Ezra Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.34 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2016 Spiderman 1917, Those are all valid questions (your words in red). Others have responded, and I will respond according to what I have learned: So, obviously to some he has given the ability to understand His Word, but I'm pretty sure that the majority of misinterpretations of God's Word are not the fault of the person who is teaching and reading His Word , but because of a lack of grace given to them to understand it. God does equip some Christians to be evangelists, pastors, and teachers (Eph 4:11,12). But He has also given every believer the gift of the Holy Spirit, and all can be taught the truth if all are willing to learn according to God’s requirements (1 Jn 2:20,27). For instance, there is a scripture verse where Paul says "all things have become lawful for me". Context is key. “But all things are not expedient” is also there. Another verse that says " all shall be saved." Or "ask anything of the father in my name and it will be done for you". Or when called " good teacher" Jesus said "why do you call me good, the only one who is good is God"... and many more that people are confused by. Again, if we take the context into account, these statements become clear (provided we already have a good understanding of the fundamental doctrines. For example “there is none good but God” tells us that the man addressed must make a determination – either Christ is God, or He is not good. Many do not wish to accept the fact that Jesus is God, and this verse is a challenge to them. The thing is , what one scripture verse says at one point in scripture , a person can find another scripture that says the opposite. Not really. There are no contradictions in Scripture. On the other hand, everything is not simply sitting on the surface, and nothing can really be understood unless the Holy Spirit is within. There are many theologians who dedicated themselves and their lives to prayer, fasting, and seeking the truth, and were led to opposite views , while sincerely believing the Holy Spirit led them to those views, and having scriptural basis for why they declare it to be so. Correct. But there can only be one truth, so somewhere along the line we must go back to Scripture and see whose interpretation is correct. For example, there are many Christians who sincerely believe that God elects some to salvation and others to damnation. They believe they have the Scriptures to prove it. But when they are presented with other Scriptures that reveal that all men may be saved if all will repent and believe, they refuse to acknowledge that that is really the case. God could annoint all seekers with understanding to bring unity, which would bring more souls to salvation and glorify him so much more, and make Christianity so much more powerful and credible force on earth. Ideally this would be the perfect scenario. Unfortunately there are two factors which God allows to operate on earth: (1) Satan and his evil spirits attempting to deceive Christians and (2) “the flesh” (the old sinful human nature”) which resists the things of the Spirit. Only God knows why He has not eradicated these opposing forces, but they exist and prevent perfect unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. Why has he chosen not to give this grace that is so easy and free for him to grant, which would have nothing but positive results? It is not God who is withholding the grace, but it is men who are resisting the truth when it is presented. For example, the Bible clearly reveals that God is actually the triune Godhead (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Yet you have people right here on Worthy resisting this truth and refusing to believe that Jesus is God and the Holy Spirit is also God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eha Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 194 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 230 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/16/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/08/1973 Share Posted March 4, 2016 just few weeks ago Father told me to find out definition of truth. 1.the true or actual state of a matter 2.conformity with fact or reality; verity 3.a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like truth is something, that have proofs, facts. start from that ground. If Father wants us not just believe, BUT BELIEVE TRUTH (we can believe.. lie, illusion what ever) then that means - we must believe proofs, facts... strong delusion will be sent to those, that dont love truth. or other words, that dont seek proofs, facts. Jesus told what are those facts and proofs. He told - those signs will follow.. sign - 1. a token; indication. 2. any object, action, event, pattern, etc., that conveys a meaning. 3. a conventional or arbitrary mark, figure, or symbol used as anabbreviation for the word or words it represents. something you can see or touch or.. something physical... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,253 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 16,670 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2016 I am convinced that God gives us truth we need to know at the time for our personal growth.. So Luther needed to know that salvation is by grace through faith, that the just shall live by his faith. He needed to be freed from the bondage of salvation by works, especially works that were dictated by his catholic church at the time that were not scriptural, such as the sale of indulgences. Calvin needed to know about the soverignty of God. One truth does not cancel the other. God knows how both are true. Sometimes we don't understand how that works, but we trust our all wise God to know. When Jesus said only God is good, He was trying to help the man conclude that He is God with Us Immanuel,, and The Word made flesh. You quoted "all shall be saved" out of context. We understand that it is God's perfect will that all be saved, but the truth is that the Jews and many of us are not saved because we stubbornly resist God's calling and grace. Acts 7:51 "You stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears! You ALWAYS RESIST THE HOLY SPIRIT; Sometimes theologians use their own logic to try to understand how seemingly conflicting scriptures are true instead of just accepting that both are true. Both Luther and Calvin have done this to some extent. Luther wanted to toss out the book of James because it says that without works our faith is dead. Calvin explains away or says "that is not what it means" when verses contradict his theology. But the truth is that by walking in faith following the Holy Spirit we will do good works. We are saved by grace through the gift of faith, Period. But the kind of faith God gives us will produce works. And it is true that God is completely soverign and in contruol. But He has allowed men to resist Him and refuse His salvation. That is God's Word. By accepting all of God's Word and not tossing out the parts that say the opposite, we start to have a better understanding of the Truth. God may have first chosen us, but He wants a people who also desire Him., who receive His Son, and to these He gives the authority to be born of the Holy Spirit and to be adopted as His sons. God wanted me to know His love because I was filled with bitterness and unforgiveness, so Corinthians 13 was the first thing I saw. The next thing I saw is that no one can be good enough to go to heaven. Then I learned about salvation by faith and started to be freed from the bondage of works as Luther had been. But the last thing I needed to learn was how to live by faith and follow after the Spirit. So God opened Scripture to me according to my greatest needs as I surrendered more and more of my life to Him. So the key to understanding Scripture by the light of His Spirit is to accept that all of God's Word is true. But meanwhile we need to put into practice what we already know, and then God will shed more light that we my grow to look more like Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,253 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 16,670 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2016 Ps. All things are lawful to me is also out of context. The rest is but not all things are expedient or helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.--Now the body in not for sexual immorality but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body. 19 Or do you not know the your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit Who is in you, Who is from God, and you are not your own? For you have been bought with a price; therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suray2 Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 86 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 99 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/25/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2016 Isaiah 55:8-9King James Version (KJV) 8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. God knows the best way to handle things. Many times we, yes even Christians really think we know the right way something should be done, but God in his ultimate wisdom says no, that way won't accomplish anything, but do it my way....it's the only true way. I wonder, if God had just laid all his truths out, easy to understand...would we have the need to do daily searching, asking Him to help us understand, growing closer to Him daily as we pray for his truth....and then feeling His awesome spirit each time He shows us what He wants us to know. This builds our relationship with Jesus Christ...oh what a wonderful walk with Him! I do believe our past experiences and preconceived notions often do get in the way though of our understanding of what He is showing us....but God is patient and knows our life...and will lead us to truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eha Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 194 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 230 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/16/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/08/1973 Share Posted March 4, 2016 (edited) will lead us to truth after we start seek truth truth = proofs, witnesses, facts Holy Spirit baptism - gift is received healing - happens time to time, have documents and witnesses. prophecy - was given and yes, i have that gift through Holy Spirit baptism (and some more) He lead us through TALKING - have witnesses, several those are facts, that none wont take away from me those are facts, that prove to me - HE IS and Bible is true and many more i dont believe, i want believe truth, that is possible to prove, that have witnesses and facts - He did give them to me. i stand on Rock. on truth. on Word. always love - dont tell me, show me. Edited March 4, 2016 by Eha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Deidre* Posted March 4, 2016 Group: Senior Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 521 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 608 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/03/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2016 Through the Holy Spirit, we are enlightened and given wisdom and understanding. I believe this, anyway. And faith is also an experience, it is in your everyday life, in how you interact with others...in how you commune with others...in how you view yourself...in how we read the Word. But, it isn't only limited to how we read the Word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted March 5, 2016 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.37 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 5, 2016 ..... On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: So, obviously to some he has given the ability to understand His Word,. ... ability, capacity, sheer grace, yes ... On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: God could annoint all seekers with understanding to bring unity ,..... .... Did you read ACTS ? Yahweh did this already. On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: which would bring more souls to salvation and glorify him so much more, Yes. Amen. more souls were saved and He received Glory to Himself. On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: and make Christianity so much more powerful ... What is more powerful than raising the dead ? Forgiving sins ? Healing the sick ? Casting out demons ? Loving the unloved untouchables and outcasts of society ? On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: and credible force on earth. "credible force" ? Has Yahweh ever lost HIS credibility ? His Sovereingty ? His PERFECTNESS ? On March 4, 2016 at 8:48 PM, spiderman1917 said: Why has he chosen not to give this grace that is so easy and free for him to grant, which would have nothing but positive results? WHOA ! When did HE chose NOT to give this grace !?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted March 5, 2016 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.37 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 5, 2016 On March 4, 2016 at 6:37 AM, spiderman1917 said: However, as I said there are people who have dedicated their entire life to the study of Scripture and prayers from the Holy Spirit for guidance, and that they may use that understanding not only to help themselves but to guide others to truth. So many of these people who have spent the greatest portion of their time, energy, and life into the pursuit of God and truth are led to opposite beliefs that they are convinced are true, and go to their grave believing so. If they prayed to the Holy Spirit for guidance and through the study of Scripture and much prayer, that was what they discern the Holy Spirit was telling them, then they are not at fault. They trusted that the Holy Spirit descended upon them as God promised and that he was guiding them as God promised. They prayed for understanding, enlightenment, and the guidance of the Holy Spirit, and so God choosing not to give them those graces is in the end what is the biggest factor into why they fell into heresy and mislead others. No. The one factor is "they were not willing" . That's all. Yahweh NEVER tells His children DIFFERENT ((opposing, contradictory)) TRUTH. Yahshua the GOOD SHEPHERD never leads His sheep astray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts