Mexico: Evangelicals Expelled, Domiciles Destroyed

[thereselittleflower]

50 minutes ago, Cletus said:

Soooo.... no one can provide a scripture with salvation and relating with others? 

I wonder why that is..... 

Also I would like to point out that living as the ekklesia as one, with hearts knit together, is NOT how one gets saved. 

no.  I will be in heaven with other people who opened the door of their own individual heart to God during some point in their life.  other people being there or not is a moot point unless you can provide scripture that says salvation and relating with others is one in the same.  Since you have not been able to thus far I would say you, as well as others, are choosing to believe a teaching thats not biblical.

The whole reason I asked the question in an earlier post for a scripture reference was to allow people to see for themselves its not in the bible.  Kinda reminds me of that old saying about leading a horse to water.

Show me where there is a verse or passage that explicitly states God is 3 persons, one being, co-equal, co-eternal, co-eternally pre-existing. Can you show me the scripture that says the Holy Spirit is co-eternal with God (the Father)?  Can you show me the scripture that says the Holy Spirit is co-equal with God (the Father)?

The Trinity is a logical conclusion from various scriptures added together.  

Unless you deny the validity of the Trinity doctrine, then you are holding one standard to the Trinity and another standard to other beliefs.

When one applies one standard to one belief yet denies it to another, this is where the error is.

As I said before,  we are saved together as the Body of Christ.  Is a finger going to be saved by itself?  No, but as part of the body it belongs to - the Body of Christ.  Paul goes into the dependency of the various parts of the Body of Christ on each other.

The scriptures nowhere state we are saved as separate bodies, but tell us we are one Body;  we are not stones that stand alone, but fitted jointly, compactly, tightly together making up the Temple of God.   

Are these scriptures you need me to look up?

 

[SavedOnebyGrace]

18 hours ago, simplejeff said:

...Someone, perhaps,'might' be saved and still 'believe' some of those doctrines if they haven't had time to be purified by Jesus and HIS WORD - they don't have to have a perfect mental /scholastic/ religious understanding to meet, seek, and follow JESUS if the FATHER in heaven draws them to HIMSELF. ((HE will cleanse them from all unrighteousness and all sin IF they are HIS))

Historically, S.O.b.G, what you experienced first hand was most common - until recently.  But now, ecumenism is the new "wolf" devouring churches from the inside out, destroying souls;  so some rcc participants might claim that you can be saved outside "the  rcc church"  in the errant spirit of this new "wolf".

But the tenants of the main world church((recognizing the pope being first)), and the wider ecumenical rules, remain directly contrary to Christ Jesus and remain directly opposed to Scripture.

I'm asking you simplejeff, why are you directing this comment at me?

[SavedOnebyGrace]

2 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

I expect it was because of a previous post, or posts , by you.

Specifically you, I think, because you posted the truth.

I'll look back shortly, (now), Yahweh willing, and edit in here if needed....

Shalom to all who love the Truth in Yahshua , experientially with their whole heart and mind and soul and body.

jeff

Thank you Jeff.  We should all strive, at least us Christians, to speak the truth at all times and defend the truth when it is put into question.  Attacks on God's word comes from many sides.  We have to be prepared with the full armor of God.  [Ephesians 6:10-18, NIV]

[thereselittleflower]

9 hours ago, Cletus said:

the bible clearly states the trinity is legit.  it is not a logical conclusion drawn by compiling scriptures, while that may help better understand, the bible clearly says this:

1Jn_5:7  For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jn_5:8  And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

You have asked for scripture and I provided it.  I do not need you to look it up for me.  You are referring to the second chapter of Ephesians.  In this passage it does not say that we become saved by relating to others.  In fact, if we study the whole book of Ephesians We can see more in depth on relating to others in all relationships with people thru our everyday life.  its instructions for us on the disciplines of unity 4:1-16...  Purity and forgivness being found in the fourth chapter, and walking in the fullness of the Holy Spirit in the 5th.  to read more about these relations with people you can read in the latter parth of the 5th and in the 6th chapter of Ephesians.  However nowhere in the entirety of the epistle does it link  salvation, as in the act, the moment, or what must occur to be saved to relating with others.  nowhere.  One must receive salvation before his or her function in the body becomes known.  unless of course God gives a word on it to one already functioning in the body.  Which has happened.

I do agree with we are the body, and I do  believe as the the body, His Church, that we are the fullness of the expression of Himself here on earth today not only to other believers but to the world. 

edit:  The relating to others part is because we are saved, and have His spirit.

Of course the scriptures show that the Trinity is the legitimate understanding of God.

But that's not the point of my post.   My post did not call into question the Trinity, but how you claim we come to believe in the Trinity from the scriptures.

 

Please show me where it says the Holy Spirit is co-equal with God (the Father).

Please show me where it says the Holy Spirit is co-eternally pre-existing with God (the Father).

So lets look at the scriptures you provided:

• 1Jn_5:7  For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
• 1Jn_5:8  And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

 

verse 7 says they are one.  But where does it say HOW they are one?    Others use this verse to say they are one in purpose but deny that it means one in being, in essence.

Where does it say they are one in essence, in being?

 

verse 9  says they agree in one.   Others would say this is simply agreement, but does not mean one in being, in essence.

Where does it say they are one in essence, in being?

 

The Trinity is a theological determination from all the evidence in scripture; a logical extension of what scripture does say.   But nowhere is the full teaching of the Trinity EXPLICITLY stated.

So it's important to understand how christianity came to understand God is a Trinity, through logical deduction and reasoning from scripture, and not deny this same process to other beliefs.

 

 

 

[SavedOnebyGrace]

23 hours ago, simplejeff said:

...Someone, perhaps,'might' be saved and still 'believe' some of those doctrines if they haven't had time to be purified by Jesus and HIS WORD - they don't have to have a perfect mental /scholastic/ religious understanding to meet, seek, and follow JESUS if the FATHER in heaven draws them to HIMSELF. ((HE will cleanse them from all unrighteousness and all sin IF they are HIS))

Historically, S.O.b.G, what you experienced first hand was most common - until recently.  But now, ecumenism is the new "wolf" devouring churches from the inside out, destroying souls;  so some rcc participants might claim that you can be saved outside "the  rcc church"  in the errant spirit of this new "wolf".

But the tenants of the main world church((recognizing the pope being first)), and the wider ecumenical rules, remain directly contrary to Christ Jesus and remain directly opposed to Scripture.

Jeff, the thing is, the Roman Catholic Church is in a state of denial.  They refuse to acknowledge they have been teaching error throughout their history.  They have their willing accomplices in society pushing their latest agenda.  Unless the brainwashed masses see the truth, God will have to decide their idolatrous practices can be overlooked or not.

[thereselittleflower]

1 hour ago, Cletus said:

The Trinity and The Holy Ghost being equal with The Father has absolutely nothing to do with the scripture reference I requested, which you still, days later, have yet to provide. 

Please stop changing the subject and provide scripture to validate your statement. 

If The Book says it I believe it.  I cannot find it anywhere in scripture.  Can you?

 

I have given you scripture to support what I have said.  The question is, why hasn't this been acknowledged?

If one believes the Holy Ghost is God, co-equal to the Father and the Son, co eternally pre-existing with the Father and the Son, yet there are no scriptures that state explicitly state this, then it is hypocritical to require a verse or verses that explicitly state what I've said and so it has everything to do with the scripture reference you requested.

Since I have already referred to scripture, but the scripture I've referred to is being rejected as not having supplied you with the scripture reference you requested, there is nothing else I can logically conclude than that you are holding what I've said to a different and higher standard of proof than what you hold the Holy Spirit being Co-equal and co-eternally pre-existing with the Father and the Son - a central belief of Christianity.  

How can what is held to be a central belief of Christianity be held to a lower standard of proof than something more to the periphery?   Yet, given our conversation thus far, I am left with no other conclusion than this is what is happening here.

 

[Guest Thallasa]

On ‎21‎/‎01‎/‎2016 at 6:22 PM, ayin jade said:

I disagree. The us does a great deal to aid justice and fairness. And the bible speaks of individual salvation, that whether or not one is saved is dependent on where the individual stands with Jesus.

I thought that Jesus said the two most important commandments are 1) to love your God with all your heart ,and 2) and  love your neighbour as yourself . This idea ,that you can hate your neighbour while loving  God, is  therefore false .

That does not mean we have to be close with them especially if they would lead us into sin ,but we are responsible for helping them and not 'hating' on  them .

[simplejeff]

.....How does this relate to the op ?  Who taught the mexicans in error ?  What are they teaching TODAY ?  When they are being taught about JESUS of the BIBLE,  why are the teachers being attacked and/or expelled ? 

On January 24, 2016 at 0:00 AM, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

Jeff, the thing is, the Roman Catholic Church is in a state of denial.  They refuse to acknowledge they have been teaching error throughout their history.  They have their willing accomplices in society pushing their latest agenda.  Unless the brainwashed masses see the truth, God will have to decide their idolatrous practices can be overlooked or not.

 

[thereselittleflower]

12 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

.....How does this relate to the op ?  Who taught the mexicans in error ?  What are they teaching TODAY ?  When they are being taught about JESUS of the BIBLE,  why are the teachers being attacked and/or expelled ? 

 

The Incas taught the Mexicans their error.

 

 

[ayin jade]

17 minutes ago, thereselittleflower said:

The Incas taught the Mexicans their error.

 

 

The incas are from peru. Not from mexico. Aztecs, mayans, olmecs. Those are indigenous to mexico. I think only the mayan survive today.