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Mike 2

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About Mike 2

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  1. How exactly does God discipline us?

    Here's my way of thinking on this; Adam and Eve sinned when they ate the fruit that they were told not to. Interestingly, it was Adam and Eve that imposed their own punishment. They chose to separate from God. You will notice in the story that God was walking through the garden looking for them. Logic would tell us that God knew they sinned, yet there was God still pursuing them. It was Adam and Eves guilt that caused them to feel exposed and embarrassed, both physically hiding behind "clothing" and spiritually hiding from God. We do the punishing to ourselves by reminding ourselves that we don't measure up. That is what is meant in part in Heb 2:15 And let those who all their lives were in chains because of their fear of death, go free. We are enslaved to the idea that because we don't measure up we will be punished some how, forgetting that we are made righteous in Christ. I think we are the ones that do the punishing to ourselves and to each other. He's there waiting for us, he wants to be a part of our lives but we are embarrassed by our sin, we step away, He steps forward, like Adam and Eve we too let our actions separate us from God and, well, we kinda suffer. God stands by and waits Jas 4:7 Therefore, submit yourselves to God. Resist the devil, and he will run away from you. Jas 4:8 Come close to God, and he will come close to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. The Holy Spirit convicts us of our sin and in that sense we see God as the punisher when we start to suffer the consequences of our actions. Of course we have to blame someone for the consequences. Something else the Holy Spirit does is compel us to repent, that correction as a part of sanctification can be long and arduous pushing us out of the worldly norms and towards kingdom behavior. Resisting that can be very punishing as we agonize between what we know is right and the fear of how our worldly position might change.
  2. What does really "do not love the world" mean?

    In order to get the full meaning of anything written in the bible we must come to the understanding that we live a duel life There is a you living inside of that body. We are constantly subject to how we are perceiving what is around us and how we respond to that. That is us living in the world. The bible tells us that that is only temporary and that our real life is found in our spiritual life, that part of us that is not physical but spiritual/ emotional and that's what we should focus on based on what Jesus has taught us Learning to respond to the spiritual needs of others is a big part of what Jesus is talking about. We often have conflict when we see a spiritual principal that the bible teaches, conflicting with what our culture or society says is the norm. That's when we have to choose not to pursue the love of the world around us and choose to follow the teachings of Jesus despite how we feel we might be at a disadvantage in light of everyone elses standard. Looking after the earth is a good thing, unless you start having relationships with people and God being pushed into second place.
  3. Why is the Father greater than Jesus?

    Jesus was not in eternity past, the Word was, and Sister brings up a good point in reminding us THE WORD became flesh. That flesh was given the name Jesus. Jesus was only around for some 30+ years. But the Word that was dwelling within that body has been around for eternity past, with God and is God. I agree with a lot of what otherone is saying but I stop at saying that Jesus was acting in the past. The physical is created and everything created was created by the Son. The Son dwelt in the body that was given the name Jesus. The body is not God, the spirit within is. To say Jesus lived in the past is to say that something physical has eternal life and at the very least is confusing to people, more so, it is illogical. It was the Word/ the Son acting in the past that created in some physical way something that made it obvious that the writers of Exodus knew it was God working in the physical. Again, the body is not God but the spirit within was. The Son does nothing without first seeing the Father do it. Anything seen and understood in the physical as God had to be created so it had to come from the Father (the thoughts of God), through the Holy Spirit, to the Son who then created it in the physical. We go through the same process when we take the thoughts from our spirit within and create something in the physical. It could be a word, a drawing, a physical movement. We create from the spiritual into the physical all the time, think about the process of typing a response on this forum. If a person insists that Jesus created everything, then how did he create himself? However, if the Son created everything then we can say that the Son created Jesus (the body). Johns gospel actually does say that..."the Word became flesh"...and lived among men. The Son lived in the body we identify as Jesus. We have to separate the spiritual from the physical or we will not understand how the Father is greater than the Son. I believe it may be as simple as understanding that we are talking about the way that God creates into the physical. We are created in Gods image, when we look at our creating process we can see that image (although it is imperfect because of sin). Does any of this make sense or does it seem too strange an understanding?
  4. Why is the Father greater than Jesus?

    To say this seems to be saying that God is another entity from the Father. I think a lot of us have this idea that there is the Father, there is the Son, there is the Holy Spirit....then.... ......there is God. I can show you a tire, I can show you a fender, I can show you an engine....when you put them together they make a car. The difference between that analogy and God is that if you see just a tire you are not seeing a car. However, if we experience the Son or the Holy Spirit we are experiencing God (we cannot experience the Father without the Holy Spirit) Let me put it another way; if I give you a slice of pure blueberry pie you are experiencing 100% blueberry, no cherry, no apple, 100% blueberry BUT you are not experiencing the whole pie, just a part of it that is 100% blueberry. When we see anything to do with God in the physical we are seeing that part of God that works in the physical. The bible clearly tells us that all things created were / are created by the Son. Look at 1Co 2:11 Is there anyone who can understand his own thoughts except his own inner spirit? In the same way, no one can know the thoughts of God except God's Spirit. There is a process revealed to us here. God's thoughts are known by his Spirit. This is telling me that God's thoughts and his Spirit are two different things. The thoughts are the place of origin, the deep part of God where things begin, and they are known by the Holy Spirit. What does the Holy Spirit do with them.... Paul says 1Co 2:12 Now, we have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who comes from God, so that we can understand the things that were freely given to us by God. We cannot possibly know what the Father wants us to do in the world unless we communicate with Him. Paul tells us we know what His desire in heaven is because of the Spirit. so lets look at this The Father is the thoughts of God What the Father does (thinks, desires) is known by the Spirit and.... ...because we have the Spirit within us , through the Spirit, we can understand the thoughts (the Father) We then follow his leading and act out into the physical our Fathers will on earth as it is in heaven. We have THE FATHER (the thoughts of GOD) The HOLY SPIRIT (that knows and shares the thoughts) The SON (who we saw in Jesus but now see in every follower of the Christ) The SON (seen in the physical as Jesus) did nothing without first "seeing" the Father do it through the process I just described Joh 5:19 Jesus told them, "Truly, I tell all of you with certainty, the Son can do nothing on his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing, What the Father does, the Son does likewise. Joh 5:20 The Father loves the Son and shows him everything he is doing, Having said all that the Father is greater than the Son because the Son can literally only do as the Father directs. Any manifestation of "God" seen by man is that part of God identified as the Son working in the physical at the direction of that part of God known as the Father through that part of God known as the Holy Spirit, all 3 parts working together and known together as God. God is not some fourth entity. No different from you or I having a thought and then directing our body to act out in the physical what our thoughts desire.
  5. Is Jesus at work in the world today, or is God working in the world in a different way? HOW?
  6. Need help to find Bible aids

    I have to agree with Yowm on the Thompson chain bible.....tons of information in there. Lots of cross reference aids. and you don't need electricity to read it. I do have an NIV version. Something I have found very useful is the e-sword bible program. I highly recommend it. It is a free download. The program takes a while to download but once you do you can down load like a bazillion different bible versions, commentaries and dictionaries even the Naves topics that Yown also mentioned. Once you learn how to use it , searching topics is a lot easier...type in a few key words and hit enter. I also highly recommend you download the ISBE in the dictionary section, it's very extensive I must say though that nothing beats just reading the bible and asking the Lord to put the knowledge in your head so you can recall it when he wants you to. God bless
  7. I stand corrected Now, that aside...... What makes Christianity different in that we can say "it is finished" Jesus is the final word? How do we reason that? I'm curious to hear how different people would respond to that.
  8. LOL I was sitting on the fence whether I would use that word or not
  9. So I'm at a party the other day and I meet this guy, nice pleasant guy. He tells me he is following the Bahai religion. He talked a fair bit about his religion but what stuck out to me most is that he said (basically) they believe that God continues to send prophets and they are following the teachings of the latest prophet from which the religion of Bahai comes from. I can't help but get a sense of how a Jew must feel when I come along and say I am a Christian and Jesus supersedes the Law . I'm not looking for a discussion about that religion but what I am suggesting, in light of "revelations" that have resulted in Islam, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witness and others is that we discuss.... What makes Christianity different in that we can say "it is finished" Jesus is the final word? How do we reason that? I'm curious to hear how different people would respond to that.
  10. Baptism

    Hey BK1110 I don't know what your disability is and I say this with sincerity. Get someone you know is a believer to baptize you, pour a cup of water on you, drip some water from a rag, doesn't matter. I believe that it's the ACT of the baptism done from a confessing soul that shows it's willingness in whatever way they can, that God honors. I suppose there are some theologians that are going to argue that you have to be hanging upside down with a Bat suit on as opposed to a Spiderman suit or any one of a dozen other "correct" ways. I say poopoo to them, don't let their understanding take this away from you. You do this with someone and with a love for the Lord in your heart and I believe it's legitimate. Blessings brother.
  11. Baptism

    No it's not but it has a lot to do with a wonderful life in the Kingdom of God. Take a look at the circumstances surrounding Jesus baptism. Mat 3:14 But John tried to stop him, saying, "I need to be baptized by you, and are you coming to me?" Mat 3:15 But Jesus answered him, "Let it be this way for now, because this is the proper way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Jesus has given us a hint in those words, and we see about what when we notice what happened after his public declaration. He was tempted in the face of that and.. He started his ministry. It's interesting that we see that baptism is significant in the beginning and then at the end of our Lords ministry. Look at what his last words were. Mat 28:19 Therefore, as you go, disciple people in all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit, Mat 28:20 teaching them to obey everything that I've commanded you. And remember, I am with you each and every day until the end of the age." If we don't obey the simple instruction to be baptized, what hope do we have of responding in faith to the greater things God wants to call us to. This is the meat and potatoes of what James is talking about in Jas. 2:14-26 ( I don't want to get side tracked with the James passage but what James is saying IS NOT that you have to do works for salvation, rather, he is saying what BK1110 is saying, if you're not ya gotta wonder if you really have faith in God)
  12. Why do some professing Christians seem cold?

    ...........and if I have absolute faith so as to move mountains but have no love, I am nothing. 1Co 13:3 Even if I give away everything that I have and sacrifice myself, but have no love, I gain nothing. 1Co 13:4 Love is always patient; love is always kind; love is never envious or arrogant with pride. Nor is she conceited, 1Co 13:5 and she is never rude; she never thinks just of herself or ever gets annoyed. She never is resentful; 1Co 13:6 is never glad with sin; she's always glad to side with truth, and pleased that truth will win. 1Co 13:7 She bears up under everything; believes the best in all; there is no limit to her hope, and never will she fall. 1Co 13:8 Love never fails........... This ain't easy annnnd, you can't do it from a distance You can't help whether or not you like someone or their behavior but love..... Love is something you have to work at....and teach by example I gotta agree with Omegaman....sometimes humanness steps on love, that's why the verses from Paul can be hard to practice.
  13. What happens when we die?

    I think you have to keep in mind what Solomon was writing about in Ecclesiastes ....the frustrations and frivolousness of the pursuits of this world and that all the concerns of this world......mean nothing when we die. Doesn't matter if you were the worlds smartest person like Solomon,it counts for nothing when you're dead, when you die it goes with you and eventually you won;t even be remembered. So whats the big deal about worldly pursuits Taking this passage by itself without understanding the root of Solomon's message could easily cause us to think differently. I suggest reading the chapter before and after to understand what he is talking about and in the context it was intended. The dead know nothing.....they are of no help in this world. They have no further reward.....in this world (they are no longer a part of it) Just an aside; Solomon's writing causes me to ask...What will I do with my life that will leave a legacy, that will leave something lasting. It seems that Solomon is saying that chasing worldly things is like chasing after the wind. It really leaves me thinking that the only thing that can create a lasting memory is having a spiritual effect in peoples lives
  14. Does Doctrine Divide?

    Earlier I said I think doctrine can be divisive and sometimes we just have to step back and ask.....does it really matter? After the gospel and salvation does doctrine serve anything more than keeping us occupied? Isn't it a shame that our disagreements on doctrine that usually have nothing to do with the Gospel, can so often turn people away from wanting anything to do with Christianity.
  15. This is a good question but I do have to get behind the others that have responded by saying you should include biblical references to what you are talking about. I say this and try to practice it because it is a huge help in gaining understanding. Without doing the study of where the words are actually coming from it is very easy to slip into using incorrect "quotes" that you heard from a friend who heard it from a friend. If you really want understanding you have to do the work of getting into the bible, getting away from the "generalized" statements and finding the exact wording in context.There's no other way around it. In response to the opening question.. I think it is important to consider 2 things 1) Rom 10:9 If you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. .....That's not an if or maybe, there's no condition attached to it. In every way I understand it, it's a definite thing. 2) I think James 2 will encompass a lot of what you are referring to regarding works. Simply put, James is saying ..if you say you believe but are not seeing a change in your life where you are more and more seeking and trusting Gods direction (acting in faith), you better be concerned about what it is you actually believe..... In the end God, through James, is telling us...you will know you're mine by the fruit in your life, if you are not doing ....(insert any of the mentioned things in the OP)... you simply agree that God is real, even to the point of talking about and knowing all about him, but never putting any saving faith in him, never really believing in your heart that he is Lord/director of your healthy spiritual life. So I think it is wrong to say the things mentioned in the OP are conditions . I say that Jesus has told us that we can know our faith by seeing the fruit of our spirit working in the world and we can use those things mentioned in the OP as a "gauge" as to whether we really are following him as Lord (director).