nebula Posted June 20, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.93 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted June 20, 2004 Dear nebula, sorry that you had to wait a bit longer for my reply. I don't have regular access to the net at the moment (as i am on holiday). Understood! i hope you have your question answered. Not really. What I want to know is what He has done for you personally. Not what He taught you and stuff like that. But is there any time you were in trouble and you called out His name and He saved you? Is you life changed somehow? Is He personal to you? Yes, I am looking for specifics that apply to you and you alone. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artsylady Posted June 20, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 171 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,813 Content Per Day: 0.64 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted June 20, 2004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluesun Posted June 20, 2004 Share Posted June 20, 2004 Dear nebula, What I want to know is what He has done for you personally. When i was 12 or 13 years old, i begged "please God, if you exist, show me a sign. I cannot believe in you, if i don't know about you. if you exist, please make me a believer". I've forgotten about that later on as other things became more important (as seemed to me at that time). At university, i've come in contact with muslims, learnt about islam and realised that it was the Truth. So God showed me the right path and made me a believer, praise be to God. Being a believer is the thing most dear to me. But is there any time you were in trouble and you called out His name and He saved you? Is you life changed somehow? Is He personal to you? Being a believer and having been lead to the right path has changed my life in this world (inner peace, being modest and patient, etc.) and more importantly, the life in the Hereafter [God willing], which is eternal and thus the real life. I can impossibly be aware of everything God does. (also with regard to my life). I am not aware of His 'actions'. He is aware of all of mine. God is very personal to me. I pray to Him directly, I ask Him directly for forgiveness and repent to Him directly (not through intermediary). I give charity because God loves people who give charity. I do my best to be kind and just, to forgive, to speak well and not to speak bad about anyone, because God loves people who do this. Dear artsylady, your post is very long. i'll try to answer it tomorrow. regards, marianne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted June 21, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.26 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 21, 2004 Bluesun, We know that Jesus Christ is the Way, Truth ,and Life. Not only that but He was fully God incarnate. To recognize this fact it must be revealed to us by the Father. Who does islam say Jesus is? As children of Abraham why do you not know that the Lord desires Mercy and not Sacrifice? Peace, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted June 21, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.93 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted June 21, 2004 Dear nebula, What I want to know is what He has done for you personally. When i was 12 or 13 years old, i begged "please God, if you exist, show me a sign. I cannot believe in you, if i don't know about you. if you exist, please make me a believer". I've forgotten about that later on as other things became more important (as seemed to me at that time). At university, i've come in contact with muslims, learnt about islam and realised that it was the Truth. So God showed me the right path and made me a believer, praise be to God. Being a believer is the thing most dear to me. But is there any time you were in trouble and you called out His name and He saved you? Is you life changed somehow? Is He personal to you? Being a believer and having been lead to the right path has changed my life in this world (inner peace, being modest and patient, etc.) and more importantly, the life in the Hereafter [God willing], which is eternal and thus the real life. I can impossibly be aware of everything God does. (also with regard to my life). I am not aware of His 'actions'. He is aware of all of mine. God is very personal to me. I pray to Him directly, I ask Him directly for forgiveness and repent to Him directly (not through intermediary). I give charity because God loves people who give charity. I do my best to be kind and just, to forgive, to speak well and not to speak bad about anyone, because God loves people who do this. You aren't aware of His actions? That's sad. If I wasn't aware of His actions in my life, I couldn't make it through this life. I remember one time I was crying for having lost my closest friends (for whatever reasons, all but one of my closest friends has transferred to different colleges), and I was crying to the Lord in my pain. Then a song came to me: When you're up against the wall I'll always be there for you, for you When you rise and when you fall I'll always be there for you, for you It's a recorded song that played on the radio, but the song just filled my thoughts. I knew the Lord was singing that song over me! Wow! I felt so loved by Him and my trust in His care over me was refreshed and strengthened. Do you know what it is like to feel so wrapped in God's love for you like that? It's the best feeling in the world! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2bba Posted June 21, 2004 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 393 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/21/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/05/1955 Share Posted June 21, 2004 out of desperation he called out to Jesus and was changed so much...that when he returned to his home and his wife...she was astonished by the look of his face..and she rushed off to the place where someone had introduced him to the Saviour and she was wonderfully changed as well...speaking to him and seeing the reality of the Holy Spirit beaming out of him was lovely..Our G-d is an awesome G-d who loves Moslems and wants to break into their lives with His love and His truth. Praise the Lord for their salvation. Conversion of the world through love (rather than hatred) is the only way we are going to achieve what Christ commissioned us to do. From this chart below I would say we have a long way to go, not just towards Muslims. After all we have the whole armor of God to help us in our quest to reach the lost and dying world. We should have compassion for those who have no compassion towards us. Pray. Christianity: 2 billion Islam: 1.3 billion Hinduism: 900 million Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 850 million Buddhism: 360 million Chinese traditional religion: 225 million primal-indigenous: 150 million African Traditional & Diasporic: 95 million Sikhism: 23 million Juche: 19 million Spiritism: 14 million Judaism: 14 million Baha'i: 6 million Jainism: 4 million Shinto: 4 million Cao Dai: 3 million Tenrikyo: 2.4 million Neo-Paganism: 1 million Unitarian-Universalism: 800 thousand Rastafarianism: 700 thousand Scientology: 600 thousand Zoroastrianism: 150 thousand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluesun Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Dear nebula, You aren't aware of His actions? That's sad. If I wasn't aware of His actions in my life, I couldn't make it through this life. What i was trying to say is that I am not aware of all of God's actions. I know He lead me to the straight path, as i became a muslim (submitter). I feel in my heart that He increased my faith in Him, that He made me patient and at peace. I am aware that God is the Sustainer [of everything and everyone]. So I know He is sustaining this Universe, the Laws of Physics, the Earth, ourselves, the Angels, Jinns and Satan, the accursed. It's a recorded song that played on the radio, but the song just filled my thoughts. I knew the Lord was singing that song over me! Wow! I felt so loved by Him and my trust in His care over me was refreshed and strengthened. How can you be so sure that 'the Lord was singing that song' over you? If i know one thing about God, then that no-one has ever seen Him, no-one knows His 'thoughts', and that He knows everything about us [thoughts, secrets, good and bad deeds, whereabouts etc.] but we know about Him only what He revealed to us through His prophets (peace be upon them all). The Bible contains a statement by Jesus (pbuh) which expresses similar description of God. So i am personally rather cautious in assigning this or that to God. I prefer to do so only where and when i can be sure that it is God's action [e.g. sustaining everything He has created, leading people to the right path]. Dear Dr. Luke, Who does islam say Jesus is? Jesus, son of Mary (pbuh) is a prophet sent by God. His mother, Mary, was a rightious believer and was a virgin when she gave birth to him (pbuh). Jesus (pbuh) will return to Earth to accomplish his mission from God. At that time, He will kill the Dijjal (someone who will falsely claim to be God and will lead many people astray) and establish God's Law on Earth. One of the illustrations given in the Koran by God as to why Jesus (pbuh) could not have been God is that both he and his mother ate food, i.e. they both needed to eat in order to stay alive. God, the Creator and Sustainer fo everything and everyone is not dependent upon food to survive. He is free from all need. This, very briefly, is what Islam says Jesus (pbuh) is, has done and will do. [God-willing]. As children of Abraham why do you not know that the Lord desires Mercy and not Sacrifice? Islam says that God is the Most-Merciful, Most-Forgiving and Most-Compassionate. What exactly are you referring to with 'sacrifice'? regards, marianne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluesun Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Dear artsylady, "As Christians, we know there will always be the enemies of God and we'll always be persecuted because we know there is a real devil." "This is earth, not heaven and evil is something we have to overcome spiritually - not by killing people."I have commented on these points in my previous post. Please have a look, if you can. And, "Does the Koran speak of Satan?"The Koran speaks of Satan [shaytan], the accursed, yes. God created Satan, the accursed. Thus, Satan, the accursed, is not equal in power to God [as I understand, in Christianity, Satan has the potential to challenge God], but subordinate and depends for everything on Him, as any other creation of God. The purpose of Satan, the accursed, in this world, is to test mankind. He tries to lead us from the straight path and to sin. Shaitaan has vowed that he will create such desires in mankind. He has said (as stated in the Qur'aan): "Surely I will arouse in them [mankind] false desires; and certainly I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and indeed I will order them to change the nature created by Allaah." [(4):119]. I said: It is strictly prohibited to kill any civilians, non-combatants, priests, rabbis, women, children, to destroy livelihood or the environment.Instructions of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) to Muslims who are forced to fight a war: "Do not kill women or children or non-combatants and do not kill old people or religious people,'' and he mentioned priests, nuns and rabbis. And he said, "Do not cut down fruit-bearing trees and do not poison the wells of your enemies." 5:32 "...if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole of mankind: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole of mankind..." I said: What do you exactly refer to with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted June 22, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.93 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Dear nebula, You aren't aware of His actions? That's sad. If I wasn't aware of His actions in my life, I couldn't make it through this life. What i was trying to say is that I am not aware of all of God's actions. I know He lead me to the straight path, as i became a muslim (submitter). I feel in my heart that He increased my faith in Him, that He made me patient and at peace. I am aware that God is the Sustainer [of everything and everyone]. So I know He is sustaining this Universe, the Laws of Physics, the Earth, ourselves, the Angels, Jinns and Satan, the accursed. Hey, Bluesun! Can you give me a specific testimony where your God has touched your life? I mean, a specific story of when you were lost and He found you or was found by you or gave you specific direction for a specific course of action or whatever. I'd like to hear an example, really. I can't relate to general concepts too well. How has He sustained you? Has He brought you comfort in the mindst of pain? Peace in the midst of confusion and despair? Assurance that you are not alone? Freedom from fear? Have you ever felt His presence? How would you describe the feeling of His presence? It's a recorded song that played on the radio, but the song just filled my thoughts. I knew the Lord was singing that song over me! Wow! I felt so loved by Him and my trust in His care over me was refreshed and strengthened. How can you be so sure that 'the Lord was singing that song' over you? If i know one thing about God, then that no-one has ever seen Him, no-one knows His 'thoughts', and that He knows everything about us [thoughts, secrets, good and bad deeds, whereabouts etc.] but we know about Him only what He revealed to us through His prophets (peace be upon them all). The Bible contains a statement by Jesus (pbuh) which expresses similar description of God. So i am personally rather cautious in assigning this or that to God. I prefer to do so only where and when i can be sure that it is God's action [e.g. sustaining everything He has created, leading people to the right path]. With all due respect, Bluesun, you are wrong. I know it was the Lord because I am still alive. If the Lord had not been so real and so personal to me, I would never have had a reason to keep on going. You see, I developed chronic depression early on in life, and I've fallen into several manic depressive episodes. I couldn't even begin to count the number of times I I was ready to end my life to end my pain. But each time, the Lord would somehow give Himself to me, grant me just one thing to hold on to, a reason to keep on living. Truly, my relationship with Jesus more often than not has been my one reason for not becoming another suicide statistic. Truly, the fear of a bad afterlife as punishment would not have stopped me. The picture of me hurting Jesus by doing such a thing did stop me. I love Jesus too much to want to hurt Him. I am sure you are preparing yourself to tell me that I'm blaspheming or that Jesus isn't so personal - or that God isn't so personal - or that Jesus isn't God, and other such rebuttals. But I know. I know what I went through. I know what kept me alive. I knew He who healed my brokenness. He's walked with me through these years. I am not ashamed to admit He was my life support system, and I don't mean in the "He's the sustainer of all" way - I mean in a very specific, personal way. And the feeling of God's presence? It's the most wonderful feeling in the world! I've heard from people who have experienced such that the feeling of His presence is better than the feeling they got by being drunk or drugged up. Please tell me, what does Allah have for me that could have kept me from killin gmyself? Would He have surrounded me with His love and with His presence? What can I find in Him that I have not found in Jesus? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted June 22, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.26 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 22, 2004 Bluesun, QUOTE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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