Fez Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 683 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 11,128 Content Per Day: 2.00 Reputation: 1,352 Days Won: 54 Joined: 02/03/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/07/1952 Share Posted August 3, 2011 String theory? I use it to tie things together all the time. The natural fiber is better than artificial nylon, the knot holds better (think about it, it's a very deep statement ). God created the base products, but we manufactured the nylon. My thoughts on omniscience? God knows the history of your future. Checkmate.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
methinkshe Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 679 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/02/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 3, 2011 Everything that is in the natural was in the spiritual first even you and I even were formed in the belly and GOD knew us spiritually before we ever came out of the womb as the prophet Jeremiah in....... Jeremiah 1:4-7 Then the word of the Lord came unto me saying, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. Then said I, Ah, Lord GOD! behold, I cannot speak: for I am a child. But the LORD said unto me, Say not, I am a child: for thou shalt go to all that I send thee, and whatsoever I command thee thou shalt speak. The knowledge of God goes all the way back to his beginning and goes on into the future where his end is past finding out. Just as GOD has a beginning that goes beyond human understanding he also has an end that also goes beyond human understanding that goes on forever. According to the foreknowledge of GOD he gave man a beginning a time to be born and a time to die for it is appointed once for man to die. After death our never-ending future will begin for all eternity. For those who claim that there is no future that is going to come to pass will have a rude awakening one day. For Jesus Christ was prophesied that he would come lo, and riding a donkey which is only one of the many that foretells of his birth. It is easier to believe a lie over the truth as it makes it more soothing to believe that over the truth. I'm reminded of the friends of Job who tried to convince him he sinned against and to repent and Job held to his integrity even though he was mocked by his friends. Job held onto his faith and never let go of it even though he didn't understand all that came upon him. Job had a future as God restored to him double of all he had before. God has given to us a future and a hope which was foretold about Jesus who would come born of a virgin and it was through him we could have our sins forgiven and have everlasting life. God has spoken to man through his word and showed them things to come like Joseph who had a dream where his brother's were going to bow before him and didn't like the thought of being humble before him. Joseph went through alot of things but God gave him favor and promoted him to the second most powerful in Egypt beside Pharoah and there came a time when his brother's had to come to buy food and they did bow before Joseph all of this was foretold to him and it came to pass in the future as the Lord had said it would. The deliver was foretold was going to come and lead the people of God out of Egypt in which they had been made slaves and that deliverer was Moses whom God called and then sent him out to lead them out. This was the future that happened according to the will of God and to deny the future is no where close to the truth and it is to deny your own life that was in the mind of God before you were even formed in the belly and born in the womb. God had your own future in his mind before he even created you first you was in the past, now you are in the present and by faith like Abraham for he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God. (that sounds like Revelation 21:1-27 for our future home shall be GREAT) Hebrews 11:1-3 NOW FAITH is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. For by it the elders obtained a good report. Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were made of things which do appear. Everything in the spiritual was before it was in the natural. Nice post - thanks. Everything in the spiritual was before it was in the natural. Building on that, could it then be said as follows? Since everything that God wills/plans/purposes, IS (because that is a characterisitic of omnipotence) then it must be that what IS in the spiritual unfolds in the natural, over time. Moreover, God must live in an eternal present if He is omnipotent because otherwise He would be dependent on events unfolding before executing His next move, so to speak, and dependency does not equate to omnipotence. Jesus said, referring to His second coming in Matthew 24: "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." And that must require foreknowledge of how every person that has ever lived will act - past, present and future. A slight digression: having just quoted the above verse, I am puzzled as to why the Father has knowledge that the Son does not. Is Jesus saying that in His humanity He does not have this knowledge? Because if the Son does not have this knowledge in His divinity, would that not make the Son lesser than the Father? Some help would be appreciated on this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godrulz Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 885 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/25/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/19/1960 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I used to think that Jesus did not know in His humanity, but this is problematic. I now think that the date was not fixed in the first century and that the Father would bring it to pass in the future. At that point, the Son would know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,220 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,480 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I figured out how to express the main point I've been trying to make. When one tries to figure out quantum physics and string theory and the like, one is left feeling overwhelmed and confused and fully aware that he is looking into something he has to accept on faith without being able to make sense of it. When you try to figure out God, and such things as His omniscience, if you are not left with the same feeling, you are completely missing the boat, and what you think you know isn't right. did we actually think Our Father in Heaven would not have been found so... the reality of truth is in the Message and it increases our faith and shrinks our own personal opinion of ourselves... yeah for when I am weak (small) He is seen as He is Strong (Larger...) We have plenty of room to grow and increase in Him-> for He is without end... Love Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,220 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,480 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Time is more fundamental than space. Time marches on even if we do not measure it (the subjective measures of time should not be confused with objective time itself). Endless time is more coherent than timelessness.Just because there was no clocks, moons, suns, etc. before creation, does not mean there was no duration/succession/sequence in God's triune relations (otherwise, creation is co-eternal with God). God must think, act, feel in sequence, even apart from creation. It is a myth that time is created or limited to creation. The temporal measures of time were created, but the concept has always been an aspect of an eternal God's experience (without limiting Him). http://www.revivalth...s/eternity.html Try this on for size.... Okay! try this on for size... To avoid the conclusions regarding time which are at the heart of evolutionary hypotheses,astronomers go to great lengths in inventing explanations regarding the"missing mass." Margon3 suggests that "we have reached animpasse, almost to the point Thomas Kuhn has called a scientific revolution.Apparently, unless the experimental data are blatantly in error, it isinevitable that some cherished astronomical or physical principle must fall. Itwould seem that the ax should fall upon the supposed aeons-long time age thatis assigned a priori to the Universe, the Solar System, and Earth, for thisconcept of huge quantities of time leads to contradictory and illogicalposition in certain aspects of astrophysics. Pastedfrom <http://www.icr.org/a...es/view/73/342/> Love Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted August 3, 2011 String theory is speculative and probably wrong. Quantum mechanics/chaos theory actually supports Open Theism vs determinism. I had the same problem when I tried to figure out eternal now, God knowing the future, time travel in sci-fi movies, etc. The problem was that it was incoherent, wrong, confusing. When I found a biblical, logical, coherent view, I could understand and had a eureka moment. The lights came on. I have tried to merge it with tradition, but this will not work, since one is correct and the other is not. I have tried to undermine my new view or try to prove the classic view, but I cannot since I am convinced that it is more true, less problematic than other views. Most people do not think critically about these things, so they just spout traditional statements without really being able to defend them (begging the question). So you believe God is small enough to fit into your understanding? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 God is responsive by His intelligence and ability. Since exhaustive foreknowledge would fix the future, it offers no providential advantage because God could not change it even if He wanted to (would make His FK wrong). You still have not demonstrated from Scripture that God changes the future or simply responds to events as they occur. You have not demonstrated Scripturally that God does not know our future decisions and choices. You are relying more on philosophy and philosophical assumptions than you are on Scripture. That would explain you cannot employ God's self-disclosure to support your view. God does not reveal Himself according to your limited and unbiblical view of Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,220 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,480 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted August 3, 2011 String theory is speculative and probably wrong. Quantum mechanics/chaos theory actually supports Open Theism vs determinism. I had the same problem when I tried to figure out eternal now, God knowing the future, time travel in sci-fi movies, etc. The problem was that it was incoherent, wrong, confusing. When I found a biblical, logical, coherent view, I could understand and had a eureka moment. The lights came on. I have tried to merge it with tradition, but this will not work, since one is correct and the other is not. I have tried to undermine my new view or try to prove the classic view, but I cannot since I am convinced that it is more true, less problematic than other views. Most people do not think critically about these things, so they just spout traditional statements without really being able to defend them (begging the question). So you believe God is small enough to fit into your understanding? 11 words... 1 point per word... 11 points game over! SCORE.... sorry Neb i get a little carried away at times Love Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
methinkshe Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 679 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/02/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 3, 2011 I used to think that Jesus did not know in His humanity, but this is problematic. I now think that the date was not fixed in the first century and that the Father would bring it to pass in the future. At that point, the Son would know. Thank you for your response. T However, your answer does not sit well with my spirit. In truth, I would prefer to remain in ignorance and trust God with my ignorance than to adopt the resolution that you propose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godrulz Posted August 3, 2011 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 885 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/25/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/19/1960 Share Posted August 3, 2011 String theory is speculative and probably wrong. Quantum mechanics/chaos theory actually supports Open Theism vs determinism. I had the same problem when I tried to figure out eternal now, God knowing the future, time travel in sci-fi movies, etc. The problem was that it was incoherent, wrong, confusing. When I found a biblical, logical, coherent view, I could understand and had a eureka moment. The lights came on. I have tried to merge it with tradition, but this will not work, since one is correct and the other is not. I have tried to undermine my new view or try to prove the classic view, but I cannot since I am convinced that it is more true, less problematic than other views. Most people do not think critically about these things, so they just spout traditional statements without really being able to defend them (begging the question). So you believe God is small enough to fit into your understanding? No, but we have sufficient reason and revelation to make truth statements about issues. We can understand somethings about God, but never exhaustively. There are many false views on Scripture and God. Defending a right view over a wrong view on specific issues does not mean we are thinking God is small enough to fit our understanding?! A face value reading of Scripture and a view that resonates with common sense is preferred over a speculative, philosophical one that is neither coherent nor biblical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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