Ezra Posted September 3, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.33 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted September 3, 2015 Melhisedec spent nine months into his mother womb...Since we are told that he was "without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life" (Heb 7:3) he could not have possibly spent any time in any mother's womb. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.The Holy Spirit enlarged our understanding of this King-Priest in the book of Hebrews. As to those who question the authorship of Hebrews, there is sufficient internal evidence to indicate that the apostle Paul was the writer and the Holy Spirit was the Author. It is interesting to note that in the Greek Textus Receptus (Stephanus 1550) the heading of this epistle states in Greek "The Epistle of Paul to the Hebrews" and so the original KJV had "The Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Hebrews". Since Paul is the primary writer of the New Testament, this is completely logical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeinChrist Posted September 4, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 192 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 1,393 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 635 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/29/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted September 4, 2015 Omegaman, Dave, perhaps you should not state things that make is sound as though we know the author of Hebrews was Paul, just a suggestion. I know there are many who disagree on things like did Moses write the Pentateuch, did Peter writ the Petrine letters etc,but the book of Hebrews does not claim to be authored by Paul, as I am sure you know, nor does the majority of scholarship claim it is Pauline. Doubts about it's authorship go back a log way in church History.That being said, the book is a masterpiece, and deserves it's place in the Bible, regardless of who wrote it, it is scripture and carries scriptural authority and sound teaching in harmony with the rest of scripture. Origen stated that only God knew who was the author. However, most scholars agree that it is heavily influenced, if not written by Paul, by his thought and influence. Whether it was Barnabas , Luke, or Apollos doesn't matter. It has the mark of Paul all over it and it carries Apostolic Authority. Peace,DaveHello Dave, I know there is no way for us to prove the author of Hebrews but I have often thought that it was Priscilla, the wife of Aquila. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Online Share Posted September 5, 2015 Melhisedec spent nine months into his mother womb...Since we are told that he was "without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life" (Heb 7:3) he could not have possibly spent any time in any mother's womb. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.The Holy Spirit enlarged our understanding of this King-Priest in the book of Hebrews. As to those who question the authorship of Hebrews, there is sufficient internal evidence to indicate that the apostle Paul was the writer and the Holy Spirit was the Author. It is interesting to note that in the Greek Textus Receptus (Stephanus 1550) the heading of this epistle states in Greek "The Epistle of Paul to the Hebrews" and so the original KJV had "The Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Hebrews". Since Paul is the primary writer of the New Testament, this is completely logical.I am disappointed by the avenue you choose to oppose the fact that Melhisedec was well known by, not only Abram but also by the King of Sodoma and the confederates which had fought with Abraham. And also by your attempt to teach others, how to build strongholds, by giving your royalty to someone, and taking sides, and loosing your own soundness of mind, by standing firm in somebody's else's opinion. The issue I raised is very simple and comes from the text in the writings in the book of Genesis. I have approach the story of Melhisedec, first as someone who lived before the writings of the letter of "Hebrews". Or before someone ever read those writings. Later I will considered his writings. First the istorical facts. Also we should considared if there is mention of Melhisedec and his Kingdom in other istorical books. And if we should considered those informations? Genesis 14:18, And Melhisedec King of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God. 14:19, And he blessed him, and said, blessed be Abram of the most High God, possessor of heaven and earth: 14:20, And bless be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into into thine hand. And he gave him tithes of all. The one who is describing the events identifies the one who met Abram, as Melhisedec and that he was the King of the city of Salem, but that he also was a priest of the Most High God.Been a King we understan, but what does it mean been a priest? What were the duties of the priest at that time? How can someone be quiliefied to be a priest? And a priest of the most high God? What did the writer new about him to called him a priest? To be a priest of someone you need the one who offers, and the one who accepts, the two can not be one and the same, you must have at list two or three if the offering is on behave of someone else. They had burned offerings that time. But did they have offerings for forgiveness of sins that time?Did Abram needed the services of a priest? Melhisedec did not have to identified himself to Abram and to the other people. They new who he was. Thats why they did not ask who are you? And where you coming from? Melhisedec had a lot of other people with him, and he must also had a lot of donkeys to carry the goods, and they must also ride their horses, they must also have the grain and vines fields to cultivate. They had the product of their labour with them, bread and wine. Maybe some dried figs, and some prunes, and raisins. And the carry with them and went away with all the goods, that Abram gave them. I don't have any doubt that we will meet Abram and Melhisedec in the heavens and get to know more about them, and they may want to know, what we thought about them. Melhisedec is a real factual person like you and me, and he is born, lived and died like any one else. Now regarding what we gather from the writer of Hebrews, what informations did he have, did he wright facts about Melhisedec or he is making paralell comparisons, to show that In the past God had not divided the duties of kings and priests as he had divided them in the Law he gave to Moses. There is a question thought. We know that the kings go to war and kill, the priest don't go to war, their hands are clean, from human blood. It's strange that the son of Aaron who killed one of their own in the tent of the Temple inherited the priesthood from Aaron. How about Abram and Melhisedec did they have human blood in their hands? Just questions. The writer of Hebrews said: that Jesus had no beginning of days, we all know the message the angel gave to Mary his Mother, and the Romans have the books of the registration of his birth. Now who he was and his doing before his birth in this world as a baby, we know quite a bit. We know that his Father is God, he call him Havenly Father, my Father is in heavens, He did not have an earthly Father, and we know when he died, and how he died, we know the begining and the end of his earthly life, that's how Paul was teaching, Contraring to suggestions made in that passage in Hebrews. That questions the view that Paul is the writer of the Hebrews.We all know that Jesus is the heir of the throne of David, and that he is a the high priest forever, and there is no need any more of the Aaronic priesthood. At the same time a king and a priest with no blood of animals in his hands, only his own blood. And for this kind of priest, with this kind of offering, there is no instructions in the Law that it can be administer and accepted in the earthly Temple. We have Angels of God appearing to Abraham and later to others, the parents of Samson, and to Jacob, to shepards to Moses and so on.We need to make an examination to see if Melhisedec was an Angel or the Lord God him self, as some suggest, and that he was not a real Person. The first thing we notice is, the name, "Melhichedec" this is a no, no, situation to have th name of the Angel, or the name of God. (Jesus was not born yet)( he was the Emanuel) the Lord God had to leave first everything and take flesh and become just like the children, and to be born as Jesus , so he can receive the glory waiting to be received by the Christ.They always bring messages from God about something that God propose to do. They never hide that they are Angels on a mission from God. They never bring any animals with them to carry material things to give and receive, as in the case at bar, soliciting a blessing from Abram, receiving the value of goods many times the value of the bread and wine they offered.A very bad business deal for the people, who would have enjoy the goods. Never Angels have receive goods to take with them when they go away. God never is identifey with a name, and if he realy was the most Holy One, all of them Whould have died.Say something about the appearance of Angels from the stories in the bible so we can make a comparison to test the claims about Melhishedec. The Lord said to Moses I have no name. "I Am that I Am" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.33 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2015 Now regarding what we gather from the writer of Hebrews, what informations did he have, did he wright facts about Melhisedec or he is making paralell comparisons, to show that In the past God had not divided the duties of kings and priests as he had divided them in the Law he gave to Moses. YCF,There is such as thing as progressive revelation in Scripture. For example the Church was a mystery to Israel before Pentecost and before it was unveiled to Paul. Therefore what is revealed in the book of Hebrews is progressively greater than what is revealed in Genesis. Hebrews is one of the most important books in the Bible, and it clearly shows us that Melchizedek was actually "without father, without mother, without descent". That is very powerful evidence that he was not an ordinary man, but in fact Jesus appearing as a Theophany before His incarnation. And the author of Hebrews (Paul) received his revelations directly from God. That is a Divinely inspired book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,379 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2015 Wow! How do you know Paul was the author of Hebrews? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.33 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2015 Wow! How do you know Paul was the author of Hebrews? Hebrews chapter 1318 Pray for us: for we trust we have a good conscience, in all things willing to live honestly.19 But I beseech you the rather to do this, that I may be restored to you the sooner.20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.22 And I beseech you, brethren, suffer the word of exhortation: for I have written a letter unto you in few words.23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty; with whom, if he come shortly, I will see you.24 Salute all them that have the rule over you, and all the saints. They of Italy salute you.25 Grace be with you all. Amen. (Written to the Hebrews from Italy, by Timothy.)Timothy was the constant companion and spiritual son of Paul. Verse 23 is the clearest proof that this epistle was written by Paul with Timothy as the scribe and God as the true Author. Thus the original KJV, following the Textus Receptus in the Greek, has a note at the end "Written to the Hebrews from Italy, by Timothy". Also notice verse 19 which is typical of Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,379 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted September 5, 2015 Thanks Ezra. I had never heard it explained that way, and it does make sense. I always assumed that Paul had written at least the closing of the letter ( as a confirmation of his approval ) but this is pretty logical evidence!Yes, amen Jeff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peacemakerIND Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 94 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 475 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/23/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/13/1962 Share Posted September 5, 2015 He is a priest.. He took the offering from Abraham, He is king too.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peacemakerIND Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 94 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 475 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 636 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/23/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/13/1962 Share Posted September 5, 2015 Melhisedec spent nine months into his mother womb...Since we are told that he was "without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life" (Heb 7:3) he could not have possibly spent any time in any mother's womb. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.The Holy Spirit enlarged our understanding of this King-Priest in the book of Hebrews. As to those who question the authorship of Hebrews, there is sufficient internal evidence to indicate that the apostle Paul was the writer and the Holy Spirit was the Author. It is interesting to note that in the Greek Textus Receptus (Stephanus 1550) the heading of this epistle states in Greek "The Epistle of Paul to the Hebrews" and so the original KJV had "The Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Hebrews". Since Paul is the primary writer of the New Testament, this is completely logical.Yes brother.. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted September 5, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Online Share Posted September 5, 2015 Melhisedec spent nine months into his mother womb...Since we are told that he was "without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life" (Heb 7:3) he could not have possibly spent any time in any mother's womb. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.The Holy Spirit enlarged our understanding of this King-Priest in the book of Hebrews. As to those who question the authorship of Hebrews, there is sufficient internal evidence to indicate that the apostle Paul was the writer and the Holy Spirit was the Author. It is interesting to note that in the Greek Textus Receptus (Stephanus 1550) the heading of this epistle states in Greek "The Epistle of Paul to the Hebrews" and so the original KJV had "The Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Hebrews". Since Paul is the primary writer of the New Testament, this is completely logical.Yes brother.. Melchizedek was simply a Theophany of Christ.... /////////////://////////////////////////////:::////You have misquote me.Please read my post very carefully, cause I work very hard to show that he was just like me and you a king and a priest, he was born just like me and you, he was a diferent king and priest, he lived in the O.T. . And we lived in the N.T. He died and went to Hades waiting for Jesus Christ to set him free. He did not go to the BOSSOM of Abraham, he was not a descendant of Abraham, and he was not Sircumsize, only Sircumsize offsprings of Abraham went to him waiting for Jesus to set them free and take them together with any one else who believe in him,(that he is the Christ), he died for all, and he preach the Gospel to every one down there, from the bigining of the world, that he is the Christ. He took every one who believed in him, out from there, to the heavenly Promice Land, they got born again down there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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