Wayne222 Posted January 8, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 32 Topic Count: 476 Topics Per Day: 0.17 Content Count: 6,559 Content Per Day: 2.28 Reputation: 7,638 Days Won: 9 Joined: 06/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said: Amen Wayne. Even the NT says though the Saturday Sabbath hasnt changed we dont HAVE to keep it. Yes your right. The sabbath is still sunset friday to sunset saturday. But for the christian its not over us. We are free to work on that day becsuse christ is our rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted January 8, 2018 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 8, 2018 "Hebrews 10Complete Jewish Bible (CJB) 10 For the Torah has in it a shadow of the good things to come, but not the actual manifestation of the originals. Therefore, it can never, by means of the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, bring to the goal those who approach the Holy Place to offer them. 2 Otherwise, wouldn’t the offering of those sacrifices have ceased? For if the people performing the service had been cleansed once and for all, they would no longer have sins on their conscience. 3 No, it is quite the contrary — in these sacrifices is a reminder of sins, year after year. 4 For it is impossible that the blood of bulls and goats should take away sins. 5 This is why, on coming into the world, he says, “It has not been your willto have an animal sacrifice and a meal offering;rather, you have prepared for me a body.6 No, you have not been pleasedwith burnt offerings and sin offerings.7 Then I said, ‘Look!In the scroll of the bookit is written about me.I have come to do your will.’”[a] 8 In saying first, “You neither willed nor were pleased with animal sacrifices, meal offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings,” things which are offered in accordance with the Torah; 9 and then, “Look, I have come to do your will”; he takes away the first system in order to set up the second. 10 It is in connection with this will that we have been separated for God and made holy, once and for all, through the offering of Yeshua the Messiah’s body. 11 Now every cohen stands every day doing his service, offering over and over the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But this one, after he had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, sat down at the right hand of God, 13 from then on to wait until his enemies be made a footstool for his feet.[b] 14 For by a single offering he has brought to the goal for all time those who are being set apart for God and made holy." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted January 8, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 8, 2018 15 minutes ago, Wayne222 said: Yes your right. The sabbath is still sunset friday to sunset saturday. But for the christian its not over us. We are free to work on that day becsuse christ is our rest. I sometimes wonder about such legalists and how they would judge those who HAVE to work on Saturday and cant get out of it because they dont have much control over their work schedules. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted January 8, 2018 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 8, 2018 About 250,000 results (0.65 seconds) www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/the-written-law-torah "It was one of the very few real dogmas of rabbinic theology that the Torah is from heaven; i.e., the Torah in its entirety was revealed by God. According to biblical stories, Moses ascended into heaven to capture the Torah from the angels. In one of the oldest mishnaic statements it is taught that Torah is one of the three things by which the world is sustained. Eleazar ben Shammua said: "Were it not for the Torah, heaven and earth would not continue to exist". The Torah was often compared to fire, water, wine, oil, milk, honey, drugs, manna, the tree of life, and many other things; it was considered the source of freedom, goodness, and life; it was identified both with wisdom and with love. Hillel summarized the entire Torah in one sentence: "What is hateful to you, do not to your fellow". Akiva said: "The fundamental principle of the Torah is the commandment, 'Love thy neighbor as thyself '". The message of the Torah is for all mankind. Before giving the Torah to Israel, God offered it to the other nations, but they refused it; and when He did give the Torah to Israel, He revealed it in the extraterritorial desert and simultaneously in all the 70 languages, so that men of all nations would have a right to it. Alongside this .., the rabbis taught the inseparability of Israel and the Torah. One rabbi held that the concept of Israel existed in God's mind even before He created the Torah. Yet, were it not for its accepting the Torah, Israel would not be "chosen," nor would it be different from all the idolatrous nations." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted January 8, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 8, 2018 3 minutes ago, simplejeff said: i.e., the Torah in its entirety was revealed by God. According to biblical stories, Moses ascended into heaven to capture the Torah from the angels. Ah now we see where Muslims get this stupid idea that their Koran was sent down in its entirety from heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydog1976 Posted January 10, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 626 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 360 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2018 On 1/7/2018 at 6:58 PM, MyLordsServant said: Jesus clearly and plainly taught, how to keep the Sabbath. That's it, nothing more, nothing less. I am interested in where the scripture is that teaches this as you say? I mean didn't Jesus himself ask the Pharisees when the questioned him healing on the Sabbath in Luke 14:5 "Then he asked them, "If one of you has a child or an ox that falls into a well on the Sabbath day, will you not immediately pull it out?" But I really love the response of the Pharisees to this question in Luke 14:6 "And they had nothing to say." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydog1976 Posted January 10, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 626 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 360 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2018 On 1/7/2018 at 6:45 PM, MyLordsServant said: "legalists" as you call them. Are supporting the law commanded by God. If you can find an error in that, then you can call them "legalists". If you deny the validity of law, then your whole scripture is upside down. So question: Do you follow the Law verbatim or do you pick and choose what parts of the Law to follow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted January 10, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 25 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,605 Content Per Day: 3.97 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2018 (edited) Those that choose not to observe (or try to) the law are themselves UNDER IT. When it is said 'under the law' it means UNDER PENALTY of it. So if you ignore it, you are automatically under it. Condemnation is automatic since you chose to ignore it and say it is of no meaning under Grace. Saul said just the opposite. He said that Grace does not give us freedom to ignore the law. But in following it, Grace gives us the freedom from its Penalty. Doctrines twist these words so that people can ignore it conveniently. It is an RCC dictate from many years ago and modern Christians find it soothing to their carnal natures to say they are under Grace and not the Law. It is the complete opposite of what most have been taught. Edited January 10, 2018 by Justin Adams 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne222 Posted January 10, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 32 Topic Count: 476 Topics Per Day: 0.17 Content Count: 6,559 Content Per Day: 2.28 Reputation: 7,638 Days Won: 9 Joined: 06/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 10, 2018 23 minutes ago, Justin Adams said: Those that choose not to observe (or try to) the law are themselves UNDER IT. When it is said 'under the law' it means UNDER PENALTY of it. So if you ignore it, you are automatically under it. Condemnation is automatic since you chose to ignore it and say it is of no meaning under Grace. Saul said just the opposite. He said that Grace does not give us freedom to ignore the law. But in following it, Grace gives us the freedom from its Penalty. Doctrines twist these words so that people can ignore it conveniently. It is an RCC dictate from many years ago and modern Christians find it soothing to their carnal natures to say they are under Grace and not the Law. It is the complete opposite of what most have been taught. We are under the law to Christ. He is our law . Every word from Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted January 10, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 25 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,605 Content Per Day: 3.97 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2018 31 minutes ago, Wayne222 said: We are under the law to Christ. He is our law . Every word from Christ. The WORD (Christ) gave us the Law. He expects us to keep it. "If you love me, keep My Commandments". ( not the Pharisaical additions to the law) Saul agreed with that as well. We are in Christ Yeshua Messiah. He is the one that gave us the Law and the Commandments. The Torah exists in perpetuity from Yahweh - The father and transcribed and given by Yeshua the Son. We honor Him by observing and keeping His Law and His Commandments. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts