Genesis Flood: Entire earth or local? (Is "godandscience" a cr

[Jayyycuuup]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

The Bible is the word of God.

2 Timothy 3:16 (King James Version)

¹⁶ All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.

Listening to legends or myths is not biblical and you walk in my opinion on thin ice.

Hi ncn,

I agree that the Bible is the inspired word of God, but there are some things in the Bible that is taken as an allegory, and not taken literally. Also, the Holy Spirit would not take over a person's mind and body the way a demon does. A man under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit would still have his human knowledge and free will.

Also, the scripture below is an example of why some things in the Bible is not to be always taken literally:

Ruth 2:12 The LORD recompense thy work, and a full reward be given thee of the LORD God of Israel, under whose wings thou art come to trust.

I don't think God our Father has wings. As for the Great Flood, I think God was giving us a message. The message is all the wicked will perish and those who are righteous (like Noah) will be saved. I would think the Great Flood is really a local flood pointing to a global judgement of people who are wicked and righteous.

In Christ,

Selene

Selene your statement contradicts the bible to a tee.... All flesh were effected by the flood, as said in Genesis 9:11-17 "Thus I established My covenant with you:Never again shall all flesh be cut off by the waters of the flood; never again shall there be a flood to destroy the earth. And God said "This is the sign of the covenant which I make between Me and you, and every living creature that is with you, for perpetual generations: I set My rainbow in the cloud and it shall be for the sign of the covenant between Me and the Earth. It shall be, when I bring a cloud over the earth that the rainbow shall be seen in the cloud; and I will remember My covenant which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh.; the waters shall never again become a flood to destroy all flesh. The rainbow shall be in the cloud, and I will look on it to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth. And God said to Noah "This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth."

Jacob, my post does not contradict scripture. I stated that the inspiration of the Holy Spirit does not take away human knowledge. So, to the author's human knowledge, the entire earth looked like it was flooded only because he saw water everywhere. All his human eyes could see was water everywhere, but his human eyes could not see if North and South America was also flooded. The Holy Spirit does not act like a demon who possesses a person. When a demon possesses a person, it takes over the person's body and mind.

So the scripture I posted, doesnt mean anything ? The things that were told do not stand true ??? The God I know, when He tells me something I better believe it....when God says He sent forth water to destroy man, that means to me (reading scripture) that water engulfed the earth.

[ncn]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

"Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar."

Proverbs 30. 5-6.

[Steve_S]

Gen 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

I don't think that it can get more literal than this. The Word speaks for Itself here. Digging and hoping for it to mean something that it doesn't say so that it's easier to reconcile beliefs with that of those being pushed by secular parts of the world who are God hating is pointless.

[IatePistachiosSigningUp]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

Yes, but the local flood theory doesn't say it killed off some people. The local flood killed off all. Either way the whole population (excluding Noah and his family on the ark) were destroyed. So even if it were local, there's no why anyone could have had legends about it because they were still destroyed.

[Steve_S]

"Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar."

Proverbs 30:5-6

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

"Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar."

Proverbs 30:5-6

"

Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path." Psalm 119:105

i'm not adding anything to it. As I pointed out to you earlier, there are some things in the Bible that are not taken literally.....unless of course, you really believe that God has wings. I think it makes sense that the Holy Spirit does not take away a person's human knowledge when He inspires that person to write. Afterall, the word "all" in the Bible also does not imply everything. Look at the scripture below:

Luke 2:1, “And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus that all the world should be taxed”

So, did Caesar send out a decree to every part of the globe? No, but scripture says that they did. So, what exactly does it mean here? To the inspired author (Luke), it most likely meant the Roman world. Also, look at this other scripture regarding John the Baptist:

Mark 1:5 “The whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem went out to him”.

Does this mean that every last person in Jerusalem and Judea went to the Jordan to get baptised? Does that mean King Herod and Pilate were also baptised by John? No, this use of “all” clearly can be understood as limited due to the historical context.

It's quite possible that August actually decreed that all the world be taxed and He's just repeating what Augustus said here. The romans basically looked at everything outside of roman territory as barbarian and not part of the civilized world, so it would not have been uncharacteristic for that sort of statement to come from a roman emperor and just historically speaking this was towards the end of Augustus' reign and there had been wars with the illyrians and germans that required taxation to pay for and it was common to tax provinces harder than they taxed the population of the actual city of Rome. So this may just be a paraphrase of what another man said here.

Gen 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

I think that "all flesh, wherein is the breath of life," (meaning everything that breathes, I'd assume). Also, "from under heaven" certainly adds context here.

[IatePistachiosSigningUp]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

Yes, but the local flood theory doesn't say it killed off some people. The local flood killed off all. Either way the whole population (excluding Noah and his family on the ark) were destroyed. So even if it were local, there's no why anyone could have had legends about it because they were still destroyed.

But there are stories of a Great Flood in other countries and among many different cultures. The stories in other cultures also never suggested that it was a local flood as well. All the stories say it was a global flood. In the eyes of these ancient observers, it may appear as the entire world was affected, but they would not know that at all from where they are standing. Today in our modern world, we can tell if an event was worldwide or local because we have satellites in space to show that. Through these satellites, we can see the entire world. But to people of the ancient world, they only see with their own eyes. Our eyes today is different from the eyes of the ancient people. I think in order to understand the Bible, we need to look at it from their point of view rather than our modern point of view.

There are plenty of stories similar to Biblical accounts. If it were completely global, there is no way that ancients could have recorded it. They would have been wiped out. If it were local, and there were accounts from other people, that would contradict what the Bible says about all of humanity being destroyed at the time. People didn't scatter around the world until after the Tower of Babel was destroyed. Before the flood, there was only civilization around the Mesopotamia world, so how could they have recorded it if there weren't people around the entire globe?

[Steve_S]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

Yes, but the local flood theory doesn't say it killed off some people. The local flood killed off all. Either way the whole population (excluding Noah and his family on the ark) were destroyed. So even if it were local, there's no why anyone could have had legends about it because they were still destroyed.

But there are stories of a Great Flood in other countries and among many different cultures. The stories in other cultures also never suggested that it was a local flood as well. All the stories say it was a global flood. In the eyes of these ancient observers, it may appear as the entire world was affected, but they would not know that at all from where they are standing. Today in our modern world, we can tell if an event was worldwide or local because we have satellites in space to show that. Through these satellites, we can see the entire world. But to people of the ancient world, they only see with their own eyes. Our eyes today is different from the eyes of the ancient people. I think in order to understand the Bible, we need to look at it from their point of view rather than our modern point of view.

There are plenty of stories similar to Biblical accounts. If it were completely global, there is no way that ancients could have recorded it. They would have been wiped out. If it were local, and there were accounts from other people, that would contradict what the Bible says about all of humanity being destroyed at the time. People didn't scatter around the world until after the Tower of Babel was destroyed. Before the flood, there was only civilization around the Mesopotamia world, so how could they have recorded it if there weren't people around the entire globe?

This is pretty simple to me. It was a legend passed down by the descendants of Noah who repopulated the earth. So all those people scattered and carried the flood legend with them.

[jasoncran]

ok, the jews believe per ramban that the flood covered the whole. earth. the book of beersherit(genesis) is a written oral story with an exodus bias. noah met abram and taught him the story. and he passed it on, nahor as well.if the flood of genesis is local then so will be his return as peter compares the end of the earth to that.

[IatePistachiosSigningUp]

in fact it was only Mesopotamia that was flooded.

Just as the Flood was Global, so will be the Final Judgment.

I don't think it was global. If it was truely global, every culture on earth would have a flood legend or myth. There are cultures that have no legends or myths of a flood; therefore, it could not be global. There are some things in the Bible that are more allegory. The Great Flood is one of them.

Thanks for your replies, guys.

Selene, I can see how a local flood could be percieved from the word. However, of cultural myths and legends about floods don't exist; YHWH destroyed all flesh (except for noah of course). How then would other cultures even be able to write about a flood that happened?

Some cultures do have flood myths and others don't. For example, the island (Palau) not far from mine has a flood myth, but my island has no flood myth. This is why I said, the Great Flood was a local event rather than a global event because there are cultures that do tell of a great flood in their country and others don't have it at all. If there was a Great Flood, only the Bible would record it, but other cultures around the world have stories of a Great Flood as well. And these stories are just as old as the Bible.

Yes, but the local flood theory doesn't say it killed off some people. The local flood killed off all. Either way the whole population (excluding Noah and his family on the ark) were destroyed. So even if it were local, there's no why anyone could have had legends about it because they were still destroyed.

But there are stories of a Great Flood in other countries and among many different cultures. The stories in other cultures also never suggested that it was a local flood as well. All the stories say it was a global flood. In the eyes of these ancient observers, it may appear as the entire world was affected, but they would not know that at all from where they are standing. Today in our modern world, we can tell if an event was worldwide or local because we have satellites in space to show that. Through these satellites, we can see the entire world. But to people of the ancient world, they only see with their own eyes. Our eyes today is different from the eyes of the ancient people. I think in order to understand the Bible, we need to look at it from their point of view rather than our modern point of view.

There are plenty of stories similar to Biblical accounts. If it were completely global, there is no way that ancients could have recorded it. They would have been wiped out. If it were local, and there were accounts from other people, that would contradict what the Bible says about all of humanity being destroyed at the time. People didn't scatter around the world until after the Tower of Babel was destroyed. Before the flood, there was only civilization around the Mesopotamia world, so how could they have recorded it if there weren't people around the entire globe?

This is pretty simple to me. It was a legend passed down by the descendants of Noah who repopulated the earth. So all those people scattered and carried the flood legend with them.

Well, of course Noah would have told stories, as well as his family, but that still doesn't show how accounts would have been written elsewhere in the world to show that it was global.

[IatePistachiosSigningUp]

ok, the jews believe per ramban that the flood covered the whole. earth. the book of beersherit(genesis) is a written oral story with an exodus bias. noah met abram and taught him the story. and he passed it on, nahor as well.if the flood of genesis is local then so will be his return as peter compares the end of the earth to that.

What verse or book does Peter compare the end to the flood again?