Being a slave to sin under law....

[carlos123]

I was reading through Romans some more tonight and was wondering if ya all could give me your take on the following verse and what it says.....

Romans 6:14

For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.

A master is someone who has rights over others who are his slaves. He can tell them what to do and when to do it and there is nothing the slave can do about it.

How does being under grace free us from sin as a master?

How does being under law make sin our master?

Sin is sin and dwells in our flesh. How does being under grace or law affect the ability of sin to control us as a master?

Anybody?

Carlos

[Guest shiloh357]

I was reading through Romans some more tonight and was wondering if ya all could give me your take on the following verse and what it says.....

Romans 6:14

For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.

A master is someone who has rights over others who are his slaves. He can tell them what to do and when to do it and there is nothing the slave can do about it.

How does being under grace free us from sin as a master?

How does being under law make sin our master?

Sin is sin and dwells in our flesh. How does being under grace or law affect the ability of sin to control us as a master?

Anybody?

Carlos

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Under the law is positional. It is a reference to our standing before God. If you notice in chapters 5 and 6 of Romans, Paul uses three terms regarding the unbeliever: In Adam, slave to sin, and under the Law. These are three different ways of saying the same thing. If you are in Adam, then you are a slave to sin. If you die in Adam, as a slave to sin, you will stand before God "under the Law."

Conversely the believer is: In Christ, a slave to righteousness, and under grace.

Sin no longer has dominion over us, because we have been delivered from its hold over us. Just as the death of the Passover Lamb delivered the Children of Israel from the bondage of slavery in Egypt (a type of sin), The death of Jesus delivers us from bondage to sin.

I dont have time to fully answer all of your questions, but I hope this is good start. I will check back tonight. Perhaps others will have better answers.

[tsth]

I was reading through Romans some more tonight and was wondering if ya all could give me your take on the following verse and what it says.....

Romans 6:14

For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.

A master is someone who has rights over others who are his slaves. He can tell them what to do and when to do it and there is nothing the slave can do about it.

How does being under grace free us from sin as a master?

How does being under law make sin our master?

Sin is sin and dwells in our flesh. How does being under grace or law affect the ability of sin to control us as a master?

Anybody?

Carlos

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dear Carlos,

I answered this in detail under your other thread about "implications". I noticed that you did not understand it. You might take one more look at it, in light of this new thread. It's about understanding what grace REALLY IS, and how it works.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[tsth]

Romans 5:17 For if by the one man's offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.) 18 Therefore, as through one man's offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man's righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man's obedience many will be made righteous.

Grace empowers us to obedience, thereby giving us no excuse for "unrighteousness", as some would like us to believe.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[Sola Scriptora]

Paul elaborates on this in detail in Romans chappter 7, where he shows that although the law is good and holy, there in another law operating in our flesh, that prevents people from doing right, even when they want to. That is the status of an unsaved man under the law---powerless to do that which is right. The law holds up the standard, but provides no ability to obey it.

We have that now-Rom 8:1 under grace, for we are free from the law of sin and death. Jesus, the Holy One lives in us by His HOLY Spirit, and we can obey Him. Praise God forever!

[carlos123]

Dear Carlos,

I answered this in detail under your other thread about "implications".  I noticed that you did not understand it.  You might take one more look at it, in light of this new thread.  It's about understanding what grace REALLY IS, and how it works.

Hi Suzanne. Sorry it has taken me so relatively long to get back to you here but I am starting to loose who has responded to what as I get more involved in the forum and end up getting responses from all over the place.

I am still not quite clear on what I in particular do not understand about grace Suzanne. Can you please elaborate on that a bit more? I want to learn and if there is something I am not understanding about grace that is one category of issue that I am HUNGRY to learn in. So please don't hold back. What is it about grace that I do not understand?

If you could elaborate on that in the sense of highlighting for me what it is about grace that I do not understand I would be very grateful. Even if my understanding is foolish, childlike, immature, or whatever I won't take it personally. I come on this forum realizing that the Lord wants to teach me and I am very open to any input you might have.

Carlos

Edited January 1, 2005 by carlos123

[carlos123]

Paul elaborates on this in detail in Romans chappter 7, where he shows that although the law is good and holy, there in another law operating in our flesh, that prevents people from doing right, even when they want to.  That is the status of an unsaved man under the law---powerless to do that which is right.  The law holds up the standard, but provides no ability to obey it.

We have that now-Rom 8:1 under grace, for we are free from the law of sin and death.  Jesus, the Holy One lives in us by His HOLY Spirit, and we can obey Him.  Praise God forever!

Well Sola....for someone who posted what initially seemed to me a nasty article contrary to what I believe the fundamentals of the faith are you sure are sounding Scritptural in what you said above.

Hmmm....perhaps I misjudged the article you posted. I will have re-read it now that I have calmed down some .

It wouldn't be the first time I have misjudged something that's for sure.

Carlos

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Carlos,

If you are male and looking for fellowship in the Edmonton, Alberta Canada area please PM (private message) me. I am looking to start reading the New Testament with other men and discussing what it says with a view to hearing from God together.

Do you currently attend any fellowship? If so, what is its denomination? What denominations are availble in Edmonton? From your questions, it sounds like you need a good mentor like Paul was to Timothy and others. They are around, but you can't find them if you forsake fellowshipping one with another.

I have found many Worthy friends on this forum and they offer good council, albeit not as personal as it would be if we could all gather together in one home or area. Nevertheless, make Christ your most important priority. Study the Word and pray without ceasing. God WILL answer you if you seek Him diligently.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

[tsth]

Dear Carlos,

I answered this in detail under your other thread about "implications".

[carlos123]

Do you currently attend any fellowship?

Nope.

If so, what is its denomination? What denominations are availble in Edmonton?

Well I imagine there lots of denominations (I started writing demonations by accident) in Edmonton. Let's see...there's Baptists, Episcopalians, Mehodists, Pentecostals, Lutherans, Menonite, and you name it. Lot's of them.

I wouldn't bother going to 99.9% of them.

I've tried a bunch and in my mind 99.9% of them care more for following church traditions than the Word of God for their life and practice.

I was in a church once for ten years but it was a college church that was non-denominational. It was connected with the Great Commission Association of Churches (GCAC) and was very unorthodox in their church practice when compared to most denominational churches, though not in belief.

I left them as a result of not feeling loved when an intense discipleship move came into the church where everyone had to choose a mentor and everyone a disciple. Like someone not being picked to play basketball in a line up there wasn't a mentor that wanted me so I eventually left, ran away from God, and moved South to Florida and warmer weather. Ironic that I ended up in Alberta, Canada absolutely freezing my butt off as a direct result of wanting to draw closer to the Lord through involvemenet with my wife (a long story).

Incidentally the GCAC group of churches were led to see some of their faults by the Lord and repented of them. But by then I was already in Florida. They also didn't and don't believe in the gifts of the Spirit for today. I thought of going back to them but I couldn't given that.

It would take a bit to explain to you why I don't attend a local church anymore and I would be more than willing to do that if you want to hear it but through private email. Just PM me with your email address and I will be happy to explain things in more detail. Posting that long of an explanation would be too much for a forum post I think.

From your questions, it sounds like you need a good mentor like Paul was to Timothy and others. They are around, but you can't find them if you forsake fellowshipping one with another. 

I don't see myself forsaking fellowship Dad Ernie since I am getting lots and lots of it on this board and though email and learning tons. So many people seem so hung up on the need to attend a Sunday church service that anything less is seen as forsaking fellowship. You seem to think that way and I can understand why but I don't see myself as doing that. As for needing a mentor that would be great. If you know of any mature Christians men who love the Lord and would be willing to help me learn how best to do things from a Scriptural sound viewpoint (as opposed to a traditional, denominational viewpoint) I would be more than happy to make their acquaintence.

Carlos