caughtinside Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30, 2008 The subject of Absurdism came up in the "celebrities" thread, and I thought it might be interesting to discuss in a thread of its own. I put it in this sub-forum because I think a key difference between absurdism and nihilism is that the former is open to the possibility that there can be values and meaning in a human's life. I'm not sure if it's okay to pull other people's comments from one thread and paste them in another, so nebula and Grungekid, if this interests you and you'd like to repost your thoughts here, they'll be very welcome. Here's a thought I had. A nihilist runs into a burning building to save some people. As he does, he observes himself doing it and says, "This is absurd!" And yet, he does it. That, I think, is what Kierkegaard was getting at in the comment I posted in the other thread. Here it is again (Found on the Wikepedia article on absurdism, interesting read): What is the Absurd? It is, as may quite easily be seen, that I, a rational being, must act in a case where my reason, my powers of reflection, tell me: you can just as well do the one thing as the other, that is to say where my reason and reflection say: you cannot act and yet here is where I have to act... The Absurd, or to act by virtue of the absurd, is to act upon faith ... I must act, but reflection has closed the road so I take one of the possibilities and say: This is what I do, I cannot do otherwise because I am brought to a standstill by my powers of reflection. All comments on absurdism, nihilism, etc. welcome. caughtinside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30, 2008 I think we all understand what 'absurd' means....what is the point you are trying to make? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caughtinside Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Absurdism is a philosophy. The nihilist in the burning building was making a pun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16 Absurdism is a philosophy stating that the efforts of humanity to find meaning in the universe ultimately fail (and, hence, are absurd) because no such meaning exists, at least in relation to humanity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absurdism Because He Rejects The LORD The Absurdest's Despondent Quest For Meaning Is Devoid Of Wisdom "For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end. Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will hearken unto you. And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart." Jeremiah 29:11-13 Nihilism (from the Latin nihil, nothing) is a philosophical position which argues that Being, especially past and current human existence, is without objective meaning, purpose, comprehensible truth, or essential value. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism Because He Rejects The Christ The Nihilist's Derisory Search For Truth Comes To Naught "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 14:6 When Confronted With The Eternal God How Absurd And Vain Becomes The Temporal Mind Of Man "While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal." 2 Corinthians 4:18 And How Pridefully Absurd For Folk To Claim They Know It All While Turning Up Their Nose At God's Holy Gift "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." John 3:18 And How Dangerously Unwise For Folk To Claim To Know Nothing While Hoping God Will Excuse Their Hate Filled Rejection Of HIS Holy Gift "And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil." John 3:19 Yet God Still Calls "The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee." Jeremiah 31:3 And God Still Reasons "Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool." Isaiah 1:18 And When God Speaks Will You Hear "He that hath ears to hear, let him hear. But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows, And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented." Matthew 11:15-17 Be Blessed Beloved The LORD bless thee, and keep thee: The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee: The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace. And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27 Love, Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted March 30, 2008 OK, I googled absurdism, and found this: Absurdism is a philosophy stating that the efforts of humanity to find meaning in the universe will ultimately fail (and, hence, are absurd) because no such meaning exists, at least in relation to humanity. Absurdism is related to Existentialism, though should not be confused with it. Absurdism has its roots in the 19th century Danish philosopher, S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan4257 Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 421 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30, 2008 This reminds me of the struggle faced by the writer of Ecclesiastes in the Bible. "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem. Vanity of vanities, saith the Preacher, vanity of vanities; all is vanity. What profit hath a man of all his labor which he taketh under the sun?" How absurd, and without Jesus Christ, how true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30, 2008 Absurdism is a philosophy. The nihilist in the burning building was making a pun. I understand what it is but....where are you trying to go with this? Is your point that there is no meaning of life or.....I don't get the relevance here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caughtinside Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 120 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/15/2008 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Absurdism is a philosophy. The nihilist in the burning building was making a pun. I understand what it is but....where are you trying to go with this? Is your point that there is no meaning of life or.....I don't get the relevance here. If there were NO meaning to life, the nihilist wouldn't have run into the burning building. Especially after he saw the absurdity of it. I mean, he being a nihilist! That's where I would like to go with this, to promote absurdism over nihilism. For all the nihilists that frequent this forum. I think this started with us talking about "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy", which I hope has something more than abject nihilism at its core. Absurdism, to me, is like a different way to react to the conclusion that the universe has no ultimate meaning. It's like saying, "Okay, and yet..." And yet the guy runs into the burning building. Maybe if we only lived in the intellectual world, we would all be nihilists, but humans are very emotional. I suspect that even our beliefs are strongly based in our emotions, not just our intellect. Grungekid, perhaps that's the crucial difference you were talking about--faith (emotion?) is lacking in one but not the other. I'm going to have a go through Ecclesiastes before I get back here! A parting classroom anecdote: I have a class of kindergartners whose first language is Chinese and they've been in an immersion English program for about six months. A few days ago, two of my students were getting things out of their lockers, one locker lower than the other, and one student bumped his head on the upper locker's door as he was standing up. He held his head and said to the other student, "What are we DOING?!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan4257 Posted March 30, 2008 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 421 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 30, 2008 I have a class of kindergartners whose first language is Chinese and they've been in an immersion English program for about six months. A few days ago, two of my students were getting things out of their lockers, one locker lower than the other, and one student bumped his head on the upper locker's door as he was standing up. He held his head and said to the other student, "What are we DOING?!" How absurd! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted March 31, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted March 31, 2008 So, let me see if I have this straight - Someone believes logically that there is no meaning to life, that there is no reason for there to be meaning to life; therefore, why bother with anything? But, somewhere in his - I don't know what you would say - will? heart? emotions? - he believes there has to be meaning, that there has to be a reason to have meaning. But, since he doesn't believe in anything that can and should give meaning to life (i.e. God), he is stuck in paradox. Therefore, he finds meaning in absurdity, because, after all, that is all his struggle is about. It is absurd to believe there is meaning to life when there is nothing to give meaning to life. Am I on the right track? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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