enoob57 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,189 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,469 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, discipler777 said: . Whether Christians believe in "once saved always saved" or "once saved not always saved", they should ... "Go and sin no more, lest a worse thing come upon you.”(John 5 :14 & 8:11) . To me "once saved always saved" is being presumptuous about God and discounts fallen Man's free will, even though he/she has been initially saved by faith. OSAS may lead to over-confidence about one's salvation and being desensitized to sins/evil-deeds/law-breaking or "having their own conscience seared with a hot iron" = deceivingly telling oneself that sins/evil-deeds/law-breaking will never cause him/her to be unsaved. ... 1Timothy 4 = The Great Apostasy 1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received with thanksgiving; 5 for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. . Revelation 22 = Jesus Testifies to the Churches 12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.” 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie. 16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.” 17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely. 19 minutes ago, discipler777 said: . Hebrews 6 = 4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame. (NKJV) . 2Thessalonians 2 = The Great Apostasy 2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. . 1Corinthians 6:9-11 = 9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. . Hebrews 10:26-31 = 26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. . To me, the "fall away" of Hebrews 6:4 is related to the "falling away" by the lawlessness and unrighteousness of 2Thess 2 that will precede the 2nd Coming of Jesus Christ to earth. Christians, for whatever reasons(eg self-deception/delusion and doctrines of demons), who fall into wilful or ignorant sins/evil-deeds/law-breaking, will be severely cursed/judged by God and may lose their salvation by losing faith in Christ/God while suffering for their sins, eg Job 2:9. Otoh, if they repent and keep the faith, like King David and Job, they will remain saved from hell. One verse tells us apostacy is one who has heard knows yet walks away... for this verse alone defines the reality of all else 1 John 2:19 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. KJV How does John know this … he was there when Jesus said this to him John 10:27-30 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and my Father are one. KJV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discipler777 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 606 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 102 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/25/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, enoob57 said: How does John know this … he was there when Jesus said this to him John 10:27-30 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and my Father are one. KJV . JOHN.10:27-30 needs to be cross-referenced to JOHN.17:6-26, in order to see the proper context and get the true meaning of what Jesus Christ was saying. Some Christians desire that all the positive sayings of Christ are referring to them and all the negative and convicting sayings of Christ are not. The guarantee of eternal security only applied to the 11 Apostles of Jesus Christ who were personally chosen by Him and spent about 3 and 1/2 years with Him. ... . John 17:6-26 = Jesus Prays for His Disciples 6 “I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word. 7 Now they have known that all things which You have given Me are from You. 8 For I have given to them the words which You have given Me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came forth from You; and they have believed that You sent Me. 9 “I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth. Jesus Prays for All Believers 20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me. 24 “Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world. 25 O righteous Father! The world has not known You, but I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me. 26 And I have declared to them Your name, and will declare it, that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discipler777 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 606 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 102 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/25/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, enoob57 said: One verse tells us apostacy is one who has heard knows yet walks away... for this verse alone defines the reality of all else 1 John 2:19 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. . 1JOHN.2:18-19 = Deceptions of the Last Hour 18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. . MATTHEW.24:15-16 & 23-24 = 15 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. ... 23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand. . LUKE.21:20-22 = 20 “But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. . 1JOHN.2:19 has to be looked at in the proper historical context of the time. Who were the "antichrists" and what is "the last hour" of 1JOHN.2:18.? ... After causing Jesus Christ to be crucified for not being the Christ/Messiah of their desires, ie one who would defeat the foreign Roman rulers and gift them back their kingdom of earth or Israel(john.6:15), the Jews self-appointed antichrists or false christs for themselves to lead them into armed rebellion or holy war against the Romans = the First Jewish Roman War. This culminated in the Roman Army destroying the Jews and their Holy Temple of God in Jerusalem in 70AD = the last hour. "The last hour" cannot be referring to the 2nd Coming of Jesus Christ because John was writing to fellow Jewish Christians of his time("They went out from us, but they were not of us"), ie during the 1st century AD. Who were those who "went out from us".? They were some deceived Jewish Christians who had also hoped to be gifted back their kingdom of Israel, so they believed in the false christs or antichrists and joined in the Jewish armed rebellion against the Romans. Edited October 31, 2018 by discipler777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,189 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,469 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, discipler777 said: . JOHN.10:27-30 needs to be cross-referenced to JOHN.17:6-26, in order to see the proper context and get the true meaning of what Jesus Christ was saying. Some Christians desire that all the positive sayings of Christ are referring to them and all the negative and convicting sayings of Christ are not. The guarantee of eternal security only applied to the 11 Apostles of Jesus Christ who were personally chosen by Him and spent about 3 and 1/2 years with Him. ... . John 17:6-26 = Jesus Prays for His Disciples 6 “I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word. 7 Now they have known that all things which You have given Me are from You. 8 For I have given to them the words which You have given Me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came forth from You; and they have believed that You sent Me. 9 “I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth. Jesus Prays for All Believers 20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me. 24 “Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world. 25 O righteous Father! The world has not known You, but I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me. 26 And I have declared to them Your name, and will declare it, that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them.” Doesn't hold up to the scrutiny of context... John 10:16 16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. KJV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discipler777 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 606 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 102 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/25/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, enoob57 said: Doesn't hold up to the scrutiny of context... John 10:16 16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. KJV . JOHN.10:7-16 = Jesus the Good Shepherd 7 Then Jesus said to them again, “Most assuredly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture. 10 The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly. 11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. 12 But a hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them. 13 The hireling flees because he is a hireling and does not care about the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd. . JOHN.10:7-16 was just talking about salvation through faith in Jesus Christ coming first to the Jews(= "My sheep") and then later to the Gentiles/Greeks(= "other sheep"), and not about guaranteed salvation or OSAS. JOHN.3:16 says whoever believes in Jesus Christ shall not perish but has everlasting life, whether Jews or Gentiles. In this case, "My sheep" does not refer to the 11 Apostles and "other sheep" does not refer to all other believers, like that of JOHN.17:6-26. . JOHN.4:21-22 = 21 Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe Me, the hour is coming when you will neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. . ROMANS.11:11 = Israel’s Rejection Not Final 11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. Edited October 31, 2018 by discipler777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,189 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,469 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted October 31, 2018 Eternal security of the believer is clearly defined in Scripture.... What God regenerates, keeps, seals is well documented in The Word! It could not be understood any other way 1 Cor 2:13-16 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. 16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. KJV 1 John 2:19-21 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. 21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth. KJV There just aren't any other grammatical options available to what is written... therefore all else must be brought into this light or else there is contradictions within the text and that would be heresy to believe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.88 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2018 OSAS........200 verses “ against”.......400 verses “ for” The 200 verses that “ appear” to show that OSAS is wrong are either taken out of context or verses not addressed to the Body of Christ. Argue all day, but this it what it all boils down to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discipler777 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 606 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 102 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/25/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, enoob57 said: Eternal security of the believer is clearly defined in Scripture.... . Yes, but only for those believers who have kept the faith until the very end(2TIMOTHY.4:6-8) and have remained mostly righteous or law-abiding(= showing the fruits/works of the Spirit - MATTHEW.7:15-23 and GALATIANS.5:19-26), ... not for those "believers" who wilfully or ignorantly or self-deceivingly/delusionally commit sins(or unrighteousness or lawlessness) and later stubbornly refuse to repent = may lose faith = lose salvation, eg like the Jews who went and "murdered" Jesus Christ. ... . 1CORINTHIANS.5:1-5 & 11-13 = Immorality Defiles the Church 5 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such sexual immorality as is not even named among the Gentiles—that a man has his father’s wife! 2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. ... 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person. 12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.” . HEBREWS.10:26-31 = 26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. . 1CORINTHIANS.3:1-4 = Sectarianism Is Carnal 3 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. 2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; 3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men? 4 For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted October 31, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,189 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,469 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted October 31, 2018 What you are doing is saying it is by faith but then works also are required to keep... however this could not be true then Titus 3:5-6 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; KJV That is what is so wonderful that God has told us in advance this 2 Peter 3:10 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. KJV anything that we generate with our effort will be gone here... therefor only the faith upon His Word in which I acted without reliance upon the thing itself as a lasting value will be kept into the new heaven and earth where only righteousness dwells and no memory of anything of the time of sin! Rev 21:1-6 21 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. 4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. 5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. 6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. KJV by reckoning this as will be we are given freedom to the non-reliance of things that are- as everlasting abilities assigned to them in their use.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adstar Posted November 1, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,399 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,307 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted November 1, 2018 17 hours ago, Betha said: I agree with you there ! the reason we are 'deemed perfect now' is solely on the grounds we are 'covered by the blood of Christ while we are 'IN' Christ and 'in the Kingdom of God's dear Son....having been 'translated into it after having been delivered from the power of darkness Col 1 v 13,14, (but not yet in the Kgd of God). Our Redemption is a Process from stage to stage AS WE grow and obey in the Grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Sadly false teaching has it that we are instantly born again into God's Kgd....NOT SO ! If we believe Jesus and trust in the Atonement from that moment on we are saved, as long as we do not fall away from believing and trusting we are covered by the Blood of Jesus Christ.. That means we are in the position of being saved.. It's not a process we go through over our life time where we slowly become better people and when we reach a certain level of goodness we reach saved status.. There is no 20% saved or 40% saved or 80% saved or 100% saved .. One is either in the position of being saved or they are not saved.. It's like being pregnant.. You cannot be half pregnant.. You're either pregnant or your not pregnant.. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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