty, realize also that poverty is bondage. Then teach her about the widow's mite. To teach someone that poverty is a punishment from God runs counter to who God is and it is a lie. Who is Giddy? Giddy is my possessed spellchecker. It was supposed to be God. Anyway, I don't think the concept of thing is as easy when you are in a cold house with a bare refrigerator. I think there is a REASON Paul never gave Christians a minimum amount. He knew thing in mien times is not realistic for everyone. Whether my neighbor is Christian or not is irrelevant. God chose to bless many people in scripture who were NOT of his people. Also there ARE pastors like Penny Hinn & Kenneth Copeland & Robert Tilton who DO teach poverty IS a sin because God wants his children rich and happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 28, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Giddy is my possessed spellchecker. It was supposed to be God. Hilarious! Anyway, I don't think the concept of thing is as easy when you are in a cold house with a bare refrigerator. I think there is a REASON Paul never gave Christians a minimum amount. He knew thing in mien times is not realistic for everyone. Whether my neighbor is Christian or not is irrelevant. God chose to bless many people in scripture who were NOT of his people. Also there ARE pastors like Penny Hinn & Kenneth Copeland & Robert Tilton who DO teach poverty IS a sin because God wants his children rich and happy. It wasn't up to Paul to change the amount. In lean times it is all the more important to tithe. We mustn't lean n our own understanding, but walk in faith and trust completely in God for everything we need. Tithing is that kind of situation is hard, but it reaps great rewards, spiritually. You cannot expect an unbeliever to do what Christians do. Your neighbour can only do what her sensibilities dictate. We do what God desires , completely trusting Him. God does want us to prosper in all ways. There is nothing wrong with money. It is the love of money that is a sin. Once again: 2 Corinthians 9:8 And God will generously provide all you need. Then you will always have everything you need and plenty left over to share with others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 28, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Taylor did not say God was punishing someone with poverty. You applied that to what he said and it was dishonest to do so. Taylor implied it. It was appropriate to respond to that. There's no getting around it: What should I tell my neighbor when she can barely afford to feed her kids? That Giddy (God) is punishing her for not thing and her kids should go hungry so the local pastor can pay the bills in the church? There are plenty of people who are both Christian and poor. Does that mean that they are bad Christians because they don't have any worldly goods? People who are poor and have a rich spiritual life are much better off than someone who has a bunch of junk and is empty spiritually. This entire guilt trip of "pay your tithe first and then maybe God will provide for your children" is bunk. God wants us to take care of our responsibilities and obligations first, especially to our family. This entire attitude that you give everything to the church and hope God will send you a windfall afterwords to buy food and pay the gas bill is total garbage, and you insult God when you infer that people should be that irresponsible. It isn't God's will that we be in poverty. His will is that we flourish and prosper and be the leaders in the world that he desires us to be, able to be generous givers and to do all that He calls us to do without impediment. Put the tithe to the test. It even works for the ungodly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnotherSinner Posted April 28, 2012 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 47 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 628 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 94 Days Won: 5 Joined: 03/13/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1984 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Taylor did not say God was punishing someone with poverty. You applied that to what he said and it was dishonest to do so. Taylor implied it. It was appropriate to respond to that. There's no getting around it: What should I tell my neighbor when she can barely afford to feed her kids? That Giddy (God) is punishing her for not thing and her kids should go hungry so the local pastor can pay the bills in the church? There are plenty of people who are both Christian and poor. Does that mean that they are bad Christians because they don't have any worldly goods? People who are poor and have a rich spiritual life are much better off than someone who has a bunch of junk and is empty spiritually. This entire guilt trip of "pay your tithe first and then maybe God will provide for your children" is bunk. God wants us to take care of our responsibilities and obligations first, especially to our family. This entire attitude that you give everything to the church and hope God will send you a windfall afterwords to buy food and pay the gas bill is total garbage, and you insult God when you infer that people should be that irresponsible. It isn't God's will that we be in poverty. His will is that we flourish and prosper and be the leaders in the world that he desires us to be, able to be generous givers and to do all that He calls us to do without impediment. Put the tithe to the test. It even works for the ungodly. Floating.... Am I understanding you correctly? Are you saying anyone who cannot or does not tithe is not a Christian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts