Matthew Chapter 24

[deut31:12]

I would have to agree with Blindseeker on this as Daniel 9:27 is speaking of the destruction of Jerusalem that occurred in 70 A.D.

And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. - Daniel 9:27

He - Jesus

One week - 70 years

Oblation to cease - Jesus was last sacrifice

Desolation - destruction of Jerusalem by Romans

One thing that has helped me to understand all of this that The prophesies in Daniel have nothing to do with the ones in Revelation. Daniel's prophesies are basically for the future of the Jews while Revelation is for the future of the Church. What tripe people us is when they try to use Daniel prophesies to explain future events.

Except for the seventy years being the one week, I agree. Each day of Daniel's seventy weeks represents a year, so the seventy weeks (70) times seven days a week (7) equals a total of 490 years.

The seventy weeks deal specifically with the Jewish people, Jerusalem, the fulfillment of the prophetic aspect (ceremonial) of the law, the doing away with the sin offering by Christ passion thus establish a legal means of restoration of the repentant, the pouring out of God

[eric]

You are partially right in this. The beast is a government and second beast is it's spokesperson. But, the number of 666 is is not laser scanners or bar codes. That is a great myth. The beast here is not only a government, buy also a denomination that has acted like a government. There is one denomination that has been around for a long time that has controlled many people and other governments. The smaller beast with two horns is practically its leader. Rev. 13:12 says that he cause the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast. The number of the smaller beast is 666.

So you believe that the beast is catholicism? If not, then what denomination?

When all the pieces are put together it is Catholicism, but it is almost taboo to say that.

Well I agree that there are a lot who would agree with you, from their own biased opinion,but I dont agree that it will be any denomination of the chrsian faith. A governance of sorts, whose only purpose is to gain wealth and power and control of the people of all nations. I believe this system, somehow, will begin by taking over the banking system of the world plus the energy and the media. It will of course have a mouthpiece or a front man, who will be given divine authority to impersonate the Lord Jesus by performing all kinds of miracles and deluding most of the populace of the world.... even the elect.

Those are some of my thoughts at the moment, but as time progresses they could quite easily change

Edited May 26, 2008 by eric

[Guest shiloh357]

The title of the thread says it all,

[deut31:12]

You are partially right in this. The beast is a government and second beast is it's spokesperson. But, the number of 666 is is not laser scanners or bar codes. That is a great myth. The beast here is not only a government, buy also a denomination that has acted like a government. There is one denomination that has been around for a long time that has controlled many people and other governments. The smaller beast with two horns is practically its leader. Rev. 13:12 says that he cause the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast. The number of the smaller beast is 666.

So you believe that the beast is catholicism? If not, then what denomination?

When all the pieces are put together it is Catholicism, but it is almost taboo to say that.

Well I agree that there are a lot who would agree with you, from their own biased opinion,but I dont agree that it will be any denomination of the chrsian faith. A governance of sorts, whose only purpose is to gain wealth and power and control of the people of all nations. I believe this system, somehow, will begin by taking over the banking system of the world plus the energy and the media. It will of course have a mouthpiece or a front man, who will be given divine authority to impersonate the Lord Jesus by performing all kinds of miracles and deluding most of the populace of the world.... even the elect.

Those are some of my thoughts at the moment, but as time progresses they could quite easily change

Many people focus just on what can be done today in we are controlled. This started hundreds of years ago with scriptures like this:

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. - 1 Timothy 4:1-3

The Catholics came in around 300 AD. From then they ruled with fear. They threatened and/or killed people if they did not join Catholicism. Absolution of sin could only be done through the priests. The priests set up human tradition and made it equal to the word of God. The scriptures were kept in the Latin tongue and were literally unknown to the people. They took away the bible from the people and gave them in return the most debasing superstitions known to history; they took the hard earnings of the people and gave them in return most abominable lies; they dethroned Jesus Christ and set up a most miserable sinner in his place; they led the disciples of Jesus to death, torturing them by every method that human hate and thirst for power could invent. It would take me all day to write all of the things they did to control the people out of fear to live as Catholics. The world lived in 1260 years of Dark Ages because they kept the bible away from man. They were kept ignorant or how we truly were to serve God and get forgiveness of our sins.

[Ovedya]

Replace your phrase "the Catholics" with "The clergy-laity" system and you would be mostly right. Were it not Catholicism than it would have been something else. All religion pretty much operates the same way.

[BlindSeeker]

The title of the thread says it all,

[BlindSeeker]

Daniel 9:24 breaks it down to everything that will transpire in that 70 weeks -

Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. - Daniel 9:24

It starts in verse 25 - Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

The commandment to restore Jerusalem, after the Babylon captivity, was done in Ezra 1:5. The time in between the 483 years. The "Troublous times" is Neh. 4:16-18. It took 49 years to rebuild Jerusalem and after another 434 years Jesus died. Now, in the last 7th week is when Jesus walked the earth, was crucified half way through the week, and at the end of the week Jerusalem was destroyed. The destruction was the "Abomination of Desolation".

The 70 weeks span from the time of the rebuilding Jerusalem to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD at the hands of the Romans.

Everything you stated I believe is true, except for the last part.

If Daniel

[BlindSeeker]

You are partially right in this. The beast is a government and second beast is it's spokesperson. But, the number of 666 is is not laser scanners or bar codes. That is a great myth. The beast here is not only a government, buy also a denomination that has acted like a government. There is one denomination that has been around for a long time that has controlled many people and other governments. The smaller beast with two horns is practically its leader. Rev. 13:12 says that he cause the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast. The number of the smaller beast is 666.

So you believe that the beast is catholicism? If not, then what denomination?

When all the pieces are put together it is Catholicism, but it is almost taboo to say that.

Well I agree that there are a lot who would agree with you, from their own biased opinion,but I don't agree that it will be any denomination of the Christian faith. A governance of sorts, whose only purpose is to gain wealth and power and control of the people of all nations. I believe this system, somehow, will begin by taking over the banking system of the world plus the energy and the media. It will of course have a mouthpiece or a front man, who will be given divine authority to impersonate the Lord Jesus by performing all kinds of miracles and deluding most of the populace of the world.... even the elect.

Those are some of my thoughts at the moment, but as time progresses they could quite easily change

I believe it will be a nation whose leader attempts to introduce a new economic system that will possibly eliminate currency as we presently know it, an e-cash system so to say. I believe it will be an attempt to stabilize a near global economic crisis. "Near global" I say because I believe the European Union will not be affected the same due to the backing of the euro (my understanding theirs is not a fiat money system.)

I do not subscribe to a religious leader that will be "performing all kinds of miracles and deluding most of the populace of the world . . . even the elect." Jesus' warning pertained to many "false Christs, and false prophets" that would arise throughout Christendom and not an end time individual world leader.

I believe it will simply come down to serving God or money . . . and there some of the elect will have trouble enough.

[Xan]

It does not seem like we have need for any further discussion of the first three verses of Matthew 24. It seems like everyone who is interested has a grasp on the foundational verses for this chapter.

To re-cap, in the first three verses, we have Jesus pointing to the 2nd temple prophesying its destruction, and His disciples ask Him when it will happen and about the end of the current age. Moving on, we will start with v. 4:

4And Jesus answered and said to them, "See to it that no one misleads you.

5"For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will mislead many

Jesus warns them against false Messiahs, which did occur during the time He predicted. In fact, there was a famous one that lead many Jews astray in the 1st century; unfortunately, I don't remember his name at this moment.

6"You will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end.

7"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes.

8"But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. As William showed us in his OP, these things were very much apart of the historical writings of the 1st century.

Acts 7:11 Now there came a dearth [Famine] over all the land of Egypt and Chanaan, and great affliction: and our fathers found no sustenance.

Acts 11:28 And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.

Josephus War Book 4 and 5 give accounts to the famines, pestilence, earthquakes, and wars. I can copy and paste this from the OP, but I don't find it necessary unless a poster asks for this.

[BlindSeeker]

It does not seem like we have need for any further discussion of the first three verses of Matthew 24. It seems like everyone who is interested has a grasp on the foundational verses for this chapter.

To re-cap, in the first three verses, we have Jesus pointing to the 2nd temple prophesying its destruction, and His disciples ask Him when it will happen and about the end of the current age. Moving on, we will start with v. 4:

4And Jesus answered and said to them, "See to it that no one misleads you.

5"For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will mislead many

Jesus warns them against false Messiahs, which did occur during the time He predicted. In fact, there was a famous one that lead many Jews astray in the 1st century; unfortunately, I don't remember his name at this moment.

6"You will be hearing of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end.

7"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes.

8"But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. As William showed us in his OP, these things were very much apart of the historical writings of the 1st century.

Acts 7:11 Now there came a dearth [Famine] over all the land of Egypt and Chanaan, and great affliction: and our fathers found no sustenance.

Acts 11:28 And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.

Josephus War Book 4 and 5 give accounts to the famines, pestilence, earthquakes, and wars. I can copy and paste this from the OP, but I don't find it necessary unless a poster asks for this.

Thank you hellbunny for your post. I appreciate your contribution.

There is another biblical account in Acts -

Ac 21:38 Art not thou that Egyptian, which before these days madest an uproar, and leddest out into the wilderness four thousand men that were murderers?

Josephus, Wars of the Jews chapter 13 para 5

5. But there was an Egyptian false prophet that did the Jews more mischief than the former; for he was a cheat, and pretended to be a prophet also, and got together thirty thousand men that were deluded by him; these he led round about from the wilderness to the mount which was called the Mount of Olives, and was ready to break into Jerusalem by force from that place; and if he could but once conquer the Roman garrison and the people, he intended to domineer over them by the assistance of those guards of his that were to break into the city with him. But Felix prevented his attempt, and met him with his Roman soldiers, while all the people assisted him in his attack upon them, insomuch that when it came to a battle, the Egyptian ran away, with a few others, while the greatest part of those that were with him were either destroyed or taken alive; but the rest of the multitude were dispersed every one to their own homes, and there concealed themselves.

Peace