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Posted

Ok let's all be civilized here there are many differing views of soterology and let's use historical evidence, scriptures, tradition and all forms of literary criticism and personal experience of the holy spirit to answer this one.

I'll start

" for God so loved the world that he gave his only son that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life" John 3:16 from memory I don't know what version it is from.

Posted

Christ died, because God is a just God. the wages of sin are death (romans 6:23 i believe), and every person on the face of the earth is born into sin. to spend eternity with God, we must be holy and without blemish (eph 5:27 and col 1:22). but that is not possible without the atonement of the blood of a living sacrifice. Christ became that sacrifice, so that His blood would wipe out our sin so that we can be with Him for eternity.


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Posted

Hebrews 10:1-18 (New King James Version)

Animal Sacrifices Insufficient

For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect. For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins. But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.

Christ’s Death Fulfills God’s Will

Therefore, when He came into the world, He

“Sacrifice and offering You did not desire,

But a body You have prepared for Me.

In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin

You had no pleasure.

Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come—

In the volume of the book it is written of Me—

To do Your will, O God.’”

Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them ” (which are offered according to the law), then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Christ’s Death Perfects the Sanctified

And every priest stands ministering daily and offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God, from that time waiting till His enemies are made His footstool. For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified.

But the Holy Spirit also witnesses to us; for after He had said before,

“This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,” then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

Acts 4:5-12 (New King James Version)

Addressing the Sanhedrin

And it came to pass, on the next day, that their rulers, elders, and scribes, as well as Annas the high priest, Caiaphas, John, and Alexander, and as many as were of the family of the high priest, were gathered together at Jerusalem. And when they had set them in the midst, they asked, “By what power or by what name have you done this?”

Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, “Rulers of the people and elders of Israel: If we this day are judged for a good deed done to a helpless man, by what means he has been made well, let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole. This is the ‘stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief cornerstone.’ Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

Saved

Strong's G4982

σῴζω

sōzō

1) to save, keep safe and sound, to rescue from danger or destruction

...a) one (from injury or peril)

......1) to save a suffering one (from perishing), i.e. one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health

......2) to preserve one who is in danger of destruction, to save or rescue

...b) to save in the technical biblical sense

......1) negatively

.........a) to deliver from the penalties of the Messianic judgment

.........b) to save from the evils which obstruct the reception of the Messianic deliverance

Salvation

Strong's G4991

σωτηρία

sōtēria

1) deliverance, preservation, safety, salvation

...a) deliverance from the molestation of enemies

...b) in an ethical sense, that which concludes to the souls safety or salvation

......1) of Messianic salvation

......2) salvation as the present possession of all true Christians

......3) future salvation, the sum of benefits and blessings which the Christians, redeemed from all earthly ills, will enjoy after the visible return of Christ from heaven in the consummated and eternal kingdom of God.

Scripture describes a fourfold salvation: saved from the penalty, power, presence and the pleasure of sin. (cf. Arthur W. Pink, A Fourfold Salvation)


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Posted
Christ died, because God is a just God. the wages of sin are death (romans 6:23 i believe), and every person on the face of the earth is born into sin. to spend eternity with God, we must be holy and without blemish (eph 5:27 and col 1:22). but that is not possible without the atonement of the blood of a living sacrifice. Christ became that sacrifice, so that His blood would wipe out our sin so that we can be with Him for eternity.

You know as an atheist I was having a real hard time with the amount of historical evidence around the Life of Christ and the martyrdom of the apostles was very disturbing to me. Most doubted after Christ's death only later to be martyred for these beliefs. I think the evidence is overwhelming and I had an experience - I know some may say I'm crazy or delusional but I prayed and I asked God for a sign - I know now that I probably shouldn't do that but I did and I saw a bolt of lightning come out of a cloud in the distance the exact moment I prayed that prayer- ever since then I really and truly feel different and changed I know this is an emotional encounter and I have had struggles along the way a painful divorce and the hardships that raising three kids alone - I couldn't have done any of it without Christ.

Posted

i'm glad that you had an experience like that! but i don't think it's wrong to ask for a sign. it's like saying "show me you're real, God". and i think everyone should ask God at some point to show them He's real. that's what i did. i'd been a christian since i was a child, but during my teens and early 20's i sure wasn't living for Him. a link to my testimony should be in my sig-line, or if not, in my profile. take a peek and see how God answered me when i asked Him to show me He was real :th_praying:


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Posted
Christ died, because God is a just God. the wages of sin are death (romans 6:23 i believe), and every person on the face of the earth is born into sin. to spend eternity with God, we must be holy and without blemish (eph 5:27 and col 1:22). but that is not possible without the atonement of the blood of a living sacrifice. Christ became that sacrifice, so that His blood would wipe out our sin so that we can be with Him for eternity.

You know as an atheist I was having a real hard time with the amount of historical evidence around the Life of Christ and the martyrdom of the apostles was very disturbing to me. Most doubted after Christ's death only later to be martyred for these beliefs. I think the evidence is overwhelming and I had an experience - I know some may say I'm crazy or delusional but I prayed and I asked God for a sign - I know now that I probably shouldn't do that but I did and I saw a bolt of lightning come out of a cloud in the distance the exact moment I prayed that prayer- ever since then I really and truly feel different and changed I know this is an emotional encounter and I have had struggles along the way a painful divorce and the hardships that raising three kids alone - I couldn't have done any of it without Christ.

Here is what Jesus did for me.


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Posted

Jesus died on the cross and suffered everything that He suffered, to open a way for the redemption of His fallen creation.


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Posted

Jesus died on the cross and suffered everything that He suffered, to open a way for the redemption of His fallen creation.

Wow what awesome testimonies! Whenever I see a lightning storm I am reminded of that experience.

Gold fish! Awesome!

Onelight - what is the next part of the story? If you don't mind me asking?

After I had that experience it was on a saturday and the next day I just drove up in my car to church and I was so broken I was completely in tears and walked straight up to an usher and he lead me to an office and talked to me and I became friends with this guy at church and we used to go to starbucks every day

to just read the word together. That Saturday I had tickets to see ozzfest with Marilyn Manson and I remember tearing them up and my best friend couldn't believe me! He

was like what do you mean you got saved? I don't understand- but at the time I didn't understand it that much either. I remember telling my first girlfriend who lived with me (before all this happened) that "I would never ever become a Christian, I am an atheist and I will never change - she dumped me because of that and lo and behold three years later I have given my life to the Lord.

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