Fidei Defensor Posted May 3, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.56 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 3, 2017 The truth that may offend my Catholic brothers (no offense intended) is Mary isn't special. What made her special is she gave birth to Jesus Christ via the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:26-38), and she said yes, "And Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her" (Luke 1:38). God could have picked any other woman, and it is possible Mary could have said "I can't handle this," (free will) But Mary puts things in perspective by these words, "How my spirit rejoices in God my Savior! For he took notice of his lowly servant girl, and from now on all generations will call me blessed." (Luke 1:47-48). Mary immediately rejoices in God, and mentions Him as Savior, meaning she isn't sinless, and secondly she notes that she is a lowly servant, nothing special. So the following line of "all generations will call me blessed" being a command doesn't work, because previous statements are how she needs Savior and rejoices in Him, and that she is lowly. If you follow Catholic Dogma that the "generations call me blessed" is a command, then you follow Mary was proud, and God resists the proud (), and it contradicts the spirit of worship and what she said prior to this "all generations will call me blessed." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 4 hours ago, inchrist said: Really? You are aware the bible is alive? The words in the bible are not only alive but active. When Mary states "listen to him", her words are alive. So how do you come to the conclusion she doesnt tell you to listen to Christ? Mary was talking to the people at that time, not to the Church 4 hours ago, inchrist said: Psalm 148:2 Praise him, all his angels; praise him, all his heavenly hosts. Here you are praying to the angels and heavenly hosts (dead saints included) to praise God. That is absurd and false. That is not a prayer to angels or dead saints. Our prayers go only to God. Only unregenerate, reprobate sinners pray to anyone other than God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 12 hours ago, inchrist said: So you wouldnt listen to Mary if she tells you to listen to Christ? Mary doesn't speak to us. The Holy Spirit is who leads us and guides us and God speaks to us through His Word, not through Mary. If some spirit claiming to be Mary started speaking to me, it would be a demon from Satan. The "Mary" of the RCC, the one they pray to, isn't the Mary of Scripture, the mother of Jesus' humanity. The "Mary" of the RCC is whore of Babylon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 711 Content Per Day: 0.28 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 14 hours ago, inchrist said: So you wouldnt listen to Mary if she tells you to listen to Christ? "The living know that they will die - but the dead know nothing" Eccl 9:5 "The Dead in Christ will rise first" 1 Thess 4 "Do not go to the dead on behalf of the living" Isaiah 8:19 King Saul went to the dead to inquire of the medium, the witch of Endore - to inquire "of it". saying "conjure up for me whomever I shall name". And more specifically "by thy familiar spirit". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 19 hours ago, inchrist said: And thats precisely how Catholicism views it. Catholics don’t pray TO the Saints, they pray THROUGH the Saints, or ask the Saints to pray on their behalf with them. The same way the apostles would ask Mary to pray with them in your example. First part.....no difference. They are still speaking to the saints directly which is forbidden as the saints are DEAD and it is forbidden to contact the dead, even the dead in Christ. Second....they might have when they were all still alive but any apostle who outlived Mary would not have committed the blasphemy of praying to her in heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 6 hours ago, inchrist said: When Mary states "listen to him", her words are alive. So how do you come to the conclusion she doesnt tell you to listen to Christ? Where do you hear these demonic "Mary" apparitions that have appeared to Catholics tell any of them to listen to Jesus? You dont. They barely lay lip service to Christ and they all tell people to honor and listen to HER, not to HIM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 6 hours ago, inchrist said: Psalm 148:2 Praise him, all his angels; praise him, all his heavenly hosts. Here you are praying to the angels and heavenly hosts (dead saints included) to praise God That says nothing about praying to the dead or the dead hearing our prayers. All saints and angels in heaven will naturally praise God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Just now, inchrist said: Your argument is superficial. Yet you cant deny her role for calling sarvants to Listen to Christ. Mary spoke to servants at a wedding and told them to do what Jesus would instruct them to do regarding the wine that had run out. You cannot make a doctrine from that, that says that Mary speaks to Christians. The Bible doesn't make that appeal. Nothing in Scripture points to Mary as someone we need to listen to. Quote Mary's words echo that of the Old Testament covenant All that the Lord has spoken we will do (Ex. 19:8) And All the words which the Lord has spoken we will do” (Ex. 24:3, 7). No, they don't echo that at all. That is simply false teaching that you are trying to force on to the Scriptures. Fortunately, true committed followers of Jesus know to reject your teaching and listen rather to the Holy Spirit. Quote Mary personifies Gods people in the context of the new covenant and stands as a faithful representative. No, she does not. And the Bible never says that. The Bible does not place as much value on Mary as the Roman cult does. Quote Her words and actions are an echo to us. Again the bible is alive and so are her words. No, her words are not alive. She was just a woman and nothing more. Quote Then no one spoke anything in scripture. No, God the Father spoke. He spoke through His prophets and His apostles and through His Son Jesus Christ. Jesus was God and God the Father spoke through Him and Jesus said as much. But Mary was never a prophet, never an apostle, never started a church, never wrote an epistle, is never venerated by anyone and is pretty much out of the picture after the resurrection. Quote No this is just poor eschatology wrapped up in Christian xenophobia, I mean whats stoppong this kind of xenophobic attacks on Protestant? No, it's just the truth. The RCC is an idolatrous cult that worships their god, the whore of Babylon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Just now, inchrist said: Well it actaully does, i cant fix denial. No, it does not and you can't provide any Scripture that supports it. It's not that you can't fix denial; you simply can't back up your claims with Scripture and need a convenient cop out. Quote I see no difference with protestants... We are not calling God the Father a liar by denying the Deity of Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Just now, inchrist said: Well actually it does Blessed are you among women, Catholicism seems to be the only one prophetically fulfilling this. Blessing her Blessing her is one thing. Venerating her is another. The Bible doesn't venerate her and it doesn't say that we should view her as an intermediary between us and God the Son. or the queen of heaven or any of that Babylonian idolatry. That is just Roman cultic idolatrous myth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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