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Posted

Does God have free will? Any thoughts on this? How does this relate to man's free will and connection to sin?

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Posted

God is free to act an any way He sees fit that is consistent with His eternal attributes. There is no force external to God that constrains Him in any way


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Posted
God is free to act an any way He sees fit that is consistent with His eternal attributes. There is no force external to God that constrains Him in any way

Therefore, to say that humans used free will irresponsibly (i.e. they CHOSE to sin), it would also be logical to say that the God used his own free will irresponsibly by CHOOSING to create humans who he knew (omniscience, remember) were going to sin. Sin is in the world because God made this CHOICE.

Does that make sense?


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Posted

God is free to act an any way He sees fit that is consistent with His eternal attributes. There is no force external to God that constrains Him in any way

Therefore, to say that humans used free will irresponsibly (i.e. they CHOSE to sin), it would also be logical to say that the God used his own free will irresponsibly by CHOOSING to create humans who he knew (omniscience, remember) were going to sin. Sin is in the world because God made this CHOICE.

Does that make sense?

No, becase there are other variables that must be added to the equation. We do not stand outsode of time and have perfect knowledge as God does. God had an end-game in mind of which we are not privy. Any evaluation we would make would be coulded by our humanity and inability to see as God does


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Posted

God is free to act an any way He sees fit that is consistent with His eternal attributes. There is no force external to God that constrains Him in any way

Therefore, to say that humans used free will irresponsibly (i.e. they CHOSE to sin), it would also be logical to say that the God used his own free will irresponsibly by CHOOSING to create humans who he knew (omniscience, remember) were going to sin. Sin is in the world because God made this CHOICE.

Does that make sense?

No, becase there are other variables that must be added to the equation. We do not stand outsode of time and have perfect knowledge as God does. God had an end-game in mind of which we are not privy. Any evaluation we would make would be coulded by our humanity and inability to see as God does

Therefore, the imperfect world that a perfect deity created with his perfect knowledge is actually "perfect imperfection". With that standard anyone could say they are God. They just need to say, "I meant to do that" whenever a mistake is made or limitation revealed.

Also, your comment sounds a lot like agnosticism to me (i.e. God is unknowable).


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Posted

Also, your comment sounds a lot like agnosticism to me (i.e. God is unknowable).

When challenged on logical grounds most believers revert to agnostic theism without realizing it. Since they are uncapable of defining God logically, they usually make some statement about God transcending logic (like what EricH said about human mind being clouded). Since logic is the only instrument we have to gain any knowledge, they are directly implying that God is unknowable. However they fail to realize that and then go on saying that God is omnipotent, omniscient etc.

Excellent point--I agree completely.


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Posted

Grace to you,

Yet you are the folks who accuse God of being a Dictator? ;)

If He gives you Free Will then it is His fault for your sin. ;)

However if He doesn't allow you to choose the evil and rebellion you so blatantly espouse. He then is a Tyrant? :o

Now that's imperfect logic shrouded in darkness. :taped:

Peace,

Dave

Guest Car54WhereRU
Posted (edited)

God cannot and will not do anything contrary to his written word. Psalm 138:2 says he has "magnified his word above all his name." You have to remember that God is an eternal being and as humans we cannot completely comprehend him. What we know about him is revealed in his word. You cannot approach understanding God with a "logical" approach or attitude. You will go nuts. The Bible says his was are not are ways and that they are past finding out.

Hope that helps a little.

Edited by Car54WhereRU

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Posted
Grace to you,

Yet you are the folks who accuse God of being a Dictator? :b:

If He gives you Free Will then it is His fault for your sin. :wub:

However if He doesn't allow you to choose the evil and rebellion you so blatantly espouse. He then is a Tyrant? ;)

Now that's imperfect logic shrouded in darkness. ;)

Peace,

Dave

Consider the concept of omniscience. God hates sin, right? He knows that when he creates Adam and Eve that they will sin. He creates them anyway, knowing that he hates sin.

You are now forced to either of the following conclusions: Either he likes sin, but says he hates it (so much for honesty), or he didn't know that Adam and Eve were going to sin (so much for omniscience).

Guest Car54WhereRU
Posted

Consider the concept of omniscience. God hates sin, right? He knows that when he creates Adam and Eve that they will sin. He creates them anyway, knowing that he hates sin.

You are now forced to either of the following conclusions: Either he likes sin, but says he hates it (so much for honesty), or he didn't know that Adam and Eve were going to sin (so much for omniscience).

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