Ark of the Covenant

[Fez]

I am a Christian, Jesus Christ is my Lord and Saviour! I live under His grace and His grace alone!

This is important for those reading this to understand.

One of my many TV satellite channels (it is a free channel - I don't subscribe to it), is Islam TV. I sometimes watch it out of interest and to gain a better understanding of Islamic ideas and teaching. It does not affect my faith one iota, rather strengthens it. My walk with Jesus is my only walk. He is my Lord and my God!

I watched a program this morning on the whereabouts of the Ark of the Covenant as prophesied in Islamic terms.

It is stated that the Ark will be found in the end times. It will be found near Antioch in Turkey, where the Essene Jews who split between the Dead Sea ( those that protected the dead sea scrolls) and Antioch, where those that hid the Ark, settled.

It is stated that the end times are now, and that the Ark will be found in our time, and that Islam will rejoice at the confirmation of the prophesy, and that many will come to the faith.

It goes on to say that those that find the Ark will number "the same as those who were with Saul when he crossed the river".

Now I am not really into prophecy in any big way, I just follow Jesus daily, and don't worry too much about tomorrow.

But it is interesting that there is a massive search going on for the Ark in the Antioch area right now, and that it is well funded and is using the latest ground penetrating radar etc.

I post this out of interest only, I have no opinion on the whereabouts of the Ark, nor the end times. The Lord Jesus Christ is my Lord and Saviour, and I live under His grace. Clear? Good!

But what happens if they actually find it?

[nebula]

What happens when/if they find it will largely depend upon whether or not God's presence is still with the Ark.

Remember the Philistines.

[OneLight]

Revelation 11:19

Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

[Fez]

Revelation 11:19

Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

Could this mean that the temple of God was opened in heaven, but that the ark was seen in His temple here, on earth. or do you believe the scripture alludes to heaven only? And that the hail was here on earth and not in heaven?

Barnes says:-

And the temple of God was opened in heaven - The temple of God at Jerusalem was a pattern of the heavenly one, or of heaven, Heb_8:1-5. In that temple God was supposed to reside by the visible symbol of his presence - the Shekinah - in the holy of holies. See the notes on Heb_9:7. Thus God dwells in heaven, as in a holy temple, of which that on earth was the emblem. When it is said that that was

[lekh l'kha]

This is very interesting, Fez. It shows how active the devil is in the world, getting Muslims, Christians and Jews to fear one another and hate one another by creating rival eschatological systems to God's revealed plan and prophecies.

It's almost a test for us to see how we as Christians are going to respond to those who are just as convinced of the truthfulness of their own eschatological systems as we are of the Biblical one. Certainly, the loyalty of devout Muslims to their faith exceeds religious loyalty - it's a nationalistic, patriotic, political loyalty which seems to have its origin in the Ishmael/Isaac and the later Esau/Jacob days.

I've often thought about this. Imagine how Ishmael, only son and very beloved son of his father and only heir of his father, brought up to believe his father loves him and that his father's inheritance is his, not only gets his inheritance "stolen away" by his much, much younger half-brother, but gets sent away by his own father, with his mother and nothing but a sack-full of provisions. The hurt, the pain and later the anger that Ishmael must have felt. Ishmael had done nothing wrong, nothing to deserve such harsh treatment.

It shows just what consequences human attempts to force the promises of God or bring about what only God can bring about can do. Sarah was convinced that Abraham's seed would not come from her own body, and convinced Abraham to have the seed God promised him with Hagar. The consequences were, and been devastatingly tragic ever since.

Esau lost his birthright through his own doing, but was tricked out of his father's blessing, something which was not his own doing - and his own mother had helped his younger brother do this to him.

Can you imagine the amount of money psychiatrists would make out of these people today if the same sort of things were to recur in the lives of people we know?

The Muslims believe their eschatology, and they also know that if Islam does not succeed in it's world-domination, then Mohammed was a fake. It's uncanny how Orthodox Jews, Christian Zionists and Muslims all have a deep belief and sense that we are living in the last of the last days of the age, and how our eschatological systems rival one another: Orthodox Jews are waiting for the Messiah who will come and judge Israel's enemies and prove once and for all that the claim that Yeshua is the Messiah is a "lie".

Christian Zionists are waiting for Yeshua to come back, judge the enemies of Israel and "the rest of her seed, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ" (Rev.12: 17), and will prove once and for all that He is indeed the Son of God and true Messiah.

Muslims believe that the Mahdi is going to come and violently force all peoples to submit to Islam and the only Islamic creed: "There is only one God, Allah. and Mohammed is his prophet", and prove once and for all that Yeshua is not the Son of God and was merely a prophet, and they believe also that the Mahdi will kick the Jews out of Israel and Jerusalem for once and for all and prove once and for all that the inheritance does not belong to the Jews, and never did, after which there will be peace (an absence of war).

The devil is having a field-day, and though it is not surprising that devout Muslims are filled with hatred, yet as Christians many of us are falling into the same trap in the way we respond to them.

I know you know this, Fez, and so do many others here at Worthy. But I just think it needed to be said here, so that we can all be reminded to be on guard - because Satan is having a field-day getting people to hate one another and to bring about a devastating world-war by using these rival eschatologies he created, using men like Mohammed. So when we hear Muslims breathe hatred and threats against Jews, Christians and Western nations, we need to spot THE REAL enemy, and love the people whose hearts and minds are in his clutches, because it's an absolutely awful, awful state for them to be in.

This thing about the Muslims hunting so hard for the ark of the Covenant is another immense sign that we are indeed living in the last of the last days.

Lekh

[Fez]

This is very interesting, Fez. It shows how active the devil is in the world, getting Muslims, Christians and Jews to fear one another and hate one another by creating rival eschatological systems to God's revealed plan and prophecies.

It's almost a test for us to see how we as Christians are going to respond to those who are just as convinced of the truthfulness of their own eschatological systems as we are of the Biblical one. Certainly, the loyalty of devout Muslims to their faith exceeds religious loyalty - it's a nationalistic, patriotic, political loyalty which seems to have its origin in the Ishmael/Isaac and the later Esau/Jacob days.

I've often thought about this. Imagine how Ishmael, only son and very beloved son of his father and only heir of his father, brought up to believe his father loves him and that his father's inheritance is his, not only gets his inheritance "stolen away" by his much, much younger half-brother, but gets sent away by his own father, with his mother and nothing but a sack-full of provisions. The hurt, the pain and later the anger that Ishmael must have felt. Ishmael had done nothing wrong, nothing to deserve such harsh treatment.

It shows just what consequences human attempts to force the promises of God or bring about what only God can bring about can do. Sarah was convinced that Abraham's seed would not come from her own body, and convinced Abraham to have the seed God promised him with Hagar. The consequences were, and been devastatingly tragic ever since.

Esau lost his birthright through his own doing, but was tricked out of his father's blessing, something which was not his own doing - and his own mother had helped his younger brother do this to him.

Can you imagine the amount of money psychiatrists would make out of these people today if the same sort of things were to recur in the lives of people we know?

The Muslims believe their eschatology, and they also know that if Islam does not succeed in it's world-domination, then Mohammed was a fake. It's uncanny how Orthodox Jews, Christian Zionists and Muslims all have a deep belief and sense that we are living in the last of the last days of the age, and how our eschatological systems rival one another: Orthodox Jews are waiting for the Messiah who will come and judge Israel's enemies and prove once and for all that the claim that Yeshua is the Messiah is a "lie".

Christian Zionists are waiting for Yeshua to come back, judge the enemies of Israel and "the rest of her seed, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ" (Rev.12: 17), and will prove once and for all that He is indeed the Son of God and true Messiah.

Muslims believe that the Mahdi is going to come and violently force all peoples to submit to Islam and the only Islamic creed: "There is only one God, Allah. and Mohammed is his prophet", and prove once and for all that Yeshua is not the Son of God and was merely a prophet, and they believe also that the Mahdi will kick the Jews out of Israel and Jerusalem for once and for all and prove once and for all that the inheritance does not belong to the Jews, and never did, after which there will be peace (an absence of war).

The devil is having a field-day, and though it is not surprising that devout Muslims are filled with hatred, yet as Christians many of us are falling into the same trap in the way we respond to them.

I know you know this, Fez, and so do many others here at Worthy. But I just think it needed to be said here, so that we can all be reminded to be on guard - because Satan is having a field-day getting people to hate one another and to bring about a devastating world-war by using these rival eschatologies he created, using men like Mohammed. So when we hear Muslims breathe hatred and threats against Jews, Christians and Western nations, we need to spot THE REAL enemy, and love the people whose hearts and minds are in his clutches, because it's an absolutely awful, awful state for them to be in.

This thing about the Muslims hunting so hard for the ark of the Covenant is another immense sign that we are indeed living in the last of the last days.

Lekh

I agree that satan is having a field day, and I don't think he has ever stopped, and won't until he is. It is for this reason that I repeat myself over and over on these boards, it's about Jesus and His grace under which we live. Trouble is, it is such a simple message that some think that there has to be more. But in reality, there does not have to be, it really is that simple.

[lekh l'kha]

This is very interesting, Fez. It shows how active the devil is in the world, getting Muslims, Christians and Jews to fear one another and hate one another by creating rival eschatological systems to God's revealed plan and prophecies.

It's almost a test for us to see how we as Christians are going to respond to those who are just as convinced of the truthfulness of their own eschatological systems as we are of the Biblical one. Certainly, the loyalty of devout Muslims to their faith exceeds religious loyalty - it's a nationalistic, patriotic, political loyalty which seems to have its origin in the Ishmael/Isaac and the later Esau/Jacob days.

I've often thought about this. Imagine how Ishmael, only son and very beloved son of his father and only heir of his father, brought up to believe his father loves him and that his father's inheritance is his, not only gets his inheritance "stolen away" by his much, much younger half-brother, but gets sent away by his own father, with his mother and nothing but a sack-full of provisions. The hurt, the pain and later the anger that Ishmael must have felt. Ishmael had done nothing wrong, nothing to deserve such harsh treatment.

It shows just what consequences human attempts to force the promises of God or bring about what only God can bring about can do. Sarah was convinced that Abraham's seed would not come from her own body, and convinced Abraham to have the seed God promised him with Hagar. The consequences were, and been devastatingly tragic ever since.

Esau lost his birthright through his own doing, but was tricked out of his father's blessing, something which was not his own doing - and his own mother had helped his younger brother do this to him.

Can you imagine the amount of money psychiatrists would make out of these people today if the same sort of things were to recur in the lives of people we know?

The Muslims believe their eschatology, and they also know that if Islam does not succeed in it's world-domination, then Mohammed was a fake. It's uncanny how Orthodox Jews, Christian Zionists and Muslims all have a deep belief and sense that we are living in the last of the last days of the age, and how our eschatological systems rival one another: Orthodox Jews are waiting for the Messiah who will come and judge Israel's enemies and prove once and for all that the claim that Yeshua is the Messiah is a "lie".

Christian Zionists are waiting for Yeshua to come back, judge the enemies of Israel and "the rest of her seed, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ" (Rev.12: 17), and will prove once and for all that He is indeed the Son of God and true Messiah.

Muslims believe that the Mahdi is going to come and violently force all peoples to submit to Islam and the only Islamic creed: "There is only one God, Allah. and Mohammed is his prophet", and prove once and for all that Yeshua is not the Son of God and was merely a prophet, and they believe also that the Mahdi will kick the Jews out of Israel and Jerusalem for once and for all and prove once and for all that the inheritance does not belong to the Jews, and never did, after which there will be peace (an absence of war).

The devil is having a field-day, and though it is not surprising that devout Muslims are filled with hatred, yet as Christians many of us are falling into the same trap in the way we respond to them.

I know you know this, Fez, and so do many others here at Worthy. But I just think it needed to be said here, so that we can all be reminded to be on guard - because Satan is having a field-day getting people to hate one another and to bring about a devastating world-war by using these rival eschatologies he created, using men like Mohammed. So when we hear Muslims breathe hatred and threats against Jews, Christians and Western nations, we need to spot THE REAL enemy, and love the people whose hearts and minds are in his clutches, because it's an absolutely awful, awful state for them to be in.

This thing about the Muslims hunting so hard for the ark of the Covenant is another immense sign that we are indeed living in the last of the last days.

Lekh

I agree that satan is having a field day, and I don't think he has ever stopped, and won't until he is. It is for this reason that I repeat myself over and over on these boards, it's about Jesus and His grace under which we live. Trouble is, it is such a simple message that some think that there has to be more. But in reality, there does not have to be, it really is that simple.

You have your calling Fresno Joe also. I really miss his posts. Don't see them so often anymore. Or maybe I'm just reading the wrong boards? Traveller is also pretty silent these days. What's going on? Are they sick and tired of (some of) us?

[Fez]

['lekh l'kha'']

You have your calling Fresno Joe also. I really miss his posts. Don't see them so often anymore. Or maybe I'm just reading the wrong boards? Traveller is also pretty silent these days. What's going on? Are they sick and tired of (some of) us?

Well we all have different callings, and thats how we learn from one another. I enjoy reading most posts, and I do learn from some. From others I learn how to practice grace and patience. And from others how to go out onto the deck, and howl at the moon But I learn from every one....

And nah, some people are busy, and they come and go, or they are lucky enough to be on vacation (one of my Worthy friends is off skiing with the family at the moment. I miss them...)

[Miss Elly]

I am a Christian, Jesus Christ is my Lord and Saviour! I live under His grace and His grace alone!

This is important for those reading this to understand.

One of my many TV satellite channels (it is a free channel - I don't subscribe to it), is Islam TV. I sometimes watch it out of interest and to gain a better understanding of Islamic ideas and teaching. It does not affect my faith one iota, rather strengthens it. My walk with Jesus is my only walk. He is my Lord and my God!

I watched a program this morning on the whereabouts of the Ark of the Covenant as prophesied in Islamic terms.

It is stated that the Ark will be found in the end times. It will be found near Antioch in Turkey, where the Essene Jews who split between the Dead Sea ( those that protected the dead sea scrolls) and Antioch, where those that hid the Ark, settled.

It is stated that the end times are now, and that the Ark will be found in our time, and that Islam will rejoice at the confirmation of the prophesy, and that many will come to the faith.

It goes on to say that those that find the Ark will number "the same as those who were with Saul when he crossed the river".

Now I am not really into prophecy in any big way, I just follow Jesus daily, and don't worry too much about tomorrow.

But it is interesting that there is a massive search going on for the Ark in the Antioch area right now, and that it is well funded and is using the latest ground penetrating radar etc.

I post this out of interest only, I have no opinion on the whereabouts of the Ark, nor the end times. The Lord Jesus Christ is my Lord and Saviour, and I live under His grace. Clear? Good!

But what happens if they actually find it?

Who stated that the ark will be found in our time? The muslims or their prophet? If they should find it, which I doubt very seriously, no doubt God will send a plague or some kind of punishment on them as he has said only the Jewish priests of God were to touch it. I am clueless as to why the muslims would rejoice anyhow, what for? The ark was made by the children of Israel for THEIR tabernacle / temple and the Jews followed the law of Moses. Such blindness is incredible.

[OneLight]

Revelation 11:19

Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

Could this mean that the temple of God was opened in heaven, but that the ark was seen in His temple here, on earth. or do you believe the scripture alludes to heaven only? And that the hail was here on earth and not in heaven?

Barnes says:-

And the temple of God was opened in heaven - The temple of God at Jerusalem was a pattern of the heavenly one, or of heaven, Heb_8:1-5. In that temple God was supposed to reside by the visible symbol of his presence - the Shekinah - in the holy of holies. See the notes on Heb_9:7. Thus God dwells in heaven, as in a holy temple, of which that on earth was the emblem. When it is said that that was