Guest shiloh357 Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 No, the Charismatic approach to prayer does amount twisting God's arm if you listen to how they teach about prayer. I am getting it. I get what you and others are saying; but, what you and others are saying is false teaching. I used to live around Charismatics and their goofy theology about prayer. And I watched as they didn't get what they wanted and I watched as they went down in flames when God didn't do what they demanded of him. Charismatics believe that you can take promises from the Bible, stand on those promises until God fulfills them. Yes, it is a matter of twisting God's arm to him to do what whey want him to do. Yes, God wants you trust him in all things, but trusting him doesn't mean that God is going to do what you want. Trusting him means being willing to readily accept his answer even if it isn't what you wanted. Trusting him means, that he is enough, even if he says, "no, I am not going to heal you." It means knowing that even if everything in your life looks like it is falling apart, you will still hold on to him and trust him to keep you in the most adverse and tragic situations. You don't seem to have a very good grasp of what trust means. It's not a matter of trusting him to give good news. It's a matter of trusting him when worst things happened. It means trusting when the news isn't good at all. Any one can trust God when things are coming up roses and when life is all rainbows and butterflies, but trust finds its highest value for us when we are in the midst of the valley of the shadow of death. That's when you discover if you really trust him and that's also when you discover his faithfulness. It is in that awful dark place that your testimony is built. The "whatever" is literal, but it isn't a blank check. "Whatever" is balanced out by the sovereign will of God. Prayer is not about God giving you everything you ask for. You and others are confusing the idea of "whatever" with "anything" or "everything" you ask... Prayer isn't about changing God's mind or anything like that. Prayer changes us and brings us into a position of trusting God, even if we don't know his will in the matter. It brings us into a place of humble submission knowing that God is in control and working all thing for our good and we don't have to worry about the outcome, because the outcome will be the best, no matter what it is. Your last comments reveal that you can't really trust God if he isn't going to give you want you want. "Yes," "no," or "wait" makes it impossible in your eyes to trust God. You trust God to give you what you want, but you can't trust God if that expectation isn't met. That demonstrates very low and immature notion of what it means to truly trust God. You only trust God if he makes the "right" decision in your eyes. God worked in the lives of the prophets in a special way. To expect that each of us can expect live in the level of the supernatural like Elijah is really nothing more than vain presumption. God had special anointings on the prophets and on certain people in the Bible that are not offered to everyone else. So this notion that we can all have the same supernatural power that Elijah had is just nonsense. And I never said that God isn't big enough to answer prayer. The problem is that you define, "answering prayer" as, "giving me what I want." You apparently don't see, "no" as an answer. It really has nothing to do with the either the size of your faith or God's size. It has to do with what God sovereignly decides he will do. His size is irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 19, 2015 I think people who sit in judgment over Charismatics, calling them goofy are just goofy themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Is it always in the perfect will of God to heal every person of any illness / disability 100% of the time? Discuss... God's will is that none of His children be sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,994 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,692 Content Per Day: 11.74 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2015 I think people who sit in judgment over Charismatics, calling them goofy are just goofy themselves. I do not believe in calling names no matter what their belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,994 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,692 Content Per Day: 11.74 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2015 Is it always in the perfect will of God to heal every person of any illness / disability 100% of the time? Discuss... God's will is that none of His children be sick. But it happens.Not everyone is going to be healed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 19, 2015 I think people who sit in judgment over Charismatics, calling them goofy are just goofy themselves. I do not believe in calling names no matter what their belief. I agree...it's just goofy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted June 19, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Is it always in the perfect will of God to heal every person of any illness / disability 100% of the time? Discuss... God's will is that none of His children be sick. But it happens.Not everyone is going to be healed. But it isn't God's will that we be ill. Some aren't healed immediately, but they give up before they receive it, saying that they have not been healed. Others receive an excellent, yet not instantaneous healing through the use of medical intervention. Others have all the faith they need to appropriate their own healing, which is in the Atonement, and they are healed. Others, still, have that same faith, and the Lord takes them home, where He ministers complete wholeness to them there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 I didn't call anyone goofy. I said their theology was goofy. Learn how to read, Floatingaxe... You can't really refute my points, just complain and bear false witness... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Floatingaxe, the question is whether or not it is God's will to divinely heal every believer in THIS life. We will get new bodies in heaven, but that is not the issue. The Bible doesn't promise that God will heal 100% of the time when asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FresnoJoe Posted June 20, 2015 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 207 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,651 Content Per Day: 1.17 Reputation: 5,761 Days Won: 4 Joined: 01/31/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/04/1943 Share Posted June 20, 2015 the question is whether or not it is God's will to divinely heal every believer in THIS life. We will get new bodies in heaven, but that is not the issue. The Bible doesn't promise that God will heal 100% of the time when asked. ~ Beloved, Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full. John 16:24 Maybe The Issue Here Is Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts. James 4:3 Does God Really Hear Our Prayers The eyes of the LORD are upon the righteous, and his ears are open unto their cry. Psalm 34:15 And Dear One My Prayer For Thee And Me Is Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts: And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting. Psalms 139:23-24 In The Name Of Jesus I Pray Thank You Abba For Answered Prayer Amen ~ Or Maybe The Issue Here Is I said, LORD, be merciful unto me: heal my soul; for I have sinned against thee. Psalms 41:4 Does God Still Heal He healeth the broken in heart, and bindeth up their wounds. Psalms 147:3 To Draw And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people. Matthew 4:23 Sinners To Him Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. Hebrews 13:8 ~ Or Maybe The Real Issue Here Is Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 1 Corinthians 1:10 The Unholy Evil Separation For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. 1 Corinthians 1:11-12 Of The Body Of Christ Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? 1 Corinthians 1:13 As The Greatest And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. Zechariah 12:10 Revival Ever Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest. Luke 10:2 Sweeps Across The Earth Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD. Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live: And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD. Ezekiel 37:4-6 ~ Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING Until the spirit be poured upon us from on high, and the wilderness be a fruitful field, and the fruitful field be counted for a forest. Isaiah 32:15 Love, Your Brother Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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