Guest StElsewhere Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 The non-problem with atheists...they don't realize that their opinion of Jesus Christ/GOD... is only of significance to 2 individuals...Them and Jesus!...and expounding their "fool-heartiness" only shines light on it for all to see and admire... The Word Of God has 6 references to whom God calls "Fools" Read: Psa 14:1 [[To the chief Musician, [A Psalm] of David.]] The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, [there is] none that doeth good. Psa 53:1 [[To the chief Musician upon Mahalath, Maschil, [A Psalm] of David.]] The fool hath said in his heart, [There is] no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: [there is] none that doeth good. Pro 17:16 Wherefore [is there] a price in the hand of a fool to get wisdom, seeing [he hath] no heart [to it]? Pro 17:21 He that begetteth a fool [doeth it] to his sorrow: and the father of a fool hath no joy. Pro 17:24 Wisdom [is] before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool [are] in the ends of the earth. Ecc 6:8 For what hath the wise more than the fool? what hath the poor, that knoweth to walk before the living? Congratulations!...You know know officially what the LORD thinks of your opinion of HIM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agape_CTL Posted October 26, 2007 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 74 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/04/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/12/1978 Share Posted October 26, 2007 (edited) Nothing is scary about an atheist. They are people that God made. They don't believe it, but that does not change it. As a christian, the more I trust God the less I fear everything else. Christians are commanded to share the gospel, it is part of what we do as believers. If we did not do this we would not show are love for God. In my opinion, far to many arguments have been caused by christians vs. atheist. (One argument is one to many.) If you don't believe, your disbelife won't change my belife. We can still be friends, anyone who thinks otherwise has not absorbed that Jesus was a friend to the sinner. The fact that the atheist does not believe should not change my behavior. Love God first. Love your neighbor as yourself. Love each other as Jesus loves us. Love your enemy. These are the commands I live by. This is what Jesus told christians to live by. Edited October 26, 2007 by Agape_CTL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ_Sheep Posted October 28, 2007 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 62 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/20/1983 Share Posted October 28, 2007 (edited) I, for one, am not afraid of atheist nor atheism, both are tools set up by Satan to tickle the fancies of those struggling with their faiths ... and to lead others whom are straddling the fences on what they believe away. Oh, sure, I will say this though, I agree with the one guy on this thread whom said that he isn't concerned by atheist, so much as he is concerned by their practical and logical way of viewing the world and working and influencing others. The atheists' biggest weapon, in my view, is appealing to the emotions of others. When god clearly said, do not be moved by the natural senses, but by the word of god. If there is suffering in the world, and enough camera's are around to catch it in the act, it is quite easy to convince a few hundred thousand, possibly millions of other people that a "loving god", would never let this occur, if he could be known and, if, he really existed. Head knowledge and reasoning will always support philosophy. We are called to walk by faith, and quite honestly, walking by faith doesn't and shouldn't make sense. You tell me how it made sense for god to tell Peter to fish during the day (at a time where fish would not be out) and let down his nets for a drop ... and for him to expect a huge catch? It didn't. Or when he told one of his disciples to go catch the first fish, open it's mouth ... and pay his tax with the coin he found in the fish's mouth? That too took faith and NOT common-sense. What I will say is, it is easy to persuade people when you are very well spoken, can form an articulate and catchy sentence and when you play on the emotions of others. Atheist many times, can do all three. It may be a slight stereotype here, but IMHO, most of the atheist I know or have been in contact with have college degrees. Now I am not knocking education, because I went to a pretty good college myself, but I am saying that there's a certain aura that oozes from many folks when they amass degree after degree. Many feel they have arrived and don't need a moral code, or a savior to depend on. Or as in the atheist's case, don't believe at all. Education and what doors it can open for a person in many instances, becomes their god whether they admit that or not. And that is cancerous and a detriment to society. As in anything, nobody really fears philosophy personally, but they are concerned about how, once spread, it can affect the thinking of others. Especially those whom are in a political position of power, those in the business of changing and legislating laws. No wonder they're trying to ease god or Christ out of the school system. I don't think there has been an age in recorded history not this one, that Satan has fought so vehemently on getting prayer out of public schools. Once again, he works through the spirit of atheism to accomplish his many of his ends. Edited October 28, 2007 by Christ_Sheep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asajoseph Posted October 29, 2007 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 11 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/21/1983 Share Posted October 29, 2007 As someone who knows a great number of atheists, I can assure you of one thing for certain - they DO have morals. What they usually don't have, however, is a consistent philosophical and logical grounding for those morals that can sustain the same challenges that objectivist morality can - but instead of accusing them all of doing the devil's dirty work, shouldn't they be encouraged to continue with those behaviours that are considered to be moral, and encourage them to question why they hold the views that they do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christ_Sheep Posted October 29, 2007 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 62 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/20/1983 Share Posted October 29, 2007 As someone who knows a great number of atheists, I can assure you of one thing for certain - they DO have morals. What they usually don't have, however, is a consistent philosophical and logical grounding for those morals that can sustain the same challenges that objectivist morality can - but instead of accusing them all of doing the devil's dirty work, shouldn't they be encouraged to continue with those behaviours that are considered to be moral, and encourage them to question why they hold the views that they do? Really liked this reply ... but if you look a little closer to my post, I figured you probably honed in on the part where I mentioned that atheist are devoid of a moral code, however, I wrote in also "or that they dont believe in the existence of a god" which implied, that some do have morals, and some just dont believe in god. I do think questioning them on why they hold the views and morals they do would be very vital. I think one answer one may get is, "Well, everyone knows right and wrong ... society decides what is right for all people." Which would be bogus, just because nobody has or ever had that type of creativity to decide universal law, or what is good for one person and not good for another. That knowledge is definitely inspired by something or somebody. But I like what you had to say alot. You have to fight logic with logic sometimes, if you plan to get to the heart or meat of a matter. Challenge people on their beliefs and why they believe what they believe, that goes for those whom call themselves Christians, too. You'll find some interesting things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo1 Posted October 30, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,822 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/16/1967 Share Posted October 30, 2007 damo1 so simple question ethical atheist i am runing into sevral of them know and if you are so worried why people hate you so much why people seem to fear you so much how about we cut to the chase hear and you start confronting your atheist buds i mean you find your self on a christian forum and you some how can not handle how openly us christians talk when you go threw a topic you dont think you just say something right now i am going to chase a person around the board until he wakes up to him self oh i too have atheist frends and some of my friends do not go on complaining al the time and dont blame god for what is going on know in the world so easy to blame god for what mother nature does and then go on about starving children and so on and so on i find you guys to be very offensive in how you aproach things you can not get on with those that are not like you do you want me to keep going this is my answer to your question hear if you want others to see you in a diffrent light than how about pulling up your own kind and telling them to pulll their heads in from damo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo1 Posted October 30, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,822 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/16/1967 Share Posted October 30, 2007 All the evidence point toward the fact that there must be a creater so a true atheist refuses to believe inspite of the evidence not because of it.And yes you have completely missed my point.2ndly to think that calling hypocrites christians is tolerance is obserd.It is far from morally mature.To claim christianity then live a life of sin and debotchory is shameless at best and blasphamy at worst.I have no fear of atheist I pity them aswell as others who do not know Christ as their saviour.This life on this earth is but a blink of the eye compared to eternity.All who reject the salvation freely offered to them by God the creater will have chosen for themselves to burn for all of eternity,never ending on and on forever and ever.This is not what I want for you or any one neither does God that is why Jesus gave his life to save yours. Ok, I'm going to be open to your claims. Can you back up your first claim with some of the evidence you say there is for a Creator? Yes, I want some concrete evidence for the extraordinary claim that a complex and creative minded being designed life. I do not refuse to believes things for which there is sufficient evidence, I just have no seen sufficient evidence for the claim that there exists a Creator. On the other hand I've seen scientific study after scientific study in support of natural origins of life. Well I certainly don't claim myself a Christian, and arguably I don't actually commit too many sins as described in the Bible as I was raised and still live in a Christian household, and I respect the lifestyle and moral attitude. But I also believe Christianity has a lot wrong with it, especially the idea of absolute moral laws ... that is an unchanging code that cannot shift along with changes in society. This presents a real problem as science uncovers more mysteries, and more ethical issues with which religious tends to poke it's head into on completely unsubstantiated grounds. I'm certainly not worried about burning for all eternity, but it humbles me that you believe your God has designated such a place for me, he really does care My life is not in danger, I am in no need of saving. I'm just living, and I'm trying to live as honestly and truthfully as I can, and that means I won't sell my soul to any religion, no matter how appealing, if it rests on the tenets of faith and superstition. damo1 Tuesday October 30th 2007 to Joel Wild Tree there is your answer you just stated it your self so why are you going to waste our time are you still willing to call me an ass in cyber space knowing that you are in your comfort zone and you Will never see me but you can just type away stupid things like with what nature does with the starving children and oh hear is a good one you Atheits like to use is this every thing is gods fault not Satan's fault as you said you do not believe that their is a god but some how think that Satan is a good guy by the way i am watching my grammer hear since you like to be so perfect and pick out other peoples faults hear and leave it out in the open for every one to read and have not evan said sorry for bluntly attacking with out thinking what the op in the other post was saying so you feel you have not broken any of gods commands and you feel that god Will not send you to hell well you got a long way to go my Friend i use to blame god to to what was happening in my country as i am from a war torn country and i was taught at a young age to kill the Serbians who wear constantly killing us and coming up with new ways to get rid of us Croatians so you think that one day i woke up and said i believe in god and all of a sudden you say to me in this post is god the author of evil and ignore all that i say thinking that you Will be able to pick some ideas with me like in your post does Satan have a soul or can Satan be forgiven do you feel that you can pick me out and get into a decent debate ? how about you try to openly call me an ass know so every one hear that reads this topic can see how much of a man or fool you are when the op hear is asking what makes an atheist scary ? you my friend have just shown ethical atheist why we hate guys like you so much if i wear you i would curb your tongue around Christians my atheist Friend just because you can not see me face to face and think you are safe and can type anything away i am a real person with feelings as well tel me something my atheist friend since you want to get on an attack and attack our faith have you seen a dead body or person have you lived in a war torn country and seen those that you grow up with in your village shot or have you heard a women scream for help when she is being raped by 5 Serbians and you seem to think that i just woke up one day and said i believe in you god hay i use to mock god and every single Christian to their face just like what you are doing know oh i also had a drug dealer by the throat and nearly killed him but it must have been the good person in me telling me to stop when all along i wanted to kill this drug dealer the cop in the main town did not even throw me in the cells instead he shook my hands and he was a Catholic and he could even work out what i was encountering when i had this drug dealer by his throat so do you feel you could handle killing a person and being taught from a young age how to use a gun my atheist Friend and stil have the nerve to correct me and get us to openly talk with you when al you want to do is debate and give out silly one questions oh my brother too this day is stil serving in the croation army and is a snipper and he knows about me giving my life over to god as he has seen the changes with in and is talking to christians in my own country as he lost every single friend he went to school with so my atheist friend do you feel i am making all this up and talking as one would say from my head with out hard evidance to back up what i am saying ? i dont think that i would be that much of a fool to leave something like this in cyber space for every one to read i am going to ask you a question why do you then like wasting peoples time if you feel you are happy wear you are at in your life ? if i wear you i would openly say sorry for calling me an ass and then we can talk normaly to what you want answerd from damo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo1 Posted October 30, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,822 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/16/1967 Share Posted October 30, 2007 damo1 to Joel Wild Tree whats the matter my atheist friend have you got nothing to say to me yet Will attack this person or try to debate with onwings ase eagles yet when some one from a war torn country who has been taught to use a gun and who has been taught to kill and hate his fellow Serbians you seem to back off tell me something all that you say is off TV and from what you read in the local paper unless you got hard evidence to what you seem to say on suffering and the poor and natural disasters if i wear you i would keep my mouth shut as you seem to me like a mummys boy who just wants to stir trouble and say i am doing every thing right have you lived on the streets have you slept in a run down motel and used a dirty carpet as a blanket have you seen what jail is like with out giving me the TV version to what jail is like ? as this was my life everything i have now in my own home i have had to work hard for it and i have had to fight to get to wear i am know i did not even have my parents around me i have been on my own since i was 14 as my dad left Yougoslavia but left my brother for his father to look after him as dad wanted out as he had enough of the violence and the killing and we got out when this government was calling all different people from all over the world to come and live and work in Australia we got in because we had proof that we wear also from a war torn country when i sleep i stil hear guns going off in the back of my head in my dreams i see the land mines i use to dodge as a child i still see me carrying a gun every day i pray for my brothers protection and safety as what happened in cosavo he was behind the enemy lines helping out and he killed many Serbians all in the name of freedom and justice for our people and the other people from different parts of the world that settled in the village i grew up in do you want more evidence my atheist friend i can give you a ph number and people to talk to see if i am making all this up as i said i am not a fool to leave this in cyber space and i do not type away and say what i like just to offend some one and cal them an ass and think i am safe in my own home as i can not see the other person typing away you got some one from the other side of the world stating this for every one to read in cyber space so Joel wild tree i am know going to ask for some hard proof why do you feel you can come on line and question or debate with us Christians on our faith ? when you Will not even hear what we have to say and you think that you Will not go to hell that my father in heaven will say forgive you and say welcome ? i am going to chase you around the boards Joel wild tree until i get a sorry from you calling me an ass in this post is god the author of evil you should know this post very well know i am going to ask you a question can you live the life i have lived as a young child and handle your father telling you to kill every Serbian and telling you at such a young age to hate them as they are your enemy this is how us croation boy are brought up who stil to this day live in yugoslavia by the way i am not bitter hear as i had to ask god to forgive me for every single hatred i had to wards my fellow Serbian brothers yet my past is still evident as this is apart of me and who i am as a Christian i just did not wake up one day and said i believe in you god forgive me he chased after me and showed me how real he was so if you feel i am making this up then i dare you to put the challenge up other wise curb your tongue as i said when it comes to other Christians on this sight and you have given ethical atheist a good reason to his question in what makes an atheist scary and i have atheist friends my self bud who do not talk like you do and show Christians the respect they deserve with out pointing the finger at god and blaming every thing on god because the TV or paper says so from damo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo1 Posted October 30, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,822 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/23/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/16/1967 Share Posted October 30, 2007 and you have given ethical atheist a good reason to his question in what makes an atheist scary and i have atheist friends my self bud who do not talk like you do and show Christians the respect they deserve with out pointing the finger at god and blaming every thing on god because the TV or paper says so I'm sorry about calling you an ass, that was quite uncalled for on my part, and I suppose I let my emotions take a bit of hold over my reasoning, won't happen again. I'm not trying to insult you here damo, but I'm not sure exactly what you're saying, are you saying that the fact that I've given good reasons that makes me scary? Are you scared that there is truth in what I'm saying? I'm giving reasons that I find valid and convincing, because they are some of the reasons that led me to leave my own religion. So you are asking for complete respect of your beliefs? No, I can't give you that, because I don't honestly believe that what you believe is true. I will respect any person, regardless of beliefs ... but I won't necessarily respect the beliefs that person holds. I don't respect Christianity, but I respect most Christians as people, because they are good people. If nobody questions something, if it cannot be subject to any level of criticism, then it will always hold a level of unquestioned power .. you certainly wouldn't want other religions such as Islam to go unquestioned right? Atheism is also deserved of criticism, anyone who can bring rational reasonable arguments against the position of Atheists is more than welcome! The only way we come to any resolve is by exhausting our resource of reasons for each position, and judging for ourselves as unbiased as possible which one holds more truth. Nonetheless, even though I don't think religions deserve any extra respect, that doesn't mean I go around insulting religion day to day, in fact I don't really think about religion outside of coming to this website to the apologetics forum and exercising my rational thinking skills. After all I live in a house of religious people, and it's not an issue, I don't disrespect my family, or ever insult them. This forum though is a designated place for the discussion of defending the Christian faith, as well as presenting the other side of the debate. damo1 wed 31st of october 2007 To Joel Wild Tree accepted that is one thing i do not let get in my way when it comes to comunicating on line wear i can not see the other person typing away as i go by a common rule and that is the person is a real person so if i do not want to be offended then i be as you would say nice and show the person i am debating wth or comunicating with that i see you as a real person know to your question you asked me do you feel that their is truth to what you are saying i feel their is no hard truth as i was their my self and as i left for you to read i also have atheist freinds i grew up with these guys hear in Australia and we do not get into stupid debates like this and waste each others time or alow emotions to get in the way of our friend ship wel that is your choice and i can not force my views and what i belive in down your throat i am not that sort of person that does this to others and i dont shut my self off but i try to get to know the person and i put the hand out weather they hate what i belive in i dont play god as i have also ran into christians that have nothing better to do then look down on a person and like to play god and when ever i run into some one that likes to play god i challange them as this is no way for any christian to behave as this gives people like my self a bad name and i wil chase that person that likes to play god until they see that they are in the wrong with what you said about islam i come down on these lunatics as these guys are worshiping a cult leader not a god as mohamed is a false god and i say it to immams to muslims who belive that mohamed is a god to their face and i look them in the eye when i do this with out blinking as this is just the way i am i dont bow down to them i do not let them scare me and why should we be ? what they need to see is that the koran is very twisted it is the gospel for terroisem that is all the koran is as i had a chance to read the koran and i found it very twisted their wear times i had to throw it to the side yet when i read gods word i do not get angry and i can read the bible for some time i am not preaching to you i am just showing to you that i am a person with in my own rights to belive that god is real just as you are with in your own rights to hold on to your views on atheisem and defend what you hold onto i wil defend on what i belive the bible tells me with out shame as i stand proud in what gods son did for me on the cross and i need not to question the bible or the religon its self i question the people with in the religon when i see them behaving like those in the world as this just puts down what i went threw as a young child and it puts down christ him self as his death would have been in vian for us christians i did this for too long and it got me no wear i was very skeptical when it comes to this religon because of the many fake christians i ran into so i stayed wear i was i had also friends in the ocult and people even fear my friends thinking that they are crazy or mad for who they worship yet these people are also human one of my best friends is a satanic preist he is a christian know and does not do what he use to but i know some one who is into black magic and we constantly say hello to each other with out getting into a debate and putting each other down for what we belive in the guys i use to work for in kings cross in sydney use to also think they wear good guys they had familys them selves and they even owned the strip clubs i found my self working in these men wear involved in traficking women from other countrys would go to sunday mass at the cathlic churches near to wear they lived give money that was not even theirs but blood money and it should have been given to these women instead it was given to the cathlic priests these men would constantly sit in the coffession box with the priest on the other side and say bless me father it has been over 8 months since my last conffesion knowing in their own heads they are hypocrities and their are women who have been sepperated from their familys and even their own kids and have the nerve to ask a cathlic priest to forgive them and then give a big donation to the cathlic church these priests wear not stupid as some think they wear when it came to blood money being given to the cathlic church by these criminals mean while the women they payed for and had snuck into this country suffer and get harshly treated but they see them selves as a good person until the royal inquest was held on the strip clubs and the coruption with in the corrupted police force and investigation on the corrupted detectives and police officers that would work hand in hand with these thugs my Job was to look after these women i stood up for sevral of them when the boss would hit them for no reason and i would hit him around a few times just to show him what a women feels when a tuff man hits her this is how wild i was due to the way i was bought up and often had no fear so can you see what i am saying hear to you prople are people how we live life is up to us its how we treat humans that needs to be adressed and looked at not in what i or you hold onto if you want people to understand why you belive in what you belive learn to be less judgmental and dont always throw what mother nature does or what you see happening as you could get some one like my self that has been their and you wil offend to the point wear you will be openly challanged when i talk to an Atheist i look them in the eye and i show atheists i see them for who they are and dont come down on them i hope i have shown you what sort of person i am not all christians are bad you might get the odd ball that does give us decent good christians a bad name just like you would with those who belive in atheisem give you guys a bad name i hope you have a good week from damo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwcrenshaw Posted November 2, 2007 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/10/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted November 2, 2007 What if one of his (the atheist's) own "laws" is understanding and respecting human life and empathizing with human suffering, thus actually prohibiting himself from actions that harm or cause suffering (what you referred to as dangerous). I hold myself to this "law" as you call it because I recognize my own need to live with as little suffering and harm inflicted upon myself. If I prohibited behavior that was physically harmful and dangerous, likely to cause suffering, then I would be prohibiting it against my own self as well, which isn't the type of society I'd like to be living in. Just because people have decisions for themselves doesn't mean they chose inherently selfishly. I completely agree and I think it comes down a matter of self respect with regards to what standard someone holds themselves to...and respect for humanity in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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