What is applicable to us today , that was not in the past ?

[JohnD]

On 12/18/2015 at 0:02 PM, SINNERSAVED said:

we are of the new testament ,today , trying to follow the teachings of Jesus , and follow the spirit that leads us,

but I see that there are Gods standards and talking to the people in the past,  and today we say it does not apply ?

if we do not take in as  a reminder or a example of what happened in the past , how do we become the believers of today  ?, of the same bible and word of God? what is not applied today , that was applied to the believer yesterday,

we see that yesterday the believers all believed in God and Jesus and refuse to bow to the evil and santanic pagan Gods  and were tortured and killed for following the way of the holy God,

so how is it that we today can even say we don't have tribulation its for the tribulation saints, that this in it self separates us , as different believers  of the same God?

if we are all reading one bible and following the principles of  God the father and the finished work of Christ Jesus , ,

then hw do we pick and choose what we are going to follow and what we are not going to follow, is this even correct,

to choose of what we accept in the bible and what we don't, if it be all inspired and is the true word of God,?

I get so confused in how a covenant of moses or grace replaces the next covenant , and we are okay to believe that,    as what God is saying ?

I really believe there is a dis-connect of the truth , so please comment and respond , with helpful advise and positive comments ,

thank you in advance for helping me, and to provoke me ,in learning Gods truth  to study harder,  and be filled , thank you blessings 

Galatians 3:24–25 (AV)

24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

[JohnD]

The Law of Moses was given

• to establish what is good and what is evil
• to distinguishes between the two
• to set forth the minimum requirements for salvation (none of which man can achieve on his own).

This was to steer man to the cross of Christ.

The Law still stands and is as active as ever for unbelievers in Jesus. 

His sacrifice on the cross once for all ended the Levitical sacrificial system of temporary atonement (which was itself prophetic of Jesus' sacrifice on the cross).

[JohnD]

Bear in mind that our bodies still possess a fallen sin nature (Romans 7:14 - Romans 8:39).

Where sin abounds grace all the more abounds (Romans 5:20). 

The Holy Spirit in us is working on us. If we choose to allow him... if we do not and persist in giving in to our sin nature...

1 Corinthians 5:5 (AV)

5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

God is not stupid... and he is active in our lives. And if need be, he will take us out!

If we in our spirit do not have such a love for God in Christ that we are sorry when we sin (realizing what it cost him) then perhaps we had better do a serious reality check on our faith and what it is we actually believe. Because if we are only interested in eternal fire insurance and Jesus is just an exit strategy from this life to us, then this is a most scary passage:

Matthew 7:21–23 (AV)

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 

[JohnD]

The gist of what I am getting at is the Lord in the new covenant is not placing the emphasis on keeping the Law like he was in the old covenant. The emphasis is on getting saved and then getting others saved.

Otherwise it would make no sense to keep us down here once we come to faith in Jesus. think of the grief he'd spare himself if we raptured out at the moment we believed.

No, the emphasis is on getting others saved.

And dealing with sin etc he provided for this:

1 John 1:5–2:15 (AV)

5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.

9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.

10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name’s sake.

13 I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.

15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

 

[JohnD]

1 Corinthians 6:12–13 (AV)

12 All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.

13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.

1 Corinthians 10:21–24 (AV)

21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord’s table, and of the table of devils.

22 Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? are we stronger than he?

23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.

24 Let no man seek his own, but every man another’s wealth.

[JohnD]

Just be careful realizing our bodies try to interpret such things as a license to sin and it is not!

Walter Martin used to say "If you want to sin, try it! And you will learn empirically what God can do with his property."

1 Corinthians 6:19–20 (AV)

19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s.

 

 

[SINNERSAVED]

13 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Just be careful realizing our bodies try to interpret such things as a license to sin and it is not!

Walter Martin used to say "If you want to sin, try it! And you will learn empirically what God can do with his property."

1 Corinthians 6:19–20 (AV)

19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s.

 

 

thank you for that advise, appreciate your response

[SINNERSAVED]

3 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi SINNERSAVED,

This is what you said -

 

Can you see that it seems you are saying when we have faith in Christ then we are no longer honouring.... As if Christ`s work on the cross is not sufficient, not God honouring. 

Remember there were many, many people in the OT who had faith in God & obeyed Him. God`s laws were in their conscience. (Heb. 11 people) However the children of Israel were generally disobedient children & thus God had to deal with them, as children & write the laws out for them to see. Just like we write out work simply for children. Even when Jesus came He continually directed them to their hearts. That is where we obey. Anyone can look like they are being `good` doing this & that, but it is the heart motive that God desires because that is reality for us & God.

So if you want to honour what God has said in the past then obey Christ from your heart by listening to His Holy Spirit & you will fulfil everything that God desires for you to really live & be clean, inside & out.

Marilyn. 

thank you for that Marilyn C,

I am trying ,to make sure that with the knowledge learned of Christ and grace ,and His finished work on the cross,

 that we are not leaving anything from the old, that is to be carried into the present with us, I am not trying to dig up the past or live from the law of moses , but to make suure that I am being obedient to the calling in full , and not leaving anything out,

for there is so much that I have seen that is false teachings ,and preaching of false doctrines, that even some of the past items in some cases are not to be overlooked, and all pushed aside, so I am very careful ,

and will try all the evidence, and scripture I can ,so I am not carried away with the infiltration of what satan has already done with, in the churches and teachings that we are hearing today. so I continue to study to keep my self in the grace of God , and to know I am inline with Gods will.

for the interpretations that I have heard , some of them I know in my heart and soul are not the correct way, or meaning of what the scripture is really  saying

[gdemoss]

The law of sin and death is alive and active but only the outward man is under it.  The inward man, the born again part is not.

The power of sin is the law.  If you give law then you give sin power.  And that, power to kill.

Shall we lie, cheat and steal because the law was nailed to the cross being taken out of the way?  No!  We should understand that our love needs to be for God first followed by love of our neighbor.  Is it loving to lie, steal or cheat?  If it wver becomes the loving thing to do then by all means lie away.  Let me know how that works out for you.  

Since we are under grace and not law has judgement then past for us as Christians?  No!  Judgement is now worse on us than before for we know better.  See Ananias and Saphira.  As it is written, God will judge his people and to ones own master they stand or fall.

So where is the advantage of grace then?  Why not desire the law if we are judged anyway?  Much more advantageous to be under grace than law!  How so?  Well, we can give people law all day and all we give them is death by the power of sin.  Yet when we give grace as we were also given then we give life and by it receive an abundance of grace for that which a man sews he shall reap!  Therefore it is advantageous to give more grace than death by sin through law.  God is judge under grace or law no matter.

For this cause we ought give to all who ask of us, walk two miles with the one who demands one, turn the other cheek, love our enemies, do not put away evil wives or husbands, salute all and work dilligently to be at peace with everyone that you may be found in peace when God visits his people.

I absolutely LOVE the law of God!  I hate stealing, lying, covetousness and every other abominable act under the sun but I love grace as it saved me when the law said I should die.  Peace.  Love one another.  Give grace not law!

[SINNERSAVED]

12 hours ago, gdemoss said:

The law of sin and death is alive and active but only the outward man is under it.  The inward man, the born again part is not.

The power of sin is the law.  If you give law then you give sin power.  And that, power to kill.

Shall we lie, cheat and steal because the law was nailed to the cross being taken out of the way?  No!  We should understand that our love needs to be for God first followed by love of our neighbor.  Is it loving to lie, steal or cheat?  If it wver becomes the loving thing to do then by all means lie away.  Let me know how that works out for you.  

Since we are under grace and not law has judgement then past for us as Christians?  No!  Judgement is now worse on us than before for we know better.  See Ananias and Saphira.  As it is written, God will judge his people and to ones own master they stand or fall.

So where is the advantage of grace then?  Why not desire the law if we are judged anyway?  Much more advantageous to be under grace than law!  How so?  Well, we can give people law all day and all we give them is death by the power of sin.  Yet when we give grace as we were also given then we give life and by it receive an abundance of grace for that which a man sews he shall reap!  Therefore it is advantageous to give more grace than death by sin through law.  God is judge under grace or law no matter.

For this cause we ought give to all who ask of us, walk two miles with the one who demands one, turn the other cheek, love our enemies, do not put away evil wives or husbands, salute all and work dilligently to be at peace with everyone that you may be found in peace when God visits his people.

I absolutely LOVE the law of God!  I hate stealing, lying, covetousness and every other abominable act under the sun but I love grace as it saved me when the law said I should die.  Peace.  Love one another.  Give grace not law!

that was very good , thank you for your reply brother.