missmuffet Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,993 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,691 Content Per Day: 11.75 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 1 Samuel 28:7-20 The passage does not give us any reason to believe it was anyone other than Samuel, who is described by the medium as “an old man wearing a robe” (v. 14). Obviously, age and clothing do not exist in the realm of the spirits of those who have died, but God miraculously gave Samuel such appearances as would enable Saul perceive who the spirit was. The message Samuel gave Saul was completely accurate. God allowed the witch of Endor to summon the prophet Samuel in order to give King Saul the news of his coming defeat and death. This does not mean that it is genuinely possible for witches or mediums to speak with the dead, only that God allowed it in this one exception. When a person dies, his soul is taken to heaven or hell, depending on whether he has placed his faith in Christ (Matthew 25:46). There is no reason to believe that a deceased person has any ability to leave heaven or hell in order to visit his living family members. Any such claim is a demonic deception (2 Corinthians 11:14-15). God declared such practices to be abhorrent to Him, and those who did practice such things in Israel were to be put to death (Leviticus 20:27; Deuteronomy 18:10-12). Satan would like nothing more than for people to dabble in the occult world of spiritism and necromancy. God’s commandments regarding these things are designed to protect us from the schemes of our enemy, the devil, who “prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour” (1 Peter 5:8). https://www.gotquestions.org/witch-of-endor.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,890 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,777 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 1 hour ago, zorgblar said: What really got to me was verses 9 and 10:(What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions[a]? 10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe. And by the way if you want to know were i got this i got it right here: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ephesians+4%3A9-10 Ephesians 4:9,10 is referring to Jesus Christ, JESUS is the one who has ascented high above all, and not before descenting first in the lower parts of the earth. So all powers can see Jesus the Christ, JESUS had to go to them, Every knee shall bow down to him. Hope you do not expect that all the fallen Angels, whould have to leave the Tartarus, the place of their prison to go in Heaven and bow down to Jesus Christ, and then returned back to the place of their prison. In the Gospel of John, chapter one, we read about who JESUS was and what he did before he was born in Bethlehem. His descent started from been with God from the beginning, and after when he was here on earth, he said: my descent has not finished yet, I still need to descent to the lower parts of the earth, before I begin my ascent . You know about the ressuraction of Jesus Christ and his testimony to his disciples, that all Authority has been given unto me, in Heaven and on earth, And his eventual ascention, how he was taken up in Heavens, and sitted on the Throne of God. Samuel who had a miraculous birth, and served before God, and loved by God who kept no secret from him, and his time came to die. It is interesting to note what the people believed that time, the people of God. Saul knew where Samuel was, and he did not look for him in Heavens but in Hades, and that's where he found him. Yes we see that Samuel after descenting down there at the time of his death, he ascented from Seol to where Saul was, and then descented again to Sheol, and not before telling Saul that tonight or tomorrow you will come to be together with me. That's something, it tell us to where Saul went when he died. The most favour of the Lord, Samuel, and the most rejected (perhaps a very strong word), by the Lord Saul, both went to the same place when they die. One with a peaceful death, and the other with a violent death. Before JESUS there was a young man who had descended to Seol, a non Jewish one, and the prophet (Elisah) brought him back, raised him from the dead, (the ascent back on the earth), but he eventually this man died from old age, or at a later time, to descent to Seol again. JESUS raised some people from the dead, brought them back to the earth after their descent to Seol, but if those whom he raised from the dead (and one of them was a Gentile) died later on as Believers in JESUS CHRIST , and if they died after the resurrection, they did not go back in Seol again, but they ascended in the Heavens to where Jesus is, or to be with Jesus. LASAROUS is a good example, whom we know that he was raised from the dead before JESUS death, and died after the resurrection of Jesus Christ. And this time he ascented into Heaven. Jesus said: I am the life and the resurrection, if you believe in me , you have both the life and the resurrection and you will never die. As Believers we have the life in us, just living our earthly time, till the time when we live this earthy tent, or body and go to be with the one who gave us the life, JESUS CHRIST the Lord of Heavens. No matter how we die, whether with peaceful death or a violent one, a natural or self inflicted one. in his name always. Different glory for Samuel and another for Saul, but they still ended up in the same place. The same for the Believers in Jesus Christ , in his name, only, because of the Cross. One of the reasons I respond to your post , is because I see that you are a thinker. and hope that it will be a blessing to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 15 hours ago, zorgblar said: If it wasn't samuel coming up from the earth how do you explain eph 4:8-11? The witch resurrected the body of Samuel. There is no soul sleep. 2 Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, [I say], and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 13 hours ago, missmuffet said: 1 Samuel 28:7-20 The passage does not give us any reason to believe it was anyone other than Samuel, who is described by the medium as “an old man wearing a robe” (v. 14). Obviously, age and clothing do not exist in the realm of the spirits of those who have died, but God miraculously gave Samuel such appearances as would enable Saul perceive who the spirit was. The message Samuel gave Saul was completely accurate. God allowed the witch of Endor to summon the prophet Samuel in order to give King Saul the news of his coming defeat and death. This does not mean that it is genuinely possible for witches or mediums to speak with the dead, only that God allowed it in this one exception. When a person dies, his soul is taken to heaven or hell, depending on whether he has placed his faith in Christ (Matthew 25:46). There is no reason to believe that a deceased person has any ability to leave heaven or hell in order to visit his living family members. Any such claim is a demonic deception (2 Corinthians 11:14-15). God declared such practices to be abhorrent to Him, and those who did practice such things in Israel were to be put to death (Leviticus 20:27; Deuteronomy 18:10-12). Satan would like nothing more than for people to dabble in the occult world of spiritism and necromancy. God’s commandments regarding these things are designed to protect us from the schemes of our enemy, the devil, who “prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour” (1 Peter 5:8). https://www.gotquestions.org/witch-of-endor.html Amen to that. good post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravindran Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 496 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 398 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/18/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 15 hours ago, zorgblar said: If it wasn't samuel coming up from the earth how do you explain eph 4:8-11? I don't think we need to believe it was definitely Samuel to explain Ephesians 4:8-11. I see no relationship between the 2. There are good arguments are on both sides to say whether it was Samuel or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blessed_Monk Posted February 8, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 47 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 29 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/07/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted February 8, 2017 15 hours ago, zorgblar said: If it wasn't samuel coming up from the earth how do you explain eph 4:8-11? Maybe read Paul's letter in full? Chapter 4 itself. That should help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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