doubting_tommy Posted April 25, 2013 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 264 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 11 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/19/2010 Status: Offline Author Share Posted April 25, 2013 What do you think it could mean...can you google this too? Look for John 3:16 and the Bible... Do you have a Bible? I don't have a Bible to hand. The part I find difficult to understand is how exactly Jesus' death provides salvation. I don't really get the metaphysics of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted April 26, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 55 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted April 26, 2013 You didn't tell me your explanation of John3:16..... For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." What does you read here? 1 Peter2:24 He personally carried our sins in his body on the cross so that we can be dead to sin and live for what is right. By his wounds you are healed. So what does this tell you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedMomma Posted April 26, 2013 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 142 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 34 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/30/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/17/1971 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Agrees with onelight here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 ....I don't have a Bible to hand. The part I find difficult to understand is how exactly Jesus' death provides salvation. I don't really get the metaphysics of it.... A Take .... I know God says it far better then I can and, without posting The Word I'll probably get it wrong but here goes! Sin is real and more deadly to the soul of the sinner than the venom of a viper and it is totally nasty in God's sight and cannot be in His presence. Hell is real and eternal. All have sinned. God The Father so loved the sinner that He laid the lashes for all the sins upon His Beloved Son to save the few who will receive His Gift. Jesus, God The Son, totally without sin, so loved His Father and the sinner that He went to and stayed upon The Cross and became sin and took all the lashes needed to full pay the sin debt of the whole world to save the few who will receive His Gift! All you need to do is to turn away from your nasty old sinful self, repent of your nasty old sinful self and receive God's gift by faith. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) Which you can't even do by yourself except for The Holy Spirit drawing you to God and convicting you of your horrible sinfulness and Jesus' total innocence and totally breaking your heart for what you have done!.... And As For The Understanding Of The Dark World Of Metaphysical Religions You Might Start By Looking Into The Illogical Heart And Mind Of Those Sorcerers Of The Evolutionary Myth Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their counsel from the LORD, and their works are in the dark, and they say, Who seeth us? and who knoweth us? Surely your turning of things upside down shall be esteemed as the potter's clay: for shall the work say of him that made it, He made me not? or shall the thing framed say of him that framed it, He had no understanding? Isaiah 29:15-16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 What do you think it could mean...can you google this too? Look for John 3:16 and the Bible... Do you have a Bible? I don't have a Bible to hand. The part I find difficult to understand is how exactly Jesus' death provides salvation. I don't really get the metaphysics of it. Not having a Bible is not a problem. There are plenty available on the Internet. Try this site: http://www.biblegateway.com/ Just enter the reference, like John 3:16, in the search box to see a verse, John 3 will give you the whole chapter, etc. You can also step through a book one chapter at a time. The default Bible version is for the New International Version (NIV) which is pretty easy to read, but there are other versions available too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted April 26, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 55 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted April 26, 2013 What do you think it could mean...can you google this too? Look for John 3:16 and the Bible... Do you have a Bible? I don't have a Bible to hand. The part I find difficult to understand is how exactly Jesus' death provides salvation. I don't really get the metaphysics of it. Not having a Bible is not a problem. There are plenty available on the Internet. Try this site: http://www.biblegateway.com/ Just enter the reference, like John 3:16, in the search box to see a verse, John 3 will give you the whole chapter, etc. You can also step through a book one chapter at a time. The default Bible version is for the New International Version (NIV) which is pretty easy to read, but there are other versions available too. I know not having a Bible is not the biggest problem , I was hoping douting-tommy will figure some questions out by himself,it's only the Holy Spirit who can show him the truth and he will find that in Gods word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 I know not having a Bible is not the biggest problem , I was hoping douting-tommy will figure some questions out by himself,it's only the Holy Spirit who can show him the truth and he will find that in Gods word. Understood, but I offered the site suggestion because he said he didn't have a Bible on hand, and it seemed to me that he might need access to one in order to search out those answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 The creation reveals a God who is all powerful, all knowing and is present everywhere at once. The creator is always greater than the creation. Understanding how nature reveals God is like being lost in dark cave and suddenly seeing a pinhole of light. If you move in the direction of the light, it should lead you to freedom. If you ignore the light, you are doomed to remain lost. Nature points you to God who created it. But if you ignore the witness of nature, you will be doomed to remain lost and without God. The worst part about that is that you are still accountable to God whether you believe He is real or not. Disbelieving in God isn't going to make Him go away. So while you can justify your unbelief to your own satisfaction, you still have to face the inevitable day when you will stand before Him and give an account of yourself. While I don't believe that we can infer the kinds of qualities you describe, even assuming that that is correct for the sake of argument, we're still very far away from the God of the Bible. There is nothing in nature alone, for example, which suggests that the Creator of the Universe cares whether I believe in it or not. For that, I need the Bible. When we consider the atmosphere, the lithosphere the biosphere and the hydrosphere, and if we are willing to contemplate the possibility that an intelligent creator is the causal agent for all of them, the question is what kind of creator could have done all of this? It would have taken a creator that is greater than what he has created. It would take a creator far greater in intelligence than us (we are still discovering things about our world), greater in power and also one who possesses an infinite presence in order to sustain and guide all of it at once. The uniform and consistent order of the universe speaks to a plan and a purposee. The movement of planets and stars are very predictable, the order of the seasons, the way the biological life interacts and adapts to the changes of the seasons and changes of environment. There is a program to it all. Sure, it won't reveal God in the same way the Bible does. It isn't meant to. It points to a creator, though. It points you in the right direction, just like the pinhole of light in the dark cave. The natural world gives you a point of departure on your journey to seek God. It is the starting point, if you will. Nature reveals that it has a Creator, and it is the Bible that tells who that Creator is and His desire to be in relationship/fellowship with you. In theological circles, we speak of "general revelation" to refer to the witness of the created order. General revelation is what we can see and know about God through the natural world. We also speak of "special revelation" which is what can be known about God through the Scriptures, the Bible. Both work in tandem with each other. Many who reject the general revelation in nature, also reject the special revelation found in Scripture. I have never run into anyone that accepts one without the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted April 26, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.93 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted April 26, 2013 Sorry, I thought I had answered that. My intuition is that people could be accountable for rejecting God, but I don't see how people could be accountable for rejecting God in cases where they don't have access to the information necessary to accept God. I think everyone here seems to agree with that (as I understand what has been explained to me so far, the claim is that everybody has the information necessary to accept God, even in cases where they have no access to the Bible). Tommy, suppose you find the answer that explains it to you in such a way that it makes sense to you. What would you do with this knowledge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted April 26, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.93 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted April 26, 2013 I don't have a Bible to hand. The part I find difficult to understand is how exactly Jesus' death provides salvation. I don't really get the metaphysics of it. The Hebrew word for sin is a word that means "missing the mark," but more specifically, it is what causes one to miss the mark. Because we live in a world of darkness, that darkness we live in can be reason enough for us to miss the mark (an archer can't hit a target he can't see). So even if the archer does all the right things, he still can't know where to aim. Why did God have to become man and die and rise again? I can't say that I know. What I do know is that the only way sin can be forgiven is if it is atoned for with blood. This theme is all throughout Scripture. I don't have time to write more now. But if you truly are wanting to know these things, you can begin by writing the word "atonement" in a search engine and start reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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