Speaking in tongues is that ,real or alive today ?

[ravindran]

2 hours ago, Flsnookman said:

I may be wrong but doesn't the Bible refer to two types of tongues? One where the Holy Spirit interprits "groanings" and one where people speaking different languages can understand each other? I will try and find the verses.

 

Mark 16:17 - And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

Romans 8:26  Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered

In Acts chapter 2

⁷ And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? ⁸ And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language? ⁹ Parthians and Medes andElamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, ¹⁰ Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, ¹¹ both Jews andproselytes, Cretans and Arabians—we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God

Some say it was a miracle of hearing! I believe people spoke in tongues (or other languages) which others were able to understand. Like an American speaking Greek. This was actually the first instance of speaking in tongues. Then we see Paul talking about tongues which others don't understand and it is direct communication with God. Rather than saying two types of tongues, I think we should say different operations of tongues. It is the same Holy Spirit enabling believers to speak in tongues. It is for different purposes and simply different operations. In corporate setting for edification of Church when there is interpretation, personal edification (during personal prayers) and as sign for unbelievers (when someone just speaks their native language without knowing it). I have heard testimonies from missionaries who have spoken with tribal people and shared gospel without knowing their language. I have only heard these though

[GoldenEagle]

On ‎11‎/‎14‎/‎2015 at 0:21 AM, SINNERSAVED said:

I have been a Christian a very long time over thirty years, but never heard anyone speak in tongues,

and many well known Christians say it is still current in todays world, and I know they say you need a interpreter ,if you do speak it.

but the question is ?, does  speaking in tongues really exist ,?or was it  a actual language that was spoke in long ago at Pentecost in native form for all the different people,to understand in there own,the word of God so they could tell there people  and share the gospel?

does anyone here at worthy speak in tongues,? where does it come from ,and what is its purpose,?

I don't know anything about it ,but what I read in the bible,  and yes, this is a legit question ?

I've not read the entire thread but... I'd say that the spiritual gifts (or Gifts of the Holy Spirit) can be found in the following passages. There may be others. Here's my take:

 

See Eph 4:11-13, Rom. 12:3-8, 1 Cor 12:7-11, 27:31

Gifts of the HS for leaders:  Eph. 4:11-13 – Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Shepherds, Teachers

 

Purpose of gifts associated with leaders: For building up (equipping) the Body of Christ (Vs 12)

 

Warning: Don’t think more highly of ourselves than we ought to think (Vs 3)

 

Spiritual Gifts (Rom. 12:3-8) – Prophecy, Service, Teaching, Exhortation, Generosity, Leadership, Mercy

 

Spiritual Gifts  (1 Cor 12:7-11) – Utterance of Wisdom, Utterance of Knowledge, Faith, Healing, Miracles, Discernment of spirits, Tongues, Interpretation of tongues.

 

Given by: The Holy Spirit as He wills (1 Cor. 12:11)

 

1 Cor 12:27-31 – Role 1^st Apostles, 2^nd Prophets, 3^rd Teachers, then the rest Miracles, gifts of healing, helping, administration, and tongues.

 

NOTE: Not everyone is a prophet or a teacher. Not everyone speaks in tongues. (vs 29 and 30)

 

So yes, I think this is a legitimate question.

God bless,
GE

[Flsnookman]

6 hours ago, ravindran said:

In Acts chapter 2

⁷ And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? ⁸ And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language? ⁹ Parthians and Medes andElamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, ¹⁰ Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, ¹¹ both Jews andproselytes, Cretans and Arabians—we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God

Some say it was a miracle of hearing! I believe people spoke in tongues (or other languages) which others were able to understand. Like an American speaking Greek. This was actually the first instance of speaking in tongues. Then we see Paul talking about tongues which others don't understand and it is direct communication with God. Rather than saying two types of tongues, I think we should say different operations of tongues. It is the same Holy Spirit enabling believers to speak in tongues. It is for different purposes and simply different operations. In corporate setting for edification of Church when there is interpretation, personal edification (during personal prayers) and as sign for unbelievers (when someone just speaks their native language without knowing it). I have heard testimonies from missionaries who have spoken with tribal people and shared gospel without knowing their language. I have only heard these though

What a great way to put it, thank you.

[Guest BacKaran]

The unbelieving Jews asked for signs from Jesus and his apostles to believe Jesus was the Messiah, and the apostles were mostly uneducated low society people. To hear then speak bodily like the Pharisees and Sadducees stunned then.

Speaking in tongues was for a time and no longer needed for today. 

Do people speak in tongues? Its called babble like at the tower of Babel. Is my Thai friend speaking in tongues as she translates what our pastor says in English? No, she knows both languages and she interprets. In Jesus day people spoke Aramaic, Greek and Latin. That's also a reason why the apostles have more than one name, one is in Greek and the other aramaic.

Ask a person who has left the church where babbeling was going on and they will tell you, it's all Babel.

Edited October 30, 2016 by BacKaran

[missmuffet]

3 minutes ago, BacKaran said:

The Jews asked for signs from Jesus and his apostles to believe Jesus was the Messiah, and the apostles were mostly uneducated low society people. To hear then speak bodily like the Pharisees and Sadducees stunned then.

Speaking in tongues was for a time and no longer needed for today. 

Do people speak in tongues? If calk it babble like at the tower of Babel. Is my Thai friend speaking in tongues as she translates what our pastor says in English? No, she knows both languages and she interprets. In Jesus day people spoke Aramaic, Greek and Latin. That's also a reason why the apostles have more than one name, one is in Greek and the other aramaic.

Ask a person who has left the church where babbeling was going on and they will tell you, it's all Babel.

Yes, I agree

[Leonardo Von]

On 11/15/2015 at 7:28 PM, Littlelambseativy said:

Speaking in tongues is for today, however to speak it publicly without anyone to interpret is useless. In acts when the a Holy Spirit fell upon those who were gathered, those who were watching heard words spoken in various languages and it was understood. 

UNDERSTANDING THE TRUE LESSON OF GIFT OF TONGUES FOR US

To facilitate the understanding, I will divide this article on various posts.

Today, the gift of tongues doesn’t satisfy the initial requirement. The proof of the acceptation of the gentiles is in everywhere (it’s enough the Jew wants to see). The most important is take in what Jesus want to teach us through this gift. This, yet, doesn’t meaning that Jesus can’t, off and on, to allow someone to speak in other idiom to evangelize a person of another nation.

Notwithstanding, we can learn very important spiritual lessons with 1Corithians 14. Let’s analyze verse to verse:

 

Ø  “Follow after charity, and desire spiritual [ gifts ], but rather that ye may prophesy.” (1Cor 14.1).

 

The love ought to be followed (1Cor 14.1) in order to all creatures can be reached for the gospel. After all, the love is a universal language, acknowledged for all (although, unfortunately, rejected for Ha-Satan and his followers, including humans).

To you to comprehend the importance of this, see these commandments:

 

Ø  “And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.” (Mark 16.15).

Ø  “Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD.” (Psalms 150.6).

 

Note that it isn’t to preach the gospel to all people, but every creature (including animals and plants). Many think that this is madness. After all, how does it communicate with plants and animals? Notwithstanding, they are more accessible to the gospel that many human beings:

 

Ø  “For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected [ the same ] in hope, because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.” (Romans 8.19-21).

 

Consider the expectation of all creatures (I wish that all human beings desired Jesus like that) and that there isn’t barrier big the enough to not be broken by love. Only the love is able to establish the bridge among the so many kinds of voices in the world (1Corinthians 14.10,11):

 

Ø  “There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them [ is ] without signification. Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh [ shall be ] a barbarian unto me.”

 

If we don’t understand the meaning of each voice, we won’t figure out the world, neither the role of every creature in it. The Eternal’s plan is that we have alliance with all things created:

 

Ø  “For thou shalt be in league with the stones of the field: and the beasts of the field shall be at peace with thee.” (Jó 5.23).

Ø  “And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and [ with ] the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.” (Hosea 2.18).

Ø  “Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours; whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours; and ye are Christ's; and Christ [ is ] God's.” (1Coríntios 3.21-23).

 

to be continued...

Edited November 7, 2016 by Leonardo Von

[Leonardo Von]

PART2

 

o   “For he that speaketh in an [ unknown ] tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth [ him ]; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.” (1Cor 14.2).

 

Note that to speak in tongues is a prayer (speak to God). In the reunions of the oholyao (group of persons that gather together to know Jesus in the life each other) was common the people to pray in public. The reason for no man understanding the prayer, however, isn’t because the language was other idiom.

By the way, here it’s fit to make the difference between:

 

•       Language = one idiom spoken for a group of persons.

•       Tongue = a dialect inside an idiom.

 

Also it is important to difference:

 

• ·         Nations = countries ruled for the Babylonian System;

• ·        Tongues = each country is divided in various tongues (dialect). By way of explanation, there is the tongue of the whores, of the traffickers, of the indigents, of the riches, of the lawyers, of the doctors, of the theologians, etc.

• ·         Peoples = groups of persons that believe in Jesus (Oholyao).

• ·        Tribes = each Oholyao is divided in tribes, that is, kindreds.

 

 

It’s possible somebody was speaking in the idiom of the hearer and they don’t figure out what was said. It’s enough that such person isn’t pay attention to the speaker or that this was speaking about a subject that the listener does not dominate.

In this case, in particular, the Holy Spirit is moving the person to pray conform His will:

 

o   “Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.” (Romans 8.26).

 

When the Holy Spirit join Himself to the spirit of the person to pray, this person pray things that, although was in a language of all the hearers, nobody get to understand, inasmuch as the wisdom of the Eternal is hidden in mystery:

 

o   “But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, [ even ] the hidden [ wisdom ], which God ordained before the world unto our glory: which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known [ it ], they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.” (1Corinthians 2.7,8).

 

The natural man can’t understand:

 

o   “But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [ them ], because they are spiritually discerned.” (1Corithians 2.14).

 

The only form of understanding is spiritually, when the Church is perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment (1Corinthians 1.10).

By way of explanation: The Church is the mystery of God (Colossians 1.26,27). Therefore, to speak mysteries is to speak what will permit the Church to fortify Its joints (see Ephesians 4.15,16).

 

TO BE CONTINUED...

Edited November 7, 2016 by Leonardo Von

[Leonardo Von]

PART 3

 

o   “But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men [ to ] edification, and exhortation, and comfort.” (1Cor 14.3).

o   “He that speaketh in an [ unknown ] tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.” (1Cor 14.4).

 

To be more exact: through of the gift of tongues, the Holy Spirit speaks the necessary so that the Church can be edified in the life of who pray. In the gift of the prophecy, the Holy Spirit use the person to edify the Church in the life one another:

 

o   “I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater [ is ] he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.” (1Cor 14.5).

 

Here it is fit clarify the difference between:

 

o   Translator = who translates of a language to another one;

o   Interpret = who explains the meaning of what is being said.

 

If one person is praying something that he doesn’t comprehend, still that he is being edified, his mind remains unfruitful:

 

o   “For if I pray in an [ unknown ] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.” (1Cor 14.14).

 

And the worst: all oholyao (group of persons that gather together to know Jesus in the life each other) wasn’t being edified. By the way, if my brother isn’t edified, how do I hope to be edified? After all, my brother is my priesthood. If he doesn’t discern well the God’s will for your life, how can I be used by Jesus for help him?

For this is said:

 

o   “Wherefore let him that speaketh in an [ unknown ] tongue pray that he may interpret.” (1Cor 14.13).

 

After all:

 

o   “Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?” (1Cor 14.6).

o   “And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped?” (1Cor 14.7).

o   “For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle? ” (1Cor 14.8).

o   “So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air.” (1Cor 14.7).

 

If we are speaking something that don’t add anything to the mind of the hearer, there isn’t a edification of the Church, but only of who speaks, and this merely in his spirit.

Hence the Sacred Scripture to say:

 

o   “What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.” (1Cor 14.15).

 

We ought to edify ourselves (praying and singing in spirit), but also to the Church (praying and singing with the mind in Christ – see 1Cor 2.15,16). The two things are important: we can’t edify ourselves and forget our brothers, but also can’t edify only the brothers and forget ourselves (this is hypocrisy).

The prayers and praises isn’t a vicarious duty done by other for us (1Cor 14.15,16). One person doesn’t bless other person without a contact with them. Without a direct actuation in their life, they will not be edified.

Hence to say:

 

o   “Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual [ gifts ], seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church.” (1Cor 14.12).

 

The gift ought to be seek with zeal, that is, that which will edify the Church (including us – 1Corinthias 12.31).

TO BE CONTINUED...

[Leonardo Von]

PART 4

 

o   “Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest? ” (1Cor 14.16).

o   “For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.” (1Cor 14.17).

 

Note also that the pray in tongues magnify God giving to Him thanks.

Hereby we can learn that the custom adopted for the Catholicism was wrong, to wit, to celebrate the Mass in Latin.

By way of explanation: the prayer has to be conscious. Prayer did of mechanical mode (like mere repetition of words), or without understanding internally what is being prayed, is of no value.

Remember:

 

o   “Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 18.19).

 

Observe that only the prayer with full agreement of the neighbor will have value. No prayer done isolated, without the concordance of the Church (still that such concordance give itself in spirit moved by Holy Spirit) will be answered by Father:

 

o   “I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:” (1Cor 14.18).

 

Notwithstanding, this doesn’t mean that the gift of tongues ought to be undervalued. So what so that Paul shows that he spoke with tongues more that all the Corinthians. Not to mention that, in the end of this chapter, he says:

 

o   “Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.” (1Cor 14.39).

 

Nevertheless, in the oholyao (group of persons that gather together to know Jesus in the life each other), Paul preferred to talk only what could edify the others.

 

o   “Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that [ by my voice ] I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an [ unknown ] tongue.” (1Cor 14.19).

 

Hereby we can learn that the motive to the brothers join themselves in name of Jesus isn’t to search self-edification, but for us love one another (see how many times the expression “one another” appear in the Sacred Scripture – John 13.34, 15.12,17; Romans 12.10; 13.8; 15.7,14; 16.16,20; 2Corithians 13.12; Galatians 5.13; 6.2; Ephesians 4.2,32; Colossians 3.13,16; 1Thessalonians 4.9.18     ; 5.11; Hebrews 3.13; 10.24,25; 1Peter 1.22; 5.14; 1John 3.11,23; 4.7,11,12; 2John 1.5).

Therefore, this model of the “church” that is spread out there, where a small clerical leads the cult and all the other members stay each one in his place seeking Jesus only for oneself is condemned. By the way, to exist for oneself means to make of oneself a curse, to exile oneself in hell.

Treat itself of a cult where the tongue of each is strange to the other. Each one speaks his own language (nobody figure out the problem and needs of other, much less their thoughts and feels).

Although such cult can bring some learning (this, when it brings, because many times only it is ministered vain things or even heresies), there is no real edification, i.e., nobody is leaded to be part of the life of others.

 

o   “Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men.” (1Cor 14.20).

 

Note that we have to grow in the understanding and, considering that our mind is limited, we’ll only get to reach the height designed by God allowing Christ to be our mind (1Corinthians 2.15,16) through each one that He brings to us to be part of our building (see 1Corinthians 3.9).

 

 

TO BE CONTINUED...

[Leonardo Von]

PART 5

 

o   “In the law it is written, With [ men of ] other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying [ serveth ] not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in [ those that are ] unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?” (1Cor 14.21-23).

 

Note that the prayer in tongues is to minister to unlearned or unbelievers, that is, to who doesn’t get to believe in the perfect unity of the Church, much less understand it. Therefore, if when enter some unlearned or unbeliever in the oholyao and all start to pray (whether moved by Holy Spirit or based on their understanding), they go to think: “but that unity madder! They don’t respect nor valorize one another. Nobody wants to understand anybody.”.

Many allege that Jesus understands what each one is speaking. Well, if the prayer of each one is to be figure out only by God, then each one can remain in house praying (as also ordains Matthew 6.6). Once more time the model of “church” that exists doesn’t follow the model of the Sacred Scripture.

Besides, how the wisdom of the Eternal is madness to the natural men (1Cor 2.14), if we speak in spiritual language (to speak in the spiritual things), they go to think that we are mad. They need to see the word acting in their lives.

 

o   “But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or [ one ] unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:” (1Cor 14.24).

o   “And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on [ his ] face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth.” (1Cor 14.25).

 

If all prophesy, namely, if the utterance of each one is directed by Jesus (that is, if there aren’t vain words – see Isaiah 58.13,14; Matthew 12.36,37; Ephesians 4.29), and someone unlearned or unbeliever come in will be convinced of all about what Jesus had done in their life, but that until then they are refusing themselves to see.

They will be judged of all for they were persisting in saying something like: “Have we not taken to us horns by our own strength?” (Amos 6.13). Instead of they give glory to God, they were glorifying themselves.

Yet, seeing persons that nothing knew about their lives, revealing all the works of God kept in secret in their hearts, they won’t get to refuse to glorify God. This will serve of testimony to the learned and believers that God is in midst of them.

 

o   “How is it then, brethren? When ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.” (1Cor 14.26).

 

For the third time we see the “today’s churches” contradicting the Sacred Scripture. Beyond the reunions of the oholyao be done in the houses (Acts 2.46; Romans 16.5), each one manifested the gift that Jesus conceived them. It wasn’t as the cults of today, where the pastor monopolizes all and the people remain only watching (as if it was a show).

 

o   “If any man speak in an [ unknown ] tongue, [ let it be ] by two, or at the most [ by ] three, and [ that ] by course; and let one interpret.” (1Cor 14.27).

o   “But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.” (1Cor 14.28).

 

See how the gift of tongues should be ministered: by two or three persons only, by course and only when there was someone to interpret. I ask you: do you see any of the three rules being followed in the “churches”?

If the Holy Spirit wish to use the person to pray to the Eternal something that nobody could figure out, such person should pray to God in thought.

TO BE CONTINUED