Salvation

[Brother Chad]

I was just wondering why there are so many conflicting views in regards to our salvation? The Bible has made some issues of doctrine rather vague and open to different interpretations, but with regards to salvation it is pretty much cut and dry. So why are there so many different views of what our salvation is and how we achieve it. Many will say that my particular faith is too tied up in works to achieve salvation, but I am here to say that our salvation is a free gift of God and requires certain things of us that are not works of man but are rather works of God that involve our acceptance of the His Word and an obedience to it as well.

So my question is what do the different denominations believe is required for our salvation? Please give your denomination in your reply as this is for study purposes? Thank you for any help!

Brother Chad

[Ovedya]

Salvation is Christ Himself.

Most every denomination that I have come across agree on the same basic issue regarding salvation: One must have Christ.

[Brother Chad]

Let me further relate my question so that I can be clear about what I am asking. In my faith, we believe that you must have a true and sincere faith that Jesus died, was buried, and was resurrected. This I know is a common theme in all major denominations of Christianity. It is our base or foundation for our faith. Many stop there and do not believe that we must obey all the other references in the Bible to our salvation. Repentance is the first step. We must have a genuine sorrow for our sins and ask God for forgiveness. When we do this, God will apply the blood of Jesus to our lives and help us to apply His Word and our obedience to His Word. Then we must be baptized in water (full immersion) in the name of Jesus for the "remission of our sins." It is clear in the Bible that we are to be baptized for remittance of sins. Our faith alone does not bring about the cleansing of our sins in the past, only water baptism can do this. Lastly, the Holy Spirit will enter us and we will speak with other tongues as the Spirit gives us utterance. I know that many don't hold to these basic salvation principles because of one reason or another, but it is biblical and I would love to discuss this with whoever.

God bless,

Bro. Chad

[Ovedya]

Well, I think that, in a sense you are opening a real can of worms here, because you've mentioned at least three things which many fundamanetalists have disagreements upon: Eternal security, baptismal regeneration, and speaking in tongues. If you were to search Worthy I am certain that you would find multiple topics on all three.

Eventually the denominations have to come a mutual disagreement over these matters and try to find a foundation for unity, for oneness. This is one reason I wrote that one must only have Christ for salvation. If every Christian denomination dropped their doctrinal stands on various non-essential items and fellowshipped with one another on the basis of Christ alone, they may find that those differences are not of enough value in sacrificing the oneness of the Body of Christ.

But the problem is that some denominations believe (I believe falsely) that the various doctinal issues pertaining to some religious practices (Such as baptism and speaking in tongues, for example.) in the church are essentials of the faith, and even to salvation. These doctrines are so ingrained in the denominations that they are fully convinced within themeseleves that, unless Christians everywhere believe as they do, they are in danger of suffering God's judgment and eternal perdition. Ironically, it may be these beliefs themselves and the believers' willingness to sacrifice the oneness of the Body, that will be the factors of God's righteous judgment against them!

Unless all believers mutually agree that Christ is the essential factor of their salvation, then there will be no unity in the Body of Christ. Because Christ is the foundation of God's justification and the foundation of our salvation; because everything in the new creation subsists in Christ and depends entirely upon Christ for the conveyance of God's divine life; then it must be in Christ alone that we lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon. In Him we live and move and have our being.

[Brother Chad]

Well, I think that, in a sense you are opening a real can of worms here, because you've mentioned at least three things which many fundamanetalists have disagreements upon: Eternal security, baptismal regeneration, and speaking in tongues. If you were to search Worthy I am certain that you would find multiple topics on all three.

Eventually the denominations have to come a mutual disagreement over these matters and try to find a foundation for unity, for oneness. This is one reason I wrote that one must only have Christ for salvation. If every Christian denomination dropped their doctrinal stands on various non-essential items and fellowshipped with one another on the basis of Christ alone, they may find that those differences are not of enough value in sacrificing the oneness of the Body of Christ.

But the problem is that some denominations believe (I believe falsely) that the various doctinal issues pertaining to some religious practices (Such as baptism and speaking in tongues, for example.) in the church are essentials of the faith, and even to salvation. These doctrines are so ingrained in the denominations that they are fully convinced within themeseleves that, unless Christians everywhere believe as they do, they are in danger of suffering God's judgment and eternal perdition. Ironically, it may be these beliefs themselves and the believers' willingness to sacrifice the oneness of the Body, that will be the factors of God's righteous judgment against them!

Unless all believers mutually agree that Christ is the essential factor of their salvation, then there will be no unity in the Body of Christ. Because Christ is the foundation of God's justification and the foundation of our salvation; because everything in the new creation subsists in Christ and depends entirely upon Christ for the conveyance of God's divine life; then it must be in Christ alone that we lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon. In Him we live and move and have our being.

Yes, Ovedya we all lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon Christ. In Him we live and move and have our being. I agree and that is why we follow what He said in the Bible and what His disciples have taught in the Bible to know that it takes more than just easy-believism to be saved. Yes, it is a free gift of God but is a process and one that Jesus, Peter, Paul and many others attest to in the Bible. Remember, the devils in James 2:19 also believe that Jesus is the Son of God. Does this mean that they are saved and going to heaven?

[Ovedya]

Well, I think that, in a sense you are opening a real can of worms here, because you've mentioned at least three things which many fundamanetalists have disagreements upon: Eternal security, baptismal regeneration, and speaking in tongues. If you were to search Worthy I am certain that you would find multiple topics on all three.

Eventually the denominations have to come a mutual disagreement over these matters and try to find a foundation for unity, for oneness. This is one reason I wrote that one must only have Christ for salvation. If every Christian denomination dropped their doctrinal stands on various non-essential items and fellowshipped with one another on the basis of Christ alone, they may find that those differences are not of enough value in sacrificing the oneness of the Body of Christ.

But the problem is that some denominations believe (I believe falsely) that the various doctinal issues pertaining to some religious practices (Such as baptism and speaking in tongues, for example.) in the church are essentials of the faith, and even to salvation. These doctrines are so ingrained in the denominations that they are fully convinced within themeseleves that, unless Christians everywhere believe as they do, they are in danger of suffering God's judgment and eternal perdition. Ironically, it may be these beliefs themselves and the believers' willingness to sacrifice the oneness of the Body, that will be the factors of God's righteous judgment against them!

Unless all believers mutually agree that Christ is the essential factor of their salvation, then there will be no unity in the Body of Christ. Because Christ is the foundation of God's justification and the foundation of our salvation; because everything in the new creation subsists in Christ and depends entirely upon Christ for the conveyance of God's divine life; then it must be in Christ alone that we lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon. In Him we live and move and have our being.

Yes, Ovedya we all lay our absolute devotion and dependence upon Christ. In Him we live and move and have our being. I agree and that is why we follow what He said in the Bible and what His disciples have taught in the Bible to know that it takes more than just easy-believism to be saved. Yes, it is a free gift of God but is a process and one that Jesus, Peter, Paul and many others attest to in the Bible. Remember, the devils in James 2:19 also believe that Jesus is the Son of God. Does this mean that they are saved and going to heaven?

No. There's obviously a difference between believing something objectively and believing into Christ. Believing into Christ is entirely subjective in nature. It takes place in the human spirit, not in the mind. Besides, if salvation is a free gift (Almost a contradiction in terms there, lol.) dependent entirely on Christ, then the process is also dependent upon Him.

[WISDOM]

Let me further relate my question so that I can be clear about what I am asking. In my faith, we believe that you must have a true and sincere faith that Jesus died, was buried, and was resurrected. This I know is a common theme in all major denominations of Christianity. It is our base or foundation for our faith. Many stop there and do not believe that we must obey all the other references in the Bible to our salvation. Repentance is the first step. We must have a genuine sorrow for our sins and ask God for forgiveness. When we do this, God will apply the blood of Jesus to our lives and help us to apply His Word and our obedience to His Word. Then we must be baptized in water (full immersion) in the name of Jesus for the "remission of our sins." It is clear in the Bible that we are to be baptized for remittance of sins. Our faith alone does not bring about the cleansing of our sins in the past, only water baptism can do this. Lastly, the Holy Spirit will enter us and we will speak with other tongues as the Spirit gives us utterance. I know that many don't hold to these basic salvation principles because of one reason or another, but it is biblical and I would love to discuss this with whoever.

God bless,

Bro. Chad

Chad...let me ask you an honest, sincere question. If a person is lying on their deathbed, and had NEVER before professed a belief in CHRIST (Romans 10:9-10), however he/she made this "11th Hour" acceptance of the free gift of salvation through FAITH & CONFESSION BY MOUTH, and BELIEF in their heart, yet they didn't get water baptized, nor did they speak in tongues, and moments later they died. Would they go to be with their LORD/SAVIOUR or be separated from HIM for Eternity? Now, before you respond, please carefully and thoughtfully read again what I just wrote to you in its entirety.

[Brother Chad]

Let me further relate my question so that I can be clear about what I am asking. In my faith, we believe that you must have a true and sincere faith that Jesus died, was buried, and was resurrected. This I know is a common theme in all major denominations of Christianity. It is our base or foundation for our faith. Many stop there and do not believe that we must obey all the other references in the Bible to our salvation. Repentance is the first step. We must have a genuine sorrow for our sins and ask God for forgiveness. When we do this, God will apply the blood of Jesus to our lives and help us to apply His Word and our obedience to His Word. Then we must be baptized in water (full immersion) in the name of Jesus for the "remission of our sins." It is clear in the Bible that we are to be baptized for remittance of sins. Our faith alone does not bring about the cleansing of our sins in the past, only water baptism can do this. Lastly, the Holy Spirit will enter us and we will speak with other tongues as the Spirit gives us utterance. I know that many don't hold to these basic salvation principles because of one reason or another, but it is biblical and I would love to discuss this with whoever.

God bless,

Bro. Chad

Chad...let me ask you an honest, sincere question. If a person is lying on their deathbed, and had NEVER before professed a belief in CHRIST (Romans 10:9-10), however he/she made this "11th Hour" acceptance of the free gift of salvation through FAITH & CONFESSION BY MOUTH, and BELIEF in their heart, yet they didn't get water baptized, nor did they speak in tongues, and moments later they died. Would they go to be with their LORD/SAVIOUR or be separated from HIM for Eternity? Now, before you respond, please carefully and thoughtfully read again what I just wrote to you in its entirety.

I have been given this question before and you must understand that my ways are not God's ways. I do not think that I have any power to judge or tell you what will happen to a person if this case were to happen to them. This case would be left up to God Himself and I don't think any human being could surely say whether or not that person would go to heaven or hell.

Let me just share some thoughts with you and see what you think?

-We all know that we are sinners and are in need of salvation. "Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?" (Proverbs 20:9).

-We all know that salvation comes "only" through faith in Jesus Christ. No amount of good works or adherence to law can save a man. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of ourselves: it is a gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)

-There are past, present, and future aspects of salvation.

Past-at a past point in time we received forgiveness of sin, freedom from sin's control, and power to live for God. (Titus 3:5)

Present-we presently enjoy forgiveness of sins, power to live for God, and freedom from the power of sin (Ephesians 2:5).

Future-We have not received final and complete deliverance from all the curse of sin. We still live in this sinful and imperfect world. Our salvation will be complete when we receive our immortal, glorified bodies like that of the resurrected body of Jesus (Romans 8:23; I Corinthians 15:51-57; Acts 15:11).

Now that we have alittle ground work in place, we must ask the question:

How can we be saved from sin in this life?

Jesus said in John 3:3, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." The Jewish religious leader that He was talking to, Nicodemus, did not understand this because he asked Jesus how a man could be born a second time from his mother's womb. Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God" (John 3:5). This was Jesus answer in pointing to a time when the new covenant with man would be revealed. So when Nicodemus sought after the answer to the question above, Jesus Himself said, "You must be born again of water and the Spirit." This is a call for more than just mere faith in Jesus. He is giving a prophecy of the coming kingdom and how we can get in.

Later we have the Book of Acts, which is a historical account of the first church after Jesus' ascension. In Acts 1, last minute instructions were given by Jesus to His disciples. He told them to go into Jerusalem and wait for the promise of the Father, the baptism of the Holy Ghost. In Acts 2 on the Day of Pentecost, we see the promised Spirit baptism coming onto the 120 or so believers in the upper room. Attracted by the strange happenings, many onlookers gathered around this first outpouring of the Spirit. Peter took this opportunity to preach to the crowd. He proclaimed that Jesus of Nazareth, was both Lord and Christ. The crowd hearing this felt guilt in their hearts and asked Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Men and brethren, what must we do?" (Acts 2:37) They were obviously asking them, "What must we do to be saved?" Peter gave them a plain, simple, unambiguous answer to a direct inquiry, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost" (Acts 2:38). This answer had the full endorsement of all the apostles otherwise we would have surely seen some dissension later on. This is the authoritative answer of the apostolic church to the question, "What must I do to be saved?"

In short, when Jesus answered Nicodemus, He was describing God's plan of salvation for the future New Testament church that was about to come into existence. He was giving Nicodemus information to help motivate him to believe in His person and mission. Peter's answer was a direct answer to a direct question about salvation. The Spirit had been given and Peter wanted to give explicit instructions and to produce an immediate new birth.

[WISDOM]

I understand all you've just said and written, respectfully. However, you kind of "pseudo-sidestepped" what I ask . The Bible is pretty basic and simple to understand when a Christian yields him/herself to the AUTHOR of the book....the HOLY SPIRIT. Sadly Chad, we all too often complicate the simplicity of it.

The question I asked you is no different than what happened to the Thief on the Cross, who that very day went to be with the LORD, did he not according to our FATHER's Word? You KNOW the basic truth just as I do....to be absent from the body (this earthly tent/temple) is TO BE PRESENT with the LORD. No other technical jargon you and I can come up with will suffice. (2 Corinthians 5:8) GOD has said this, not you or I, and it is IMPOSSIBLE for HIM to Lie (Titus 1:2).

Unfortunately Chad, too many Christians feel the need to add to a "gift", which changes it to something one feels they have to "pay for". Too bad they don't want to accept the fact that the FATHER doesn't want their "currency". HE's been "paid" already.

Once accepted, HIS goal is a relationship with YOU and ME. HE will never leave us, nor forsake us. HE will NEVER misguide us or forget us at death. More importantly Chad, HE will never overlook you or I, and NEVER cancel our "appointment" in HIS "Appointment Book", regardless of what we think we owe HIM.

And what is it that we do owe HIM? Faith, Trust and Obedience.....to love HIM with all our heart, soul and mind. If I hadn't accepted HIS free gift in 1977, yet instead, would today have been fortunate enough to have waited until now on my deathbed and did so, WITHOUT being immersed in water (which by the way I have been), or speaking in an unknown tongue, there is NO DOUBT in my mind that I would appear before the Judgement Seat of CHRIST (the BEMA).......just like you.

We should never add a comma, where our FATHER has placed a period. In doing so my brother, we block the Gates of Heaven to other men/women, and we become a stumbling block to our own fellow Believers. And just in case you want to know (even though you didn't ask), I'm a Non-Denominational Believer.

[Brother Chad]

That is good stuff and I respect what you have written, WISDOM. The case of the thief on the cross is not the same as a born again believer though. He was saved by the old covenant, where Jesus was his high priest and sacrifice. The Bible is very clear with regards to our salvation and although it is a free gift of God, there is a process to it:

GRACE: This is a must in our salvation and is an