I Thes 5:22

[frienduff thaylorde]

2 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Note that that still happen today, in this day and age we are living in.  People and familiy actually in reality

believe their other family members who are true believers are 'crazy', to put it most polite for here.

They will even deliver their own father or son or mother or brother over to death (like in nazi Germany they did often - it also happens all around the world today) ....

Let us take HEED to this warning.       Soon in time when the whole of the leaven is FULL and filled with this all inclusive world peace LIE

MANY will then betray us , thinking we evil and they are love.  thinking we do the work of satan and they do the will of GOD for world peace and unity.

THINK this cant happen.   NOT ONLY WILL IT ................its coming way sooner than most realize.   much sooner.

YES the time is coming for us even here in western socities and round the world , that those who kill us will think they do GODS WILL for world peace and unity.  ITS COMING

and wont be stayed too much longer.    We better be prepared n Christ NOW or fall away many more will.  

[coheir]

6 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Note that that still happen today, in this day and age we are living in.  People and familiy actually in reality

believe their other family members who are true believers are 'crazy', to put it most polite for here.

They will even deliver their own father or son or mother or brother over to death (like in nazi Germany they did often - it also happens all around the world today) ....

Mark 13

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

[simplejeff]

21 minutes ago, coheir said:

Mark 13

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The world church, partnered with or more itself being babylon,  has condemned billions of souls to destruction.

It is NOTHING in common with PETER or the early ekklesia, born again by the Father, abiding in Jesus.

Thus it does this, "pretending" to be God's representative as if descended /in line/ after PETER (but nothing at all like him nor like the other believers, ever) , as babylon and society is seeking death for one and all, even its own members on mere whims.... pernicious as babylon is... and all society ...

[Guest Butero]

16 hours ago, Running Gator said:

I understand that is your opinion, but it is just that, an opinion.

It is beyond just my opinion now, as someone else took the time to look it up in the Greek and found they KJV translators used the correct English word.  I plan to look it up in my own Greek Dictionary when I get home as well as the final proof.  

[Guest Butero]

16 hours ago, Running Gator said:

Yes, the Bible is the inerrant Word of God.  Any version of if that man is involved in is not perfect, as man is not perfect.  

Again, this is exactly the kind of thinking I have been warning people about.  It is a way of having your cake and eating it too.  You can claim to believe in inerrancy of scripture, but then say that was only the case in the original manuscripts that have long ago decayed with age.  As such, if you don't like something, you can translation shop to find a Bible that says what you want, and claim the other translations that say something you don't like have errors.  As such, we have no fully reliable translation, so inerrancy doesn't have any real meaning.  

The King James Bible was translated from the original manuscripts that were perfect, the T.R., and they used the best corresponding English words.  The perfect Word of God was translated perfectly to English.  The only thing lost in the translation was where you might have 2 or 3 Greek words that could only be translated to a single English word, but the best possible English word was used every time.  The modern translations chose to start with the Egyptian and Alexandrian manuscripts as their foundation, not the manuscripts that were accepted as scripture by the church, and they were at times incomplete or different. 

In addition to that, the translators were trying to get a copywrite, so in order to do that, their translations had to differ from one another, meaning they would often times use the 3rd, 4th or 5th best definition of a word rather than the best one which was already used.  That led to more changes in the translations.  They did something else I find interesting.  In order to differ from one another, they would at times choose to leave in things that were left out of the Egyptian and Alexandrian manuscript in one, while another left the same verse out, and there was no logical reason for it, except to differ from the others.  The KJV translators had no reason to concern themselves with such things, so they could use the best English words each time, and include every single verse.  

[Guest Butero]

5 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Butero.  SHE is not saying it seemed like he was mentally ill to her.   THEY thought he was beside himself, they thought he had a demon.

that is what she meant .

I understand that.  I knew some accused Jesus of having a devil, but I believe they knew better and only did because they didn't want to acknowledge it was the power of God doing the works.  I was just trying to figure out what was meant by some thinking Jesus was mentally ill.  It was the words "beside himself" she was referring to.  I always looked at that as being overwhelmed, not mentally ill, but I will try to take the time to look into that further.  

[Guest Butero]

14 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Here are the definitions of the Greek word "eidos" translated as "appearance" in the blueletterbible site    https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G1491&t=KJV...........so it can mean appearance as well as form, shape, so i don't believe that can be considered an error of translation in the KJV.  But the word "appearance" can mean EITHER outward appearance, OR appearance in the sense of being, like someone made an appearance at your party, ie, they came, they manifested themselves, they showed up.

According to Vines Greek Dictionary, it confirms that the original Greek word that was translated was indeed eidos, and it means "that which strikes the eye, that which is exposed to view."  This is all dealing with how something looks.  It was this word that had to be translated to English, so the KJV translators most certainly did get it right, and that is not just based on my opinion Running Gator.  

[Guest shiloh357]

16 hours ago, Running Gator said:

Yes, the Bible is the inerrant Word of God.  Any version of if that man is involved in is not perfect, as man is not perfect.  

Just to build on what Butero said, it is important to note that man was involved with the original texts, as well.  And the issue here, is not inerrancy, but infallibility.    Inerrancy speaks to the historical accuracy of the Bible.  Infallibility deals with the doctrinal truth/teaching of Scripture.

If the argument is that anything man is involved with is imperfect, then you would have to extend that to originals, as well.

Furthermore, your argument would make man more powerful than God since, by your logic, God is incapable of preserving His Word against man's imperfections.   That completely degrades the sovereignty of God.   If every Bible is imperfect, then there is no way to know what God actually says in His Word.   You can have no faith in the Word of God, whatsoever, no way to trust what you're reading.   The "Word of God" in that case, becomes whatever someone wants it to be. 

Butero is correct about the translation shopping.  I have seen preachers who grab verses from various translations within a single sermon in order to make the fit their agenda, which enables them to mold the Bible around their ideas and make the Bible conform to their preconceived ideas.

 

[Running Gator]

4 hours ago, Butero said:

According to Vines Greek Dictionary, it confirms that the original Greek word that was translated was indeed eidos, and it means "that which strikes the eye, that which is exposed to view."  This is all dealing with how something looks.  It was this word that had to be translated to English, so the KJV translators most certainly did get it right, and that is not just based on my opinion Running Gator.  

Well, then we have another problem.  If appearance is the only correct translation for this word, as you are claiming, then why when the word is used 5 times in the New Testament did the KJV folks only translate it as appearance once out of those 5?   Did they get it wrong the other 4 times?

[Heleadethme]

4 hours ago, Butero said:

According to Vines Greek Dictionary, it confirms that the original Greek word that was translated was indeed eidos, and it means "that which strikes the eye, that which is exposed to view."  This is all dealing with how something looks.  It was this word that had to be translated to English, so the KJV translators most certainly did get it right, and that is not just based on my opinion Running Gator.  

If you are interested in more study, according to Strong's in blueletter bible ( https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G1491&t=KJV ) the Greek word "eidos" also means form, figure, shape, or kind.  See elsewhere in the bible where it is used to mean shape/form.

And the more I look into it the more I'm convinced that mere outward appearance is not the right understanding of 2 Thess. 5:22, because other places that are talking EXPLICITLY about outward appearance do not use the word "eidos".  These same scriptures also give us God's thoughts on the matter and we know His word does not contradict itself.

John 7:24

Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.  (Greek word "opsis")

2 Corinthians 5:12

For we commend not ourselves again unto you, but give you occasion to glory on our behalf, that ye may have somewhat to answer them which glory in appearance, and not in heart. (Greek word "prosopon")

2 Corinthians 10:7

Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christ's, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ's, even so are we Christ's. (Greek word "prosopon")

I can only speak and testify for myself that as for me, I've completely thrown out the "outward appearance" understanding of that 2 Thess. verse.........my mind is washed of it......it's just gone, gone, disappeared, poof, nada, nyet, nil, nullified.....and away from me satan......I simply do not believe outward appearance is what God wants us to be concerned about.  He has freed me from that false constraint to simply shema (hear/obey/follow) Him, without consciousness of sin, like a little child, praise His name.

And I will add that is one stumbling stone out of the way in my life......on the way and related to another bigger one that I've been praying to have removed......I give you praise and thanks Lord Jesus \o/ and may we continue on to victory!