Donnadogsoth Posted November 26, 2016 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 15 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/23/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted November 26, 2016 I'm not in the military but I have many relatives who were. I was wondering whether there were any military people here and, if so, how they square Christianity with the military. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FresnoJoe Posted November 26, 2016 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 207 Topic Count: 60 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,651 Content Per Day: 1.17 Reputation: 5,761 Days Won: 4 Joined: 01/31/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/04/1943 Share Posted November 26, 2016 US Navy '60-'64 Joshua 1:9 "…Have I not commanded you? Be strong and courageous. Do not be frightened, and do not be dismayed, for the LORD your God is with you wherever you go." Psalms 33:20-22 "Our soul waits for the LORD; he is our help and our shield. For our heart is glad in him, because we trust in his holy name. Let your steadfast love, O LORD, be upon us, even as we hope in you." 2 Samuel 22:2-4 And he said, "The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer; My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold and my refuge; My savior, Thou dost save me from violence. "I call upon the LORD, who is worthy to be praised; And I am saved from my enemies." Ephesians 6:11 "Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemes." John 15:13 "Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." 1 Corinthians 16:13 "Be on the alert, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong." Psalms 46:1 "God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble." ~ Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight: Psalms 144:1 I Bless Your Holy Name LORD Jesus I Love You LORD I Love You Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BK1110 Posted November 26, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 6,873 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 9,611 Days Won: 4 Joined: 07/18/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/10/1986 Share Posted November 26, 2016 We're all soldiers in God's army, engaged in a war with His enemies (one that we've fortunately already won!) In what way would someone in the human military need to "square" Christianity with their service? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donnadogsoth Posted November 26, 2016 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 15 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/23/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted November 26, 2016 People die in war, BK, often at the hands of other people. That's the kind of thing I'm wondering about. Plenty of soldiers in WWII from what I have read simply refused to shoot the enemy or shot above their heads, rather than kill another human being. Not to mention bombing runs or artillery barrages. It would be a horrible thing to have to do, one that soldiers probably wouldn't like to talk about, hence my framing the question somewhat abstractly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thilipsis Posted November 27, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 253 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 149 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/10/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/11/1963 Share Posted November 27, 2016 On 11/25/2016 at 9:15 PM, Donnadogsoth said: I'm not in the military but I have many relatives who were. I was wondering whether there were any military people here and, if so, how they square Christianity with the military. Navy, back in the 80s, Indiana National Guards during Katrina, deployed to Iraq as a Guardsman and went to Afghanistan with the regular Army. You ask a good question, we know, certainly from the Flood of Noah's day that God hates violence. We also know from Paul that God appoints certain people to be ministers of justice: For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. (Romans 13:4) Paul under arrest by Rome was under guard by Roman soldiers, when he says those of Caesar's household in this passage he is probably talking about Roman soldiers: All God's people here send you greetings, especially those who belong to Caesar's household. (Phil. 4:22) We know that Cornelius the Centurion was one of the earliest converts among the Gentiles if not the first. There are other example from Scripture and from Church history, as Christian ministers we are never to take up physical arms but in a secular context military service and law enforcement are sanctioned in Scripture as God ordained governing authorities to bring justice to evil doers and malefactors. On a personal level I believe that there are those who protect others, some serve honorable while others do not. I watched when the Iranians took the embassy in Tehran, when the USSR was a threat to the peace of Europe and the world, when the USS Cole was hit by terrorists and the embassies in Africa were hit and wanted to be one of those who choose to serve in defense of the country. I don't like violence, I really don't, but I understand that some kinds of military and civilian force is not only permissible but are ordained by God as instruments of God's justice. I remember this old guy and his wife used to stand in University Park in Indianapolis with a sign, between the American Legion National Headquarters and the Tyndale National Guard armory with a sign that read, 'No War for any Reason'. Perhaps I'm a little twisted but I took pride in the fact that he lives in a country where he can do that. Grace and peace, Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BK1110 Posted November 27, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 6,873 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 9,611 Days Won: 4 Joined: 07/18/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/10/1986 Share Posted November 27, 2016 20 hours ago, Donnadogsoth said: People die in war, BK, often at the hands of other people. That's the kind of thing I'm wondering about. Plenty of soldiers in WWII from what I have read simply refused to shoot the enemy or shot above their heads, rather than kill another human being. Not to mention bombing runs or artillery barrages. It would be a horrible thing to have to do, one that soldiers probably wouldn't like to talk about, hence my framing the question somewhat abstractly. Well, killing another human being isn't automatically a sin, of course. It's a sign of the sinful, fallen world we live in, but war is a reality. People try to oppress other people. If someone breaks into my home and is threatening to harm my family, I'll have no qualms about doing what's necessary to defend them and myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donnadogsoth Posted November 28, 2016 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 15 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 10 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/23/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted November 28, 2016 (edited) It's reassuring to hear that self-defense, or defense of one's family, neighbour, or nation, is not impossible under Christianity. But consider this case: I met a man once, who claimed to take Matthew 5:39 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. seriously to the point of not resisting any evil in any way. I asked him what he would do if he had a gun, and a man with a gun threatened his family. He said he would throw down his gun. Is this man misled? Edited November 28, 2016 by Donnadogsoth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted November 28, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,136 Content Per Day: 4.63 Reputation: 27,817 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted November 28, 2016 Blessings Donnadogsoth Thats hard to say,maybe he is not mislead but it is his personal conviction and what God has for him according to the Purpose of His Calling Quote Romans 14:13-23 Do Not Cause Another to Stumble 13 Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother. 14 I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself, but it is unclean for anyone who thinks it unclean. 15 For if your brother is grieved by what you eat, you are no longer walking in love. By what you eat, do not destroy the one for whom Christ died. 16 So do not let what you regard as good be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. 18 Whoever thus serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. 19 So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding. 20 Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats. 21 It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble.[a] 22 The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who has no reason to pass judgment on himself for what he approves. 23 But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.[b] If he did stand true to his convictions they certainly are not contrary to Gods Word.....my husband feels the same way & once said he could not kill anyone.even if they threatened family(me)...after much thought(many days later)he said"I would probably shoot the man without hesitation".....It is very hard to know what you would do in those situations,lest not we judge or think we know ourselves so well,it is so important to walk in Spirit & in Truth that Jesus be our Heart & Mind With love-in Christ,Kwik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyAngeL Posted November 28, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 155 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,464 Content Per Day: 1.02 Reputation: 8,810 Days Won: 57 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/12/1952 Share Posted November 28, 2016 On 11/26/2016 at 11:38 AM, Donnadogsoth said: People die in war, BK, often at the hands of other people. That's the kind of thing I'm wondering about. Plenty of soldiers in WWII from what I have read simply refused to shoot the enemy or shot above their heads, rather than kill another human being. Not to mention bombing runs or artillery barrages. It would be a horrible thing to have to do, one that soldiers probably wouldn't like to talk about, hence my framing the question somewhat abstractly. Hi Donna, My dad, my grandfather were both in the Army, my husband was in a Marine in Korea. There is nothing to square with as far as I'm concerned. All of our US military are honorable and are due respect and a huge Thank You from those of us who are kept safe by their service. My question would be to are you a believer? Are you a born again Christian? This is the Seekers Lounge for those who are not Christians and have questions about the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1x1is1 Posted November 28, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,146 Content Per Day: 0.27 Reputation: 732 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/30/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/10/1950 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hello and welcome to Worthy Donnagogsoth. You have a valid question here. I understand your curiosity toward reconciling the taking of another persons life by a Christian soldier. I will take it that you already know the difference between murder and killing in defense. Truly there is much to say on this subject and I see why there needs to be approval by a moderator before final acceptance. I can only offer at this time that as an 18 year old Marine in Vietnam back in 68' I was not Born again. I can't really remember if there was a right or wrong struggle going on in my head. Nowadays, if I were in combat again, any returned fire on my part would be to protect my fellow Marines rather than myself. I know that I am saved, so no need to prolong my life, but I don't know for sure about anyone else, so I would make an effort to give them extended opportunities to come to Christ. This was a tough thread to respond to. I began writing on Saturday but gave up. Only today did I attempt again and was surprised to find my original unfinished response still on hand. So I decided to finish it now. It is very easy to express in my brain to myself, but hard to put in the correct words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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