The Sabbath and Sunday Worship.

[Spock]

Angel4u,

Thanks for the gotquestions article. 

May I ask you this- I'm sure you keep (don't disobey) the other 9 commandments except the 4th.  Why do you think the 4th is the only one no longer applicable, when 9 of them are still applicable? 

Thanks,

spock

[Wayne222]

36 minutes ago, Spock said:

Very involved answer, don't really feel like going into it. It's personal. But I will say this- not many Saturday worship churches out there except SDA and Messianic. 

Off shoots of the world wide church of God do. There the Philadelphia church of god then the living church of god then the United Church of god. And many more. Then the church of god seventh day which was before the world wide church. There is even the Baptist seventh day church from the 1600 In Road  island by Stephen Muford.But before this no christian church kept the Sabbath on Saturday. In the book of acts they told the gentile christian they did not need to keep the law.But gave them four commands to keep that if they did this they would be doing well. Anyway take care my friend.

[Spock]

Even if Justin Martyr was the first, who is he?  He wasn't one of the 12. So what makes me want to put so much weight behind him?  (More than God who wrote the 10 commandments, and every Christian I know follows 9, but feel the 4th isn't necessary.)

i found this little snipit: 

Saint Justin, also known as Justin Martyr (Greek: Ιουστίνος ο Μάρτυρας, Latin: Iustinus Martyr) was an early Christian apologist, and is regarded as the foremost interpreter of the theory of the Logos in the 2nd century.[2] He was martyred, alongside some of his students, and is considered a saint by the Roman Catholic Church,[3] the Anglican Church,[4] the Eastern Orthodox Church,.[5] and the Oriental Orthodox Churches.

Most of his works are lost, but two apologies and a dialogue did survive. The First Apology, his most well known text, passionately defends the morality of the Christian life, and provides various ethical and philosophicalarguments to convince the Roman emperor, Antoninus, to abandon the persecution of the fledgling sect. Further, he also indicates, as St Augustine did regarding the "true religion" that predated Christianity,[6] that the "seeds of Christianity" (manifestations of the Logos acting in history) actually predated Christ's incarnation. This notion allows him to claim many historical Greek philosophers (including Socrates and Plato), in whose works he was well studied, as unknowing Christians.

spock: hmmmmm, not exactly flawless.....

Edited April 9, 2017 by Spock
Spelling

[Spock]

4 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

Off shoots of the world wide church of God do. There the Philadelphia church of god then the living church of god then the United Church of god. And many more. Then the church of god seventh day which was before the world wide church. There is even the Baptist seventh day church from the 1600 In Road  island by Stephen Muford.But before this no christian church kept the Sabbath on Saturday. In the book of acts they told the gentile christian they did not need to keep the law.But gave them four commands to keep that if they did this they would be doing well. Anyway take care my friend.

This may sound arrogant, but every religion is just that, a religion. I prefer home fellowship, so let's leave it at that. I don't want this to be about me and my personal decisions. 

[Wayne222]

Just now, Spock said:

This may sound arrogant, but every religion is just that, a religion. I prefer home fellowship, so let's leave it at that. I don't want this to be about me and my personal decisions. 

I don't think it's arrogant at all. I hope you have good fellowship there with like minded people. Just stay close to the lord.

[Spock]

2 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

I don't think it's arrogant at all. I hope you have good fellowship there with like minded people. Just stay close to the lord.

Thanks Wayne.  Good words.....that's pretty important, staying close.....

Dont leave home without him! 

Edited April 9, 2017 by Spock

[Spock]

13 minutes ago, Giller said:

Here is one of Ignatius.

Ignatius

Ignatius of Antioch (Born c.35 , Died possibly 110)

 

(http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/ignatius-magnesians-longer.html)

 (Ignatius

But let every one of you keep the Sabbath after a spiritual manner, rejoicing in meditation on the law, not in relaxation of the body, admiring the workmanship of God, and not eating things prepared the day before, nor using lukewarm drinks, and walking within a prescribed space, nor finding delight in dancing and plaudits which have no sense in them. And after the observance of the Sabbath, let every friend of Christ keep the Lord's Day as a festival, the resurrection-day, the queen and chief of all the days)

Well, I now know Justin Martyr and Ignatius better, but, please don't take this wrong- I follow the Lord, listen to Paul, John, isiah and all the boys who wrote the Bible, and of course JESUS FIRST AND FOREMOST. He never told me to do away with the 4th C. So for me, I'm not. If you want to, you won't hurt my feelings and I'm not trying to bully you to stop working on the Sabbath. That is between you and the Lord, right? 

 

[Kindle]

39 minutes ago, Giller said:

A man changing the day in A.D. 325, is absolute baloney.

Here is info of people before this time of calling the time of the Lord's ressurection, or what the Roman calendar calls sunday, as tbeing the Lord's day, which is the first day of the week.

 

Justin Martyr

Justin Martyr, also known as Saint Justin (100 – 165 AD).

 

(http://pastorhistorian.com/2005/09/13/quotes-from-the-early-church-fathers-on-the-sabbathlords-day-issue)

(2nd Century A.D. 140
Justin Martyr:
“But Sunday is the day which we all hold our common assembly, because Jesus Christ, our Saviour, on the same day rose from the dead.” Apology, Chapter LXVII. )

 

 

Clement of Alexandria

Titus Flavius Clemens (Greek: Κλήμης ὁ Ἀλεξανδρεύς; c. 150 – c. 215), known as Clement of Alexandria to distinguish him from the earlier Clement of Rome.

 

(http://pastorhistorian.com/2005/09/13/quotes-from-the-early-church-fathers-on-the-sabbathlords-day-issue)

(2nd Century A.D. 194 Clement of Alexandria, Egypt:
“He, in fulfillment of the precept, according to the gospel, keeps the Lord’s Day, when he abandons an evil disposition, and assumes that of the Gnostic, glorifying the Lord’s resurrection in himself.” Book 7, Chapter XII.)

 

Tertullian

Quintus Septimius Florens Tertullianus, anglicised as Tertullian (/tərˈtʌliən/; c. 155 – c. 240 AD).

 

(http://www.sounddoctrine.net/Nick/sabbath1.htm)

(Tertullian, of the same period, says: "The Lord's day is the holy day of the Christian church.")

 

(http://www.zianet.com/maxey/Study4.htm)

(Tertullian (160 - 220 A.D.) was the first writer to urge the cessation of labor on Sunday. "We, on the day of the Lord's resurrection, ought to.....defer even our businesses lest we give any place to the devil.")

You haven't given ANY scripture to prove that the sabbath was on a Sunday not even one.

[Kindle]

7 minutes ago, Giller said:

I can , and have in past posts, in other Sabbath threads, you can go check them out if you want.

Since you made post in this thread with no scriptural evidence to try and prove the sabbath is on Sunday. Its best if you clean up your error in the same thread.

When God Created the earth he rested on the seventh day not the first day. There is nothing wrong with going to church on Sunday,I did(There hasn't been a good church to go to in my area so I don't go anymore) I  just know its not the original day God created the sabbath on.

[Kindle]

2 minutes ago, Giller said:

Yes it is true that the original sabbath was on the 7th day, but now we are under a new covenant, with better promises, and every thing , after a certain manner has changed.

Col 2:14-16
(14)  Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
(15)  And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
(16)  Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
 

Which hand written ordinances did he took out of the way, nailing it to the cross?

Well it says let no man therefore; the word therefore is referring to what was previously mentioned before, which is the hand written ordinances, and as a result of the hand written ordinances being nailed to the cross, let no man therefore judge you in meat ordinances (clean , unclean meats), drink ordinances (Nazarite vow), an holy day (God's old testament holy days, which were part of the hand written ordinances given to Moses), or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days plural.

It says sabbath days plural, and not sabbath day singular, which refers to the days they held their Sabbaths on, under old covenant times which they had the original 7th day sabbath, but also they had 7 extra Sabbaths, which were the day of Atonement, the 1rst day of the feast of Unleavened bread, the last day of Unleavened bread, Pentecost, Feast of trumpets, Feats of tabernacles, Last day of feast of tabernacles.

Why were these handwritten ordinances against them? 

Not because they were wrong, but because they could not save any one.

I believe that under the new covenant, we have a complete, spiritual ,physical, and soulish rest in Christ Jesus, but also a day of rest, under another day.

And this day could not be part of the hand written ordinances of Moses, because it never existed back then, but only existed at the time of the day of Pentecost , in the book of Acts.

Hebrews 4:8-9

(8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.

9  There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.)

 

Now the word rest, in verse 9, means this:

 

(Strong’s concordance)

(G4520

σαββατισμός

sabbatismos

sab-bat-is-mos'

From a derivative of G4521; a “sabbatism”, that is, (figuratively) the repose of Christianity (as a type of heaven): - rest.

Total KJV occurrences: 1)

 

Now it mentions that the word sabbatismos is a derivative of G4521, what is G4521?

 

(Strong’s concordance)

(G4521

σάββατον

sabbaton

sab'-bat-on

Of Hebrew origin [H7676]; the Sabbath (that is, Shabbath), or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself); by extension a se'nnight, that is, the interval between two Sabbaths; likewise the plural in all the above applications: - sabbath (day), week.

Total KJV occurrences: 68)

 

Hebrews 4:8

(8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.)

Jesus while alive, surely gave rest to the people, in some form, but could not give permanent rest, until he died on the cross, was resurrected on the first day , and ascended to the right hand of the Father, therefore, sending back the Holy Ghost. And Jesus did speak of another day, wherein he would send back the Comforter. And this other day, was none other than the first day of the week, which is when the Holy Ghost was sent down to men to indwell them. So it mentions a day here, another day, wherein rest would be established, that is rest through the Holy Ghost.

Isaiah 28:11-12

(11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.

12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.)

 

It mentions these other tongues as being some type of rest, and that is what they experienced on the day of Pentecost.

Acts 2:4

(4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.)

 

So we see that Jesus (John 14:26,John 16:7) mentioned another day, but also, is it mentioning this other day, for the sake of having a Sabbath rest, as well?

 

Hebrews 4:9

(9  There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.)

 

I believe that there remaineth a spiritual rest, but also a physical rest through a day of rest, under the New covenant, which the book of Isaiah shows in a certain scripture which I have not covered here.

And the word remaineth refers to something that was in the past, that now is, but in a greater way.

Under the old they had some type of rest through the victories of Joshua, and a day rest, well is it the same today? Just a complete rest in Christ, and a day of rest?

Thank you, even though I don't agree with all of it. I appreciate you taking the time to type it out and explain.