antz Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 71 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/13/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted August 19, 2006 Leviticus 26:14 [ Punishment for Disobedience ] " 'But if you will not listen to me and carry out all these commands, Deuteronomy 28:15 [ Curses for Disobedience ] However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you: Jeremiah 43:7 So they entered Egypt in disobedience to the LORD and went as far as Tahpanhes. Hebrews 4:6 It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in , because of their disobedience. Hebrews 4:11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience. It is a direct implication that every act of disobedience is an act of the will. Just to clarify so there is no room for confussion and because i am not that good in english... Do you mean all sins that the people is commiting is willfully being done by the person committing the sin??? Thanks, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted August 19, 2006 Leviticus 26:14 [ Punishment for Disobedience ] " 'But if you will not listen to me and carry out all these commands, Deuteronomy 28:15 [ Curses for Disobedience ] However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you: Jeremiah 43:7 So they entered Egypt in disobedience to the LORD and went as far as Tahpanhes. Hebrews 4:6 It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in , because of their disobedience. Hebrews 4:11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience. It is a direct implication that every act of disobedience is an act of the will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeilanS Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 158 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,763 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/14/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/23/1990 Share Posted August 19, 2006 I don't believe it is a sin if it isn't done willfully... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 19, 2006 I don't believe it is a sin if it isn't done willfully... That's a very shallow and dangerous view of sin and also a very subjective one. It also leads people to excuse their sins instead of confessing them. The sinful nature runs deep to the core, even in believers. It effects not only our sinful actions but our sinful inactions. Nothing scriptural about your concept of sin. sw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeilanS Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 158 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,763 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/14/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/23/1990 Share Posted August 19, 2006 I don't believe it is a sin if it isn't done willfully... That's a very shallow and dangerous view of sin and also a very subjective one. It also leads people to excuse their sins instead of confessing them. The sinful nature runs deep to the core, even in believers. It effects not only our sinful actions but our sinful inactions. Nothing scriptural about your concept of sin. sw Well if you are dismissing the sin in any way, then God will know. I don't think God condemns us for sins we don't realize we are commiting. However, once you know Jesus, you have no excuse not to realize your sins. And I suppose before you know Jesus, you are condemned in your sins whether you know them or not. Very confusing business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antz Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 71 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/13/2006 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 19, 2006 Leviticus 26:14 [ Punishment for Disobedience ] " 'But if you will not listen to me and carry out all these commands, Deuteronomy 28:15 [ Curses for Disobedience ] However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you: Jeremiah 43:7 So they entered Egypt in disobedience to the LORD and went as far as Tahpanhes. Hebrews 4:6 It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in , because of their disobedience. Hebrews 4:11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience. It is a direct implication that every act of disobedience is an act of the will. Can you clarify first my question at the beginning to avoid confussion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shepherdsgrace Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 880 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 4 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/28/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 19, 2006 According to the Old Testament and to nature we know that there are things which are done inadvertently....not on purpose. In fact God provided particular sacrifice for that type of sin. For instance there is manslaughter. The ax can fly apart and kill a man. It is totally wrong to kill someone. However, when not done on purpose it is different than premeditated murder. I do agree with St Worm in the fact that the sin nature runs so deep that we spend a life time discovering its action in us. And it is dangerous to be subjective about sin. However there are different types of sin therefore different consequences for sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted August 19, 2006 Leviticus 26:14 [ Punishment for Disobedience ] " 'But if you will not listen to me and carry out all these commands, Deuteronomy 28:15 [ Curses for Disobedience ] However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you: Jeremiah 43:7 So they entered Egypt in disobedience to the LORD and went as far as Tahpanhes. Hebrews 4:6 It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in , because of their disobedience. Hebrews 4:11 Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience. It is a direct implication that every act of disobedience is an act of the will. Can you clarify first my question at the beginning to avoid confussion? You clarify your own question yourself! My answer is clear as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st. Worm Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,447 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/26/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 19, 2006 I don't believe it is a sin if it isn't done willfully... That's a very shallow and dangerous view of sin and also a very subjective one. It also leads people to excuse their sins instead of confessing them. The sinful nature runs deep to the core, even in believers. It effects not only our sinful actions but our sinful inactions. Nothing scriptural about your concept of sin. sw Well if you are dismissing the sin in any way, then God will know. I don't think God condemns us for sins we don't realize we are commiting. However, once you know Jesus, you have no excuse not to realize your sins. And I suppose before you know Jesus, you are condemned in your sins whether you know them or not. Very confusing business. The Law demands we continually and without failure love God and love our neighbor. Our failure to do that is rarely something we are conscious of yet we are sinning anyway. Sinning by breaking God's Law is not only failure to do what we should not but also failure to not do what we should. To think sin in only something we are aware of is unbiblical and perhaps worse than Pelagianism. sw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted August 19, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted August 19, 2006 To think sin in only something we are aware of is unbiblical and perhaps worse than Pelagianism. You are right. Even in acts in which we unknowingly sin, they remain willful acts, and we are held accountable nevertheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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