In the beginning........

[hupo]

While going over the Old Testament I came across the first verse (yet again) and was stopped dead in my tracks by a question.....

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

In the beginning of what?

. . . .. . .. .. ... . .. . . .

Let me dissect this:-

God was, is and always will be.

In the beginning God created ...........

In the beginning of what?

The beginning of His creation? ok.........

God created something finite, something with a beginning.

Now there is something in the universe that is finite

Is this creation, God Himself?

No, God is the Creator.

So there are two "things" in the universe now:

God, the Creator, who is infinite and timeless

and the creation, that is finite.

If there are two things then God is "only" one of the two.

If there are two things, it means God is not everything...or , not Omnipresent.

We know that is not so. We know that God is omnipresent which brings us to the logical fact that God, the Creator, AND His creation, are one and the same....

God created Man. Are Man and God one and the same?

If God and Man are one and the same, it means "I" am just an illusion. I don't really exist as a separate entity.

The difference between a believer in God and an atheist is the first believes God exists while the 2nd believes Man exists....

Being a believer, my question would be:

"Am I? and if so, WHO am I?"

(an amusing answer I got was "Who is asking?")

I must emphesize once again that anything said here has no effect whatsoever on The Truth

So that we can now relax, not be afraid of ruining God's plans, and just have fun

Anyone?

Blessings in Yeshua

[tsth]

In the beginning of what?

His Word.

In the beginning was.............The Word.

Nothing was made without It/Him.

All of life is contained within God's Word.

Everything that takes place is within God's Word.

John 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 He was with God in the beginning.

3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

The Word is Eternal/Everlasting.

The Word Endures Forever.

1 Peter 1:24 For, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field; the grass withers and the flowers fall, 25 but the word of the Lord stands forever."

1 Peter 1:23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

In the beginning of what?

I believe this is talking about the beginning of time as WE know it in it's finite-ness.

Good question!

[hupo]

In the beginning of what?

His Word.

In the beginning was.............The Word.

Nothing was made without It/Him.

All of life is contained within God's Word.

Everything that takes place is within God's Word.

John 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 He was with God in the beginning.

3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

The Word is Eternal/Everlasting.

The Word Endures Forever.

1 Peter 1:24 For, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field; the grass withers and the flowers fall, 25 but the word of the Lord stands forever."

1 Peter 1:23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

In His Love,

Suzanne

Thanks Suzanne, but I still have this same issue......

It cannot be the beginning of the Word, as to your own words....

The Word is Eternal/Everlasting.

The Word Endures Forever.

If the Word is eternal and everlasting, it cannot have a beginning or end.

A beginning is, by definition a part of something finite.

God, the Word, is Infinite so it cannot be the beginning of the Word.....

I do believe God is infinite and everlasting, as you wrote

So my question... God created the heaven and the earth in the beginning of ...what?....still stands

You also mentioned (John 1:3) Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

Which I have no problem with except that it raises the question of....who am I? Am I part of God? because if I'm not, then I am something apart from God which means God is not everything........

In Yeshua

[hupo]

In the beginning of what?

I believe this is talking about the beginning of time as WE know it in it's finite-ness.

Good question!

You know, maybe you are right and the key to this is the emphasis on WE....

What we know is finite and limited. Even time is limitless but we cannot comprehend that as humans. To us it is limited and has a beginning and end.

Maybe it is so to keep us from loosing our minds.......

This is a good direction to check

Thanks

[OopsMartin]

I'd say in the beginning of TIME.

[hupo]

I don't know......

We'll have to define Time in order to "blame" it for having a beginning

Let's assume for the discussion that Time has a beginning. It would mean that time is a limited entity.

God is omnipresent and limitless. Is Time the same as God?

Not if it's limited. But if not then it is something else.

But if so there is now God and there is Time. Two separate entities!

So God is everything....except Time?

Or is Time, one with God?

If it is, then Time is limitless (just as God is) and HAS NO BEGINNING

Boggles the mind, doesn't it?

Blessings

[Guest shiloh357]

God trasncends time space and matter. Time as we know it is measured by the observable relationship of the earth as it moves among the luminaries and as at least a few of the luminaries move in their relationship to the earth.

God is eternal, and eternity by definition, has no beginning and no end. It is a concept that is hard for the human mind to conceive. Time is both relative and finite as are we, so we are limited to thinking in linear terms. God is not limited to linear time. The future is, in God's perspective already accomplished fact.

God's view on time and our view is like the difference between watching a parade by standing on the street beside the parade where you limited to only seeing what is front of you, vs. standing on 12 twelve story building where you can see the entire parade from its point of origin all the way to where the parade route stops and disbands. Standing on the twelve story building is much the same way God transcends time. He can see the end and the beginning all at once.

In the Beginining... "Bereshis" "At the first..." Gen 1:1 is a synopis of the entire 1st chapter of Genesis.

[HAZARD]

While going over the Old Testament I came across the first verse (yet again) and was stopped dead in my tracks by a question.....

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

In the beginning of what?

. . . .. . .. .. ... . .. . . .

Let me dissect this:-

God was, is and always will be.

In the beginning God created ...........

In the beginning of what?

The beginning of His creation? ok.........

God created something finite, something with a beginning.

Now there is something in the universe that is finite

Is this creation, God Himself?

No, God is the Creator.

So there are two "things" in the universe now:

God, the Creator, who is infinite and timeless

and the creation, that is finite.

If there are two things then God is "only" one of the two.

If there are two things, it means God is not everything...or , not Omnipresent.

We know that is not so. We know that God is omnipresent which brings us to the logical fact that God, the Creator, AND His creation, are one and the same....

God created Man. Are Man and God one and the same?

If God and Man are one and the same, it means "I" am just an illusion. I don't really exist as a separate entity.

The difference between a believer in God and an atheist is the first believes God exists while the 2nd believes Man exists....

Being a believer, my question would be:

"Am I? and if so, WHO am I?"

(an amusing answer I got was "Who is asking?")

I must emphesize once again that anything said here has no effect whatsoever on The Truth

So that we can now relax, not be afraid of ruining God's plans, and just have fun

Anyone?

Blessings in Yeshua

Hi hupo.

Just when did God create and make the material universe?

The Bible says that the heavens cannot be measured and the host of heaven cannot be counted (Jer. 31:37; 33:22-25). If this is true then the material universe is vast beyond conception, and as God has existed from all eternity it is also hard to concieve that He only decided a few millenniums ago to do something.

In answer to this question the Bible tells us that, "In the beginning [literally, by periods or ages] God created the heaven [Hebrew, heavens] and the earth," it does not say "Six thousand years ago God created the heavens and the earth," as is generally taught by man. Does anyone know just when the beginning was? If anyone does know, then they know more than God as revealed. If no one knows just when the beginning was then it stands to reason that we just do not know and therefore, we should not teach that the beginning was 6,000 years ago. As far as any man knows it could have been six billion years ago.

When we speak of the six days and the creation of the present life in Earth, we can speak with definate authority that it was 6,000 years ago. This can be seen by the lengths of the various dispensations since Adam.

Some teachers use Exodus 20:8-11; 31:17 to prove that the heavens and the Earth were created in the six days of Gen. 1:3-2:25, and therefore, that they were created about 6,000 years ago. However, nothing is said of the original creation of the heavens and the Earth in these passages. In these Scriptures the Hebrew, asah, meaning to make out of already existing material, is used instead of the word bara, to creat. These verses picture the re-creation work of the six days, and not the original creation "In the beginning." Asah never means to create.

Undoubtedly, God created and made the different parts of the material universe and each thing therein, using the same care as in the six days when He restored the planet Earth to a habitable state and made a new order of Earth creatures, after its destruction and ruin caused by the first war ever fought. This war was a cataclismic battle between God and Satan, when Lucifer invaded Heaven to cast God out. Satan was defeated and cast back down to the Earth, as is written in Isa. 14:12-14; Luke 10:18. This war was fought long before the days of Adam, for Lucifer was already a fallen creature when he came into Adams Eden. For an unknown period, there was an original social system on this Earth ruled by Lucifer as proved in (Isa. 14:12-14; 45:18; Jer. 4:23-26; Ezek. 28:11-17; 2 Pet. 3:5-7). Along with this origional social system there were land animals, birds, fish, and other creatures created, and they were destroyed in the flood of Gen. 1:2; Ps. 104:5-9; 2 Pet. 3:5-7. It is to this period that all fossils and remains of animals belong, as well as geological formations of the Earth.

Between these original creation's of God, "In the beginning' and the creations of the six days, is revealed the rule of Lucifer on the earth for an unknown period, his rebellion against God, the Earth's first sinful career, the defeat of Lucifer by God, and the overthrow of his kingdom by the first recorded flood on the earth in Gen. 1:2. Lucifer was the first ruler on the earth and he already had his period of Earth rule and his fall by the time of Adam.

In the work of the six days, it is stated that God with His hands FORMED each of the living creatures and man out of the dust of the ground (Gen. 1:20-27; 2:7-25; Job 26:13; Rom. 9:20; 1 Tim. 2:13). It is not only clear that God created the heavens and the Earth and all things "In the beginning," or each in its own period, but it is also clear the God FORMED all things with His hands. God formed both light anddarkness (Isa. 24:7). He did not do this on the first day of Gen 1:3-5, for at that time He merely DIVIDED them. Therefore THEY MUST HAVE BEEN CREATED AND FORMED before the first day. It is also stated that God with His hands FORMED the Earth (Ps. 8:3, 6; 90:2; 95:5); the heavens (Ps. 8:3; 9:1; 102:25; Isa. 40:12; the planets (Ps.8:3; Isa. 40:26; 45:12; 48:13; Heb. 1:10) and all things (Prov. 26:10). From a study of all these Scriptures and those on the creation af all things, it is clear that by the Word of God the materials were brought into existence, and then by His hands God formed the materials into the various parts of the universe. That is, as God spoke, the materials came into existence and as fast as they materialized He used them to form all things with His hands. (Ps. 8:3; 2 Pet. 3:3-9; Prov. 26:10).

Judging from what was done by God in six days, it took God a long time to originnaly create or bring into existence the material and use it to form with His hands each sun, moon, star, planet, and each creature that inhabits the vast endless universe. God took one day to merly divide the light from the darkness on this little planet Earth. How much time He originally took to bring into existence all the light and darkness of the entire universe is not known, but evidently He took a longer time than one day. God took one day to divide the waters which covered the Earth and restore the firmament and took one day to restore the earth and set bounds to the seas, therefore He naturally took a much longer period to originally bring the materials into existence and form the waters, the firmament, and the earth with its many mountains and valleys. God took one day to complete solar regulation in connection with the restored Earth, but He evidently used a much longer period to originally bring into existence and formwith His own hands the vast heavens and all the suns, moons, stars, and planets that are without number. God took two days to form the fish, fowls, beasts,, man and woman. He naturally took a much longer period to originally creat and form each inhabitant of the vast heavens and the many animals and inhabitants who originally lived on the Earth during Lucifer's kingdom, long before the chaos of Gen 1:2 and the six days of Gen.1:3-2-25.

In other words, if God took six days to restore one little planet to a habitable state and form new inhabitants for the earth, He would naturally take a much longer time to originally create and form with His hands the vast universe with all of its innumerable suns and planets along with their inhabitants.

Regarding time, Scripture teaches that eternity is made up of time and that time shall not cease. There is a time and a season for everything done under the sun (Eccl. 3). God originally made the sun, moon, and starsto regulate times and seasons on the eternal Earth. The work of day four was the permanent restoration of the solar system in connection with the restored Earth, to divide the day from the night; and to be for signs and for sseasons, and for days and years forever (Gen. 1:14-18). This solar regulation causing eternal time on the Earth is eternal: "They shall fear thee as long as the sun and moon endure, throughout all generations . . . .His name shall endure for ever: His name shall be continued as long as the sun" (Ps. 72: 5 and 17); "I have sworn unot David my servant, Thy seed will I establish for ever . . . . his throne as the days of Heaven . . . . as the sun before me. It shall be established forever as the moon" (Ps. 89:4, 27-37).

God promised Noah that there would be day and night, summer and winter, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, forever on the Earth (Gen. 8:22).

The Earth is eternal; so time made up of seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, and years is also eternal (Eccl. 1:4; Ps. 104:5). When the Bible says "There shall be no lnight there" it speaks of the city, the New Jerusalem, and not the Earth outside of the city (Rev. 21:23-27).

We are in eternity now. As we have seen in the above Scriptures, eternity has always existed for God has always existed from everlasting to everlasting (Ps. 41:13).

"For thus saith the high and lofty ONE that inhabiteth eternity, who's name is Holy . . . "(Isa. 57:15), and eternity will be made up of time as we now know it; so if time continues eternally as it is now, in the sense of being eternal time we are now in eternity. We do not mean by this that we are now in our eternal state, for that will not be true until we enter into immortality (1 Cor. 15:51-58; Phil. 3:20-21). But we can truly say that we are in time that will be eternal and that we are in part of eternity now.

Just what God did in the eternal dateless past no one knows, for He has not revealed His activities from all eternity past (Deut. 29:29). All we know is that God existed from all eternity, and that sometime in the dateless past God brought into being the heavens and the earth and all things originally made therein.

That God existed from all eternity is very clear in Scripture: "Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hast formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God" (Ps. 90:2). "Thy throne is established of old; thou art from everlasting" (Ps.93:2; Prov. 8:22-31; Micah 5:2; Heb. 9:14; John 1:1-3; Rev. 1:4-8; 4:8; 22:5, 13).

If God is from the eternal past, which is time past, and God, man, and the Earth will continue into the eternal future, then continued time, which is time from now on into eternity, then we can say time has always existed with God, or there would be no mentioning of time eternal "past."

God is from everlasting to everlasting. Everlasting what? Everlasting time of course.

[Guest]

"Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God."

Matthew 22:29

I believe this is talking about the beginning of time as WE know it in it's finite-ness.

The Beginning

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Genesis 1:1

The End Of Time

And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

Revelation 10:6

The End

And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

Revelation 20:11

All Things New

And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Revelation 21:5

Say Hay Dear Brothers And Sisters

Ever Notice.... Plant life was created The Day Before

And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

And the evening and the morning were the third day.

Genesis 1:11-13

The Sun, Moon And The Stars

And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,

And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

Genesis 1:16-19

Ain't That A Kick

Man Lords His Reason (Fantasy) Over The Power Of God And Gets It Backward - Again

The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

Psalms 14:1

Want Real Wisdom

If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

James 1:5

See God

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:16

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen.

Philemon 1:25

Love, Your Brother Joe