A Muslim Posted November 30, 2010 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 102 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/24/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2010 Can you show me the verse to support your comment? Can you show me where does the verse say that the whole Quran was sent down in Ramadan? We have the hadiths telling about the start of revelation and we know well that the Quran was sent through the whole 23 years, and nowhere in the verse does it say that the whole Quran was sent down in Ramadan. So actually you are the one who assume contradiction when actually there isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2010 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Whoso boasteth himself of a false gift is like clouds and wind without rain. Proverbs 25:14 >>>>>()<<<<< .... And who told you that I believe that Jesus said.... Believe The Teachings Of The LORD Jesus Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. John 3:3 Or Not Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. John 14:6 Believe Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: John 11:25 And Be Blessed Beloved Muslim Love, Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted November 30, 2010 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,368 Content Per Day: 7.55 Reputation: 28,113 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted November 30, 2010 Actually you hve no idea what i believe for I have not stated it here. i've read your Koran and much of Mohamad's writings and just can't see them as reality. Why? While I would have to agree with you that every single word in the bible being God breathed is a little hard to swallow for we have several different Bibles with different words, i would have to say that the overall message contained in the Bible is truly information sent from God. We may discuss this in a separate issue, you can see my point here, this is my own site, not just giving any link: http://sites.google....muslim/thebible You say that I am defending my tradition because this is what I believe, and I'd say the same to you LoL It's what we all do. Yes, we all defend our beliefs and I have no problem with that, but when I tell my point through citing Bible verses, and be answered with just stating the faith, that's what i was objecting on. Well, I have about as much trouble with the trinity thing as you seem to, but you and your religion goes so much further than that, I even hesitate to discuss it. The TOS of this site will not let us discuss the deity of Christ and I'm a little surprised the thread has gone as far as it has. It would be most difficult for us to have a discussion when you don't think that Jesus died and was resurrected. I've read where your religion says that God or Allah has no son. I can't disagree with that for it's impossible for me to think that Allah is the Father which is my God. You can't discuss whether or not Jesus is God here, for the vast majority of people here have the definition of the word God as The Trinity. When that is your belief, there is nothing you can say or do to change it. That's why I asked the question earlier to define "God" You should have picked up on that and understood. You say that Jesus was just a man, but I say that the spirit within Jesus existed as the word which John tells us was in the form of God (and that's a capitol "G") before he set that glory aside and lowered himself to the status of a human. But after his resurrection he had asked and received the glory he had before hand which makes him much much more than just a human. Personally I would agree with you that when he was here, he was as human as Adam was before sin entered into him..... difference though is that he didn't have a newly installed spirit. That was/is older than the universe itself...... what he is now is far greater than any human is or has been, and you'll see that when he returns, for it will not be to introduce us to Mohammad, but to be the head of the Kingdom. We can argue for years and actually thousands of years as to the divinity of Christ and it will change nothing. Whether he was just a human with an eternal spirit inside or whatever we might decide, he's still the only way to salvation. I wish there was some way I could get you to see that, but it usually takes the Holy Spirit to accomplish this........ so my prayers are for the Holy Spirit to open your eyes to the truths of the word...... and to the things that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted November 30, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 683 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,128 Content Per Day: 1.99 Reputation: 1,352 Days Won: 54 Joined: 02/03/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1952 Share Posted November 30, 2010 Can you show me the verse to support your comment? Can you show me where does the verse say that the whole Quran was sent down in Ramadan? We have the hadiths telling about the start of revelation and we know well that the Quran was sent through the whole 23 years, and nowhere in the verse does it say that the whole Quran was sent down in Ramadan. So actually you are the one who assume contradiction when actually there isn't. Ok... "Ramadan is the (month) in which was sent down the Qur'an, as a guide to mankind, also clear (Signs) for guidance and judgment (Between right and wrong)" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted November 30, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.92 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted November 30, 2010 I believe that Jesus (Peace be upon him was born through a virgin where God sent him through the Holy Spirit. That Jesus was born of a virgin, that doesn't make him God. Who was Jesus' Father? You cannot say He had "no" father. The Y chromosome and matching 22 chromosomes had to come from somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted November 30, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.92 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted November 30, 2010 You are giving an irrelevant example as it doesn't bear any other meaning, but in many cases words can bear many meanings, in our case as I said, Jesus teachings belong to him which were already revealed by the Father, that's why he next spoke about those who will follow him, because they actually followed what he said, so they had the light of life, which is the light of following his teachings, they didn't take a part of his flesh to have the light, but they followed his teachings. Would you provide me with quotes of other people who have said, "Follow me," to mean, "Follow my teaching?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted December 1, 2010 Share Posted December 1, 2010 shiloh357, on 27 November 2010 - 06:33 AM, said: Quote But this is a clear proof that God is not a son of man at all, otherwise he would have said God is not a son of man who repents, but he didn't say it that way, He totally denied this attribute for Himself, which means that the son of man is NOT God. Furthermore, He is using a parallelism style of talking. He uses the term Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted December 1, 2010 Share Posted December 1, 2010 Quote The title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted December 1, 2010 Share Posted December 1, 2010 Quote I have not ridculed you at all. John 17:3 is not the final word on what eternal life is. It is one aspect of eternal life. Jesus claims to be able to impart eternal life and that is something only God can do. Jesus leads people to the only way of God, that is the meaning of what Jesus says concerning your last sentence.No, it means that Jesus imparts eternal life. It means exactly what I said it means. Jesus literally gives people the life of God to dwell within them in the person of His Holy Spirit. He clearly says that the Father is the ONLY God, means that he is not God, and he tells that this is the eternal life, that people know that the Father is the only true God and Jesus the Christ whom He sent. He didn't say that the eternal life is that they believe that Jesus is God or that God is the Father, the son and the Holy Spirit or that the believe that Jesus came to die for their sins as you are trying to prioritize over knowing God. No, the eternal life is that they know that the Father is the ONLY true God meaning that Jesus is NOT God as Jesus is NOT the Father as the last sentence will lead you to heresy. The Father is the ONLY God. Jesus is the ONLY God and the Holy Spirit is the ONLY God. "God" refers to being or essence. There is ONLY one God, YHVH. But this God is comprised of three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. They share the same the being, albeit they are separate personages, so there is no problem. Quote That was true at the time it was spoken. It is not true now. It was voluntary limitation that Jesus took upon Himself and it was a temporary limitation that served a purpose at that time. It is not true of Jesus now. This temporary limitation has no justification at all as this hour is much much after Jesus' resurrection, and even it is, I don't worship a god who doesn't know everything even if He knew it afterwards as God doesn't change with time. I am surprised how you insult God that way.I am not insulting God at all. Rather, I am simply pointing out that Jesus emptied Himself voluntarily of some divine perogatives prior to taking on flesh. That explains why lived within the confines of certain limitations. Jesus was also not omnipresent while on earth. He was confined to being in only one place at a time. Quote Those verses demonstrate Jesus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted December 2, 2010 Share Posted December 2, 2010 The TOS of this site will not let us discuss the deity of Christ and I'm a little surprised the thread has gone as far as it has. Are you kidding? I have posted an entire study on the Deity of Christ and there are several threads on that issue or at least contain that issue. It has been discussed at length many times on the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts