LookingForAnswers Posted January 21, 2014 Group: Seeker Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,033 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 67 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/26/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 There is no sin you can commit that doesn't harm other people. Every choice we make has far reaching consequences, many time unintended. We don't see the big picture and so the notion that I have no right to say about what you do in the privacy of your home, isn't true. The things you choose to do today are seeds that someone will reap the harvest of later. What is really telling is attitude that I care so little about you that I will allow you to continue to destroy your body because that is your "right." Your "right" to destroy your live overrides any moral obligation upon me to at least try to lead out of that self-destructive tail spin. How many people will go to hell because someone else decided that that person's "right" to live a certain way was more important than bringing them to the truth?? The notion that we can't pass laws to regulate behavior usually stems from a moral indifference to that behavior. We have no problem with laws that prohibit activities that we are genuinely opposed to. We usually oppose legislation that regulates or prohibits the kinds of activities that we are either morally indifferent to, or are in favor of. You do not save people from hell by outlawing actions, a change of heart is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marnie Posted January 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 811 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 7,338 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 76 Days Won: 2 Joined: 10/06/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted January 21, 2014 Here's the thing. What applies to the believer does not apply to the unconverted. The Bible is the believer's manual for life, but according to its own testimony, the teachings of Scrpture are foolishness to the unsaved. Believers are called to admonish one another; to spur one another on in the faith. We are called to judge one another, not for the purpose of punishing them but to encourage one another to live lives that glorify G-d. Given that, if I know that a fellow believer is involved in some kind of sin, it is my duty to confront them in love. We are not called to do the same thing with unbelievers. In fact, we called to NOT judge the world; that is G-d's job. So, in a broad, libertarian sense, who am I to tell an unsaved person to stop his sinning? His body is his own personal property, so he can "eat, drink, and be merry" till the cows come home. Whether or not he stops his drunkeness or his gambling or his adultery, his eternal destination remains the same unless he confesses Christ. The Christian is not a citizen of this world. Our obligation is to obey the laws of the Kingdom, but the non-Christian is under no such obligation. So we, as Christians, have no business imposing our right, Biblical beliefs on non-Christians. We do, however, owe those non-Christians a thorough, well-reasoned, anointed presentation of the Gospel. When their hearts change, their behavior will follow. Part of our witness to the world, though, is demonstrating our faith by our involvement in society. So what you "support" is important. And how you do that makes a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 There is no sin you can commit that doesn't harm other people. Every choice we make has far reaching consequences, many time unintended. We don't see the big picture and so the notion that I have no right to say about what you do in the privacy of your home, isn't true. The things you choose to do today are seeds that someone will reap the harvest of later. What is really telling is attitude that I care so little about you that I will allow you to continue to destroy your body because that is your "right." Your "right" to destroy your live overrides any moral obligation upon me to at least try to lead out of that self-destructive tail spin. How many people will go to hell because someone else decided that that person's "right" to live a certain way was more important than bringing them to the truth?? The notion that we can't pass laws to regulate behavior usually stems from a moral indifference to that behavior. We have no problem with laws that prohibit activities that we are genuinely opposed to. We usually oppose legislation that regulates or prohibits the kinds of activities that we are either morally indifferent to, or are in favor of. You do not save people from hell by outlawing actions, a change of heart is required. Yeah but you do send them to hell by making them comfortable in their sin and telling them that what they are doing if fine and being an enbabler for sin. When you do that,you are a liability to the Kingdom of God and not an asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LookingForAnswers Posted January 21, 2014 Group: Seeker Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,033 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 67 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/26/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Here's the thing. What applies to the believer does not apply to the unconverted. The Bible is the believer's manual for life, but according to its own testimony, the teachings of Scrpture are foolishness to the unsaved. Believers are called to admonish one another; to spur one another on in the faith. We are called to judge one another, not for the purpose of punishing them but to encourage one another to live lives that glorify G-d. Given that, if I know that a fellow believer is involved in some kind of sin, it is my duty to confront them in love. We are not called to do the same thing with unbelievers. In fact, we called to NOT judge the world; that is G-d's job. So, in a broad, libertarian sense, who am I to tell an unsaved person to stop his sinning? His body is his own personal property, so he can "eat, drink, and be merry" till the cows come home. Whether or not he stops his drunkeness or his gambling or his adultery, his eternal destination remains the same unless he confesses Christ. The Christian is not a citizen of this world. Our obligation is to obey the laws of the Kingdom, but the non-Christian is under no such obligation. So we, as Christians, have no business imposing our right, Biblical beliefs on non-Christians. We do, however, owe those non-Christians a thorough, well-reasoned, anointed presentation of the Gospel. When their hearts change, their behavior will follow. Part of our witness to the world, though, is demonstrating our faith by our involvement in society. So what you "support" is important. And how you do that makes a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LookingForAnswers Posted January 21, 2014 Group: Seeker Followers: 0 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,033 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 67 Days Won: 2 Joined: 12/26/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 There is no sin you can commit that doesn't harm other people. Every choice we make has far reaching consequences, many time unintended. We don't see the big picture and so the notion that I have no right to say about what you do in the privacy of your home, isn't true. The things you choose to do today are seeds that someone will reap the harvest of later. What is really telling is attitude that I care so little about you that I will allow you to continue to destroy your body because that is your "right." Your "right" to destroy your live overrides any moral obligation upon me to at least try to lead out of that self-destructive tail spin. How many people will go to hell because someone else decided that that person's "right" to live a certain way was more important than bringing them to the truth?? The notion that we can't pass laws to regulate behavior usually stems from a moral indifference to that behavior. We have no problem with laws that prohibit activities that we are genuinely opposed to. We usually oppose legislation that regulates or prohibits the kinds of activities that we are either morally indifferent to, or are in favor of. You do not save people from hell by outlawing actions, a change of heart is required. Yeah but you do send them to hell by making them comfortable in their sin and telling them that what they are doing if fine and being an enbabler for sin. When you do that,you are a liability to the Kingdom of God and not an asset. There is a world of difference between outlawing a behavior and telling them what they are doing is fine. God did not call us to evangelize via laws and regulations, he called us to witness to the individual, to help change their heart. Laws change the outward appearance, not the heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 There is no sin you can commit that doesn't harm other people. Every choice we make has far reaching consequences, many time unintended. We don't see the big picture and so the notion that I have no right to say about what you do in the privacy of your home, isn't true. The things you choose to do today are seeds that someone will reap the harvest of later. What is really telling is attitude that I care so little about you that I will allow you to continue to destroy your body because that is your "right." Your "right" to destroy your live overrides any moral obligation upon me to at least try to lead out of that self-destructive tail spin. How many people will go to hell because someone else decided that that person's "right" to live a certain way was more important than bringing them to the truth?? The notion that we can't pass laws to regulate behavior usually stems from a moral indifference to that behavior. We have no problem with laws that prohibit activities that we are genuinely opposed to. We usually oppose legislation that regulates or prohibits the kinds of activities that we are either morally indifferent to, or are in favor of. You do not save people from hell by outlawing actions, a change of heart is required. Yeah but you do send them to hell by making them comfortable in their sin and telling them that what they are doing if fine and being an enbabler for sin. When you do that,you are a liability to the Kingdom of God and not an asset. There is a world of difference between outlawing a behavior and telling them what they are doing is fine. God did not call us to evangelize via laws and regulations, he called us to witness to the individual, to help change their heart. Laws change the outward appearance, not the heart. I didn't say that laws are meant to be tools for evangelism. What I am saying is that you can't separate laws from morality because laws are themselves based on certain moral standards of right and wrong. As I said before, people often only oppose laws that regulate what they feel is acceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted January 22, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,282 Content Per Day: 3.31 Reputation: 16,693 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 22, 2014 Who's morality should we impose on others? Which brand of Christianity should get to choose which morality we codify into law? Should we be stoning women for wearing pants? Some would tell you that even a single drink is a sin, that R rated movies are immoral and should be banned. Dancing, well that is a for sure a sin. How about outlawing lust? To lust is a sin and is immoral. Is there anything less moral that sex outside of marriage? I assume you think we should make this action illegal as well to "impose our morality" on others. The 10 commandments would be a good start. They are a framework for morality. How about teaching them in gradeschool instead of what is a "politicly correct" family or how not to offend any minority but bible believing Christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted January 22, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,282 Content Per Day: 3.31 Reputation: 16,693 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted January 22, 2014 There is no sin you can commit that doesn't harm other people. Every choice we make has far reaching consequences, many time unintended. We don't see the big picture and so the notion that I have no right to say about what you do in the privacy of your home, isn't true. The things you choose to do today are seeds that someone will reap the harvest of later. What is really telling is attitude that I care so little about you that I will allow you to continue to destroy your body because that is your "right." Your "right" to destroy your live overrides any moral obligation upon me to at least try to lead out of that self-destructive tail spin. How many people will go to hell because someone else decided that that person's "right" to live a certain way was more important than bringing them to the truth?? The notion that we can't pass laws to regulate behavior usually stems from a moral indifference to that behavior. We have no problem with laws that prohibit activities that we are genuinely opposed to. We usually oppose legislation that regulates or prohibits the kinds of activities that we are either morally indifferent to, or are in favor of. You do not save people from hell by outlawing actions, a change of heart is required. You are so very correct. But when we condone sin we see no need to share the Gospel so that God can change a heart. And when the law condones sin it promotes the kind of ungodliness that brings shame to a nation and for which judgement came upon the nation of Israel. It also becomes permissive toward the persecution of Christians for not condoning such immoral but now legalized behavior such as adultry, lying, homosexuality, fornication, pornography, abortion, euthanasia and the like. If our values are not the standard, the world's values are made the standard and we, by law, may be forced to conform to the world or face lawsuit. We now face an uphill battle where we once had the law supporting us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John SOG Posted January 30, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 28 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2014 Support and agree with what God's word says. If God doesn't you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John SOG Posted January 30, 2014 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 28 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2014 Sounds like you are getting what men say and what God says confused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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