Gentile Salvation

[Guest agua]

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[Guest]

Will any Gentiles before Jesus shed His blood at the Cross receive salvation?

Eph 2:13-16 NKJV But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. (14) For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, (15) having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, (16) and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

Jas 2:25-26 NKJV Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way? (26) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Will Rahab be resurrected to life or condemnation ?

Jos 2:8-13 NKJV Now before they lay down, she came up to them on the roof, (9) and said to the men: "I know that the LORD has given you the land, that the terror of you has fallen on us, and that all the inhabitants of the land are fainthearted because of you. (10) For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red Sea for you when you came out of Egypt, and what you did to the two kings of the Amorites who were on the other side of the Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom you utterly destroyed. (11) And as soon as we heard these things, our hearts melted; neither did there remain any more courage in anyone because of you, for the LORD your God, He is God in heaven above and on earth beneath. (12) Now therefore, I beg you, swear to me by the LORD, since I have shown you kindness, that you also will show kindness to my father's house, and give me a true token, (13) and spare my father, my mother, my brothers, my sisters, and all that they have, and deliver our lives from death."

She had great faith it seems.

A Gentile Manifesto

And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God: Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me. Ruth 1:16-17

[~candice~]

There is only one way to salvation, there has only ever been one way, and it doesn't differ for jews or gentiles before or after Jesus death. Salvation is by faith alone in Christ alone.

So to answer the question, yes, I believe some gentiles who died before Jesus died, will be saved.

[~candice~]

A Gentile Manifesto

And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God: Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me. Ruth 1:16-17

Rth 1:16 NKJV But Ruth said: "Entreat me not to leave you, Or to turn back from following after you; For wherever you go, I will go; And wherever you lodge, I will lodge; Your people shall be my people, And your God, my God.

Ruth joined herself with the Israelites. Was that necessary for her to receive salvation?

No, how could it be necessary? I think it was a demonstration of her faith, rather than a necessity of faith.

[Guest]

Oh, I don't know Agua, what about Gentiles like Adam and Eve, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Job, Noah to name a few that might? Maybe a few others?

[~candice~]

I kinda get what you are saying... but it is a response to your faith/salvation and not a requirement of it.

The analogy fits if you don't stretch it too far, but, there are differences between National Israel and the church.

If she were saved today she would have automatically been a part of the body (church), but joining a nation is something hmm with a different ring to it.

[Eccl12v13]

Where in God's word does it state that Abraham was a Gentile? How can Abraham, who was also called a Hebrew, ALSO be a Gentile? A Gentile is NOT anyone other that an Israelite. A Gentile is a nation of people just as the Israelites are a nation of people. Gentiles come from the seed of Japheth, while Abraham comes from the seed of Shem.

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[Eccl12v13]

Being a Gentile or not has nothing to do with salvation. Let's read who it was that was delivered from Egypt and let's read how God veiwed them all.

Exod.12

[37] And the children of Israel journeyed from Rameses to Succoth, about six hundred thousand on foot that were men, beside children.

[38] And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, even very much cattle.

So it was not just the nation of Israel that was delivered...there were other nations that departed Egypt along with the Israelites. Now let's read if God gave these "mixed multitude" of people a different set of laws to keep than what He gave the Israelites.

Exod.12

[48] And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the LORD, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.

[49] One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Num.15

[15] One ordinance shall be both for you of the congregation, and also for the stranger that sojourneth with you, an ordinance for ever in your generations: as ye are, so shall the stranger be before the LORD.

[16] One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.

So there was one law for ALL that choose to follow the true and living God. Let's continue....

[27] And if any soul sin through ignorance, then he shall bring a she goat of the first year for a sin offering.

[28] And the priest shall make an atonement for the soul that sinneth ignorantly, when he sinneth by ignorance before the LORD, to make an atonement for him; and it shall be forgiven him.

[29] Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.

Even for the forgiveness of sins was there ONE LAW for all. It didn't matter what nation you were from. According to God a sin is a sin, and what it takes to forgive sin, it takes the samething for ALL!

And was there a different punishment if one was not of the nation of Israel? Let's read...

[30] But the soul that doeth ought presumptuously, whether he be born in the land, or a stranger, the same reproacheth the LORD; and that soul shall be cut off from among his people.

So the person, ANY PERSON, that wilfully sinned were put to death; whether they were a stranger or an Israelite. Sounds fair to me.

Let’s read if this changed AFTER Jesus came and shed His blood.

Heb.10

[26] For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

[27] But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

So God does not have (2) standards. Whatever it took for the nation of Israel..it took the same for ANY stranger...whether they were a Gentile or from another nation of people. The punishment for sin did NOT change after the shedding of Jesus Blood. Now if the punishment remained the same, why would God change the requirement for salvation? He wouldn't!

Now let's confirm this. Let's see if those that died BEFORE Christ came to shed His blood had to do something different for salvation from those that came AFTER Christ shed His blood.

Ezek.18

[20] The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Now we know what a sinner is. It is one that breaks the laws of God, which, according to God's inspired word, ALL have done. And the scriptures says he that sinneth shall die. Understand the death spoken of here is the second death., for everyone must die the first death. Now let's read what happens if the sinner, not just one from the nation of Israel, but ANY sinner turns from his ways, and stops breaking God's laws, or stop sinning;

[21] But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

[22] All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.

Notice God did not say if just one from the nation of Israel stopped sinning he shall live. God's word simple says, "...if the WICKED will turn from his sins...."! That would include those of the nation of Israel, those of the nation of Gentiles, or those from ANY other nation of people!

Now....does the wicked today, even AFTER the shedding of Jesus blood, have to STOP sinning for salvation? Or can they continue therein and YET receive the reward of eternal life?

What it took then and what it takes now for salvation is the SAME for EVERYONE; Israelite, Gentile, or ANY other nation of people!

"For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed."

"Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever."

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[mizzdy]

Oh, I don't know Agua, what about Gentiles like Adam and Eve, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Job, Noah to name a few that might? Maybe a few others?

They had the saving knowledge of the Messiah, they knew God thats how they are saved.

[mizzdy]

Will any Gentiles before Jesus shed His blood at the Cross receive salvation?

Eph 2:13-16 NKJV But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. (14) For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, (15) having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, (16) and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

Jas 2:25-26 NKJV Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way? (26) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Will Rahab be resurrected to life or condemnation ?

Jos 2:8-13 NKJV Now before they lay down, she came up to them on the roof, (9) and said to the men: "I know that the LORD has given you the land, that the terror of you has fallen on us, and that all the inhabitants of the land are fainthearted because of you. (10) For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red Sea for you when you came out of Egypt, and what you did to the two kings of the Amorites who were on the other side of the Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom you utterly destroyed. (11) And as soon as we heard these things, our hearts melted; neither did there remain any more courage in anyone because of you, for the LORD your God, He is God in heaven above and on earth beneath. (12) Now therefore, I beg you, swear to me by the LORD, since I have shown you kindness, that you also will show kindness to my father's house, and give me a true token, (13) and spare my father, my mother, my brothers, my sisters, and all that they have, and deliver our lives from death."

She had great faith it seems.

Yes, its always been about faith in Him, faith in God that He will keep His promises to His called out assembly, and we know grace and faith have always been alive and present to those who seek Him.

The thing with Ruth, Rahab and the rest who were gentiles, they joined to the only body of people who knew God, it is necessary to join to those who have the same faith, the same goals, the same God, the same Messiah, the same outcome. Then knew the God of Israel was the true and only God. We join to that assembly of called out ones, I call this assembly Israel, some call it the church, it is all who come to Him in faith and when we, and all those who have come before, do this we become His, no longer gentile, Jew, greek or whatever we become His.

shalom,

Mizz